Some lines lease the land, but none that I know of do so from Network Rail (that's not to say there aren't any, of course). In any case, the lease is unlikely to extend beyond the land and possibly structures - so not including track and signalling.
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Can National Rail take over Heritage Railways?
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61653 HTAFC
Veteran Member
AFAIK the Wensleydale Railway is leased from NR. Not sure of others though.
CockneySparrow
Member
It would more likely be a case of both NR and ATOC working with the preserved line I would have thought, ie both sharing the line with the preserved line having sole control at weekends or possibly Sunday
Suppose you could have a situation where Greater Anglia might do a deal with North Norfolk Railway and run a few weekday passenger trains past Sheringham to Holt, wouldn't have thought the government would need to be involved in such deal
GazUk
Member
Hello all
I am sure that the birmingham railway museum run the shakespeare express (ran by vintage trains ltd) twice daily on a sundays in the summer between Birmingham snow hill and stratford upon avon which is an example of a heritage railway running services on a mainline, obviously though that on a weekeday this could not happen.
But saying this does happen on a sunday, couldn't the SVR or the vintage train company run a through service from Stratford upon via Moor street and snow hill and then onto kidderminster and bridgenorth? Now that would be a little money spinner in the various holidays!
steamybrian
Established Member
Spa Valley Railway lease from Network Rail following-
At Eridge the downside island platform/buildings
between Eridge and Birchden Jn the track/land ground frame controlling the points and redundant signalling posts
Forge Farm Level Crossing Controls
PFX
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Interesting. The heritage line I work on is currently doing the opposite to the OP's original query. The local council are starting the process of vesting land from 2 local landowners to facilitate a long-planned line extension. We have been trying to come to an agreement with the landowners for 20 years to no avail and now the council has stepped in.
stanley T
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I can think of several examples:
- the most sensible of a list of reopenings would be Matlock -Buxton, given that the intervening tunnels are in good shape. Part of that is over a heritage line.
-extending Exeter - Paignton services to Kingswear.
- the most sensible of a list of reopenings would be Matlock -Buxton, given that the intervening tunnels are in good shape. Part of that is over a heritage line.
-extending Exeter - Paignton services to Kingswear.
jnjkerbin
Member
On the subject of the Spa Valley railway, there are/were recently plans to, if the Lewes - Uckfield line was re-instated, run through services from Tunbridge Wells to Brighton. Personally, I would think this is quite unlikely, what with a Sainsbury's in the way between the current main station and TWW, as well as lack of capacity at Tunbridge Wells.steamybrian:1325987 said:
'Severn Valley could rejoin National Rail' according to this week's Rail News.
Wyre Forest District Council's strategic development report refers to the redevelopment of the former British Sugar site next to the SVR at Kidderminster, and a proposed new hotel at West Midlands Safari Park, with new stations on the SVR to serve both developments. It is being suggested that the LM Birmingham - Kidderminster service could be extended to serve the proposed new stations, or that Chiltern services to Stourbridge Jct could run to Kidderminster and onto the SVR. Apparently this would be possible because the SVR/NR connection is now managed from Saltley panel.
Wyre Forest District Council's strategic development report refers to the redevelopment of the former British Sugar site next to the SVR at Kidderminster, and a proposed new hotel at West Midlands Safari Park, with new stations on the SVR to serve both developments. It is being suggested that the LM Birmingham - Kidderminster service could be extended to serve the proposed new stations, or that Chiltern services to Stourbridge Jct could run to Kidderminster and onto the SVR. Apparently this would be possible because the SVR/NR connection is now managed from Saltley panel.
gimmea50anyday
Established Member
The weardale i believe is another. Indeed, it was when I was part of the loo group back when the 141's were delivered. That was a few years ago tho, things might have changed since then.
The Nene Valley Railway runs very close to the centre of Peterborough.
I accept that it's only quite a large city, and the railway runs from, effectively, nowhere (in population terms) and that the end of the line isn't as close to the centre as Peterborough North.
But other than that...
CockneySparrow
Member
Nene Valley Railway is connected to the mainline, but not where you would think it to be though
Its actually connected by a line that veers off of the normal tourist section roughly at the half way point and comes out on the East Coast Mainline,
It could be possible to run a service from Nene Valley into Peterborough station into the disused platform 1, but the train would have to be small in length though, hence why FCC stopped using that platform
MK Tom
Established Member
Chiltern were looking at running a Bewdley-Marylebone service for a while weren't they? They ran that 168 from Bridgnorth to Marylebone a while back. I was under the impression the main problem there was the junction at Kidderminster which causes conflicts in the westbound direction due to the layout of the junction.
As for viability, the Romney, Hythe and Dymchurch sees some use by local travellers as does the GCR, which is useful to communities along the route for getting into Loughborough. This may be the reason for the cheap ticket they offer for journeys starting at Leicester North on the morning DMU service?
As for viability, the Romney, Hythe and Dymchurch sees some use by local travellers as does the GCR, which is useful to communities along the route for getting into Loughborough. This may be the reason for the cheap ticket they offer for journeys starting at Leicester North on the morning DMU service?
Tiny Tim
Member
I don't think Network Rail have compulsory purchase powers, but the government and local authorities do, and, as has already been said, can make an order on behalf of someone else. The circumstances under which CP powers may be exercised are described as 'overwhelming need'. Make what you will of that.
D365
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Would have run into a new platform in the redeveloped North station itself with the Crescent Link, but that's not happening afaik.
steamybrian
Established Member
The proposed reintroduction of a regular daily passenger service between Exeter and Okehampton will involve running over the Dartmoor Railway line from Coleford Junction.
Who will operate the service?
Who will operate the service?
Cliveblackpool
Member
An option (Not very practical for commuters) is to change trains from heritage stock onto the Barnstaple service at Yeoford.
The line is probably maintained by Network Rail, as it serves Meldon Quarry (Ballast)
Imo the best option is for FGW to run a service direct to Okehampton.
Some pictures of Meldon Quarry & Rolling stock at Meldon!
http://www.28dayslater.co.uk/forums...quarry-Okehampton-Devon-(pic-heavy!)-Jan-2011
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nferguso
Member
Some tales from Derbyshire...
Peak Rail had a close call around 1998 when Railtrack's Network Management Statement (or whatever it was called back then) proposed reopening the Matlock to Millers Dale line. This would have been a problem for Peak Rail and they were offered the Wirksworth Branch as compensation, although we did have to point-out to Railtrack that negotiations were already underway with us!
The Railtrack proposal died a death after consultants Scott Wilson published a report stating that it would be cheaper to upgrade the Hope Valley line (which is now about to take place as part of the Northern Hub scheme).
In the meantime, the terms of the agreement for the Wirksworth Branch are that if Wirksworth's quarries ever reopen (don't hold your breath), we are obliged to take any rail traffic that might result. That would be welcomed as somebody would then pay to restore the junction to the MML at Duffield!
In the meantime, don't forget that EVR services to Wirksworth connect with the EMT Nottingham - Derby - Matlock service and it is even possible to buy a through ticket to Wirksworth.
Neil Ferguson-Lee
Ecclesbourne Valley Railway
Peak Rail had a close call around 1998 when Railtrack's Network Management Statement (or whatever it was called back then) proposed reopening the Matlock to Millers Dale line. This would have been a problem for Peak Rail and they were offered the Wirksworth Branch as compensation, although we did have to point-out to Railtrack that negotiations were already underway with us!
The Railtrack proposal died a death after consultants Scott Wilson published a report stating that it would be cheaper to upgrade the Hope Valley line (which is now about to take place as part of the Northern Hub scheme).
In the meantime, the terms of the agreement for the Wirksworth Branch are that if Wirksworth's quarries ever reopen (don't hold your breath), we are obliged to take any rail traffic that might result. That would be welcomed as somebody would then pay to restore the junction to the MML at Duffield!
In the meantime, don't forget that EVR services to Wirksworth connect with the EMT Nottingham - Derby - Matlock service and it is even possible to buy a through ticket to Wirksworth.
Neil Ferguson-Lee
Ecclesbourne Valley Railway
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Swanage is an interesting one.
If the final works were done, I could see this being quite viable especially in the warmer months, and SWT wanting a piece of the pie - even if a shuttle from Wareham as per Lymington, although I'd say maybe extending to Poole or Bournemouth would be useful for the locals also - access to jobs, schools, the uni, shopping etc... and less car reliance.
If the final works were done, I could see this being quite viable especially in the warmer months, and SWT wanting a piece of the pie - even if a shuttle from Wareham as per Lymington, although I'd say maybe extending to Poole or Bournemouth would be useful for the locals also - access to jobs, schools, the uni, shopping etc... and less car reliance.
CockneySparrow
Member
Why can't they run into the disused platform 1
You'd need some very big bolt cutters to get the gate open at the mainline end.
It joins at the other end roughly where the British Sugar site was - which I believe had an extensive network of sidings on site. I would guess that the link to the ECML was for the plant and not as a link from the ECML to the Northampton Line.
CockneySparrow
Member
This makes interesting reading, apparently the line in question is the fletyon branch line, it does in fact link nene valley to the main line, however it appears its still owned by NR
http://www.nvr.org.uk/fletton-branch-railway-line
Far too many issues with 'heritage' traincrews and locos working over the main line - it's rather a different kettle of fish to the NYMR into Whitby! Finding paths to cross the ECML would be an interesting exercise too, I'm sure.
D365
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Yes, and I recall the current P1 is being levelled to allow the current P2 (future P1) to be enlarged. Would have been interesting if the link was manageable full-time.
Appreciate that it might be confidential Neil, but are you able to give us any indication of what sort of take-up youve seen for through ticketing? My understanding of heritage Railways in the South-East is that its been neligable or non existant.
WestCountry
Member
Because it's on the opposite side of the ECML to where the Fletton Branch joins on, and running every NVR service across the entirety of a 125mph mainline would be extremely inefficient
.Also, it's disused because they're building Platform 2 (new P1) over the southern end of it. That won't improve matters at all...
nferguso
Member
Paul,
Very good question. I don't have exact figures, but first of all, since opening to Duffield, approximately 30% of fares have come from there and a 'significant proportion' of those have come by rail.
When we first opened, we got a few through tickets but it declined during 2011 and early last year it was down to embarrasing levels. We then proceeded to push through a modest campaign to support through ticketing (see http://www.e-v-r.com/comebyrail/) and we also worked with EMT to make sure that ticketing staff were aware of the facility. We have also made sure that all our publicity material reminds people that through tickets are available.
The result is that we are probably getting a few hundred quid a month in the peak season that is coming from through tickets. It takes a lot of effort to raise awareness and you keep having to push and push to get the message through. If I had a pound for every time somebody told me "We didn't know you were here", I'd be retired by now!
Neil
Amy Worrall
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Could you get your service times and stations into the data National Rail Enquiries work with? I know the Ffestiniog railway have done so. That way people could search for details online, which might help
Mvann
Member
At the moment, it is owned by BRB (residuary). Should be nene valleys soon as they are buying it.
nferguso
Member
Watch this space! We are working on a few options, although getting into the online systems is most definitely the tricky bit, not least becuase as soon as you start looking at fare structures, what seems like a simple exercise quickly becomes bewildering.
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