Trivia: Stations that don't sound like they're Spelt

[LNW-GW Joint]

Yes okay, but it has been stated several times on this thread that Welsh, unlike English, is pronounced exactly as written.

I'm not so sure (after a decade of trying to learn it).
People say Betws-y-Coyd not Betws-y-Coed (Co-ed I would have expected).
Up the road from me they say Coyd-poyth for Coed Poeth.

I was told off in my class for pronouncing Abergele as Abergelly (quite subtle).
Don't forget that in a station sign the beginning of a name might mutate to something else eg Welcome to Bangor becomes Croeso i Fangor.

I once saw an ATW leaflet about engineering diversions and came across the station names: Manceinion Heol Rhydychen (Manchester Oxford Road) and Manceinion Fictoria (Victoria).

I don't know if Port Talbot is English or Welsh but it seems to come out as one word - PortAlbot (very flat A, not as in Sunbeam-Talbot).

I had a laugh with the locals in South Africa once while trying to get my head round the Zulu "Hl" (as in Hluhluwe Reserve in ZwaZulu Natal) when I realised it is pretty much the Welsh "ll".
No wonder the Ladysmith Black Mambazo felt at home in Llangollen.

My son lives in Shrewsbury - definitely Shrew...

I lived in Malvern for a spell, and started with MAlvern like most northerners.
But it's MOlvern (supposedly from the original Brythonic Moel Bryn).

 

[DarloRich]

there are people who work in my office who insist on pronouncing Harrogate as Harrow Gate.
I just ask where and when they say Harrow Gate, you know, near Leeds i say oh you mean arrogut

 

[Ivo]

Surely the old northern trick of dropping (or inserting) random "h" sounds doesn't apply to place names?!

I would probably say "Harrow", and then follow with with word "good" but with a "t" sound instead of a "d" sound. But that is because I know that the second syllable is not normally pronounced as "gate".

 

[Aictos]

Arragut.

Thought it was, thanks for the correction though

 

[Stephen55a1960]

there are people who work in my office who insist on pronouncing Harrogate as Harrow Gate.
I just ask where and when they say Harrow Gate, you know, near Leeds i say oh you mean arrogut

Harrow Gate is the posh name. Equally, there are those,who say they live in Pannarl (a suburb of Harrow Gate). Pannal is way too common!

 

[Gwenllian2001]

I'm not so sure (after a decade of trying to learn it).
People say Betws-y-Coyd not Betws-y-Coed (Co-ed I would have expected).
Up the road from me they say Coyd-poyth for Coed Poeth.

I was told off in my class for pronouncing Abergele as Abergelly (quite subtle).
Don't forget that in a station sign the beginning of a name might mutate to something else eg Welcome to Bangor becomes Croeso i Fangor.

I once saw an ATW leaflet about engineering diversions and came across the station names: Manceinion Heol Rhydychen (Manchester Oxford Road) and Manceinion Fictoria (Victoria).

I don't know if Port Talbot is English or Welsh but it seems to come out as one word - PortAlbot (very flat A, not as in Sunbeam-Talbot).
I lived in Malvern for a spell, and started with MAlvern like most northerners.
But it's MOlvern (supposedly from the original Brythonic Moel Bryn).

The 'oe' is a dipthong; pronouced as 'oy'. There's nothing subtle about Abergele, 'L' is pronounced 'L' as in English. Port Talbot is not Welsh but named after the industrialist who developed the port. The historic name of the town is Aberafan. M'o'lvern is correct, see my earlier post concerning Welsh place names in England.

 

[6Gman]

I once saw an ATW leaflet about engineering diversions and came across the station names: Manceinion Heol Rhydychen (Manchester Oxford Road) and Manceinion Fictoria (Victoria).


.

Manceinion Buddug surely!

 

[37 418]

Speaking of which, I heard someone say, recently, that Rutherglen was pronounced Ruglen? Is this correct or a windup? Any scotttish members on here know the definitive answer? Thanks.

Ruglen (stressing the Glen - nowadays it's stressed as per English/Germanic stress patterns) makes sense as it derives from Gaelic 'Ruadh Ghleann' the 'th' in the later English form is an incorrect way of rendering the 'dh/gh' sound in Gaelic. This is also true of the 'v' in Milngavie - it derives from Muileann Gaoithe (lit. 'windy mill') the 'th' in Gaoithe would originally been a 'h' or German 'ch' as in 'ich' sound

Most people pronounce names of Celtic origin wrong when it comes to stress, my personal bones of contention are Inverness and Aviemore - inverNESS and avieMORE are the CORRECT pronounciations.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

There is a thread about a landslip at Slochd that is situated in the Highlands.....how should you pronounce that name with the correct vocal intonation ?

Locals pronounce it Slocht (o as in not, ch as in loch), the CORRECT way is to pronounce the 'd' as a 'k' thus /slochk/ 'ch' as in loch NOT church. -chd in Gaelic is pronounced IPA: /xk/

Hope that helps

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

We have a very elderly resident in our village, who came from West Yorkshire, who is adamant that he comes from Bratford, despite seeing the word Bradford appearing in much of his correspondence.

 

[IanD]

We have a very elderly resident in our village, who came from West Yorkshire, who is adamant that he comes from Bratford, despite seeing the word Bradford appearing in much of his correspondence.

I too come from that esteemed city and can confirm that is is pronounced Bratfud with the alternative pronunciation of t'sh ! tole. And the stations are pronounced Fosta Square and t'Intachange (or t'Exchange by those who know better).

 

[table38]

Just on the train this evening, the guard announced Newton Feride.

 

[johnnychips]

Just on the train this evening, the guard announced Newton Feride.

Nice to see they still add the last bit!

 

[ert47]

Theres one that gets me - Chancery Lane on the Underground's Central Line.

Pronounce it with a southern "r" or say it like its spelt? (and announced on the train)

 

[dvboy]

I thought it was announced on the tube with a "long" A.

 

[Stephen55a1960]

Ruglen (stressing the Glen - nowadays it's stressed as per English/Germanic stress patterns) makes sense as it derives from Gaelic 'Ruadh Ghleann' the 'th' in the later English form is an incorrect way of rendering the 'dh/gh' sound in Gaelic. This is also true of the 'v' in Milngavie - it derives from Muileann Gaoithe (lit. 'windy mill') the 'th' in Gaoithe would originally been a 'h' or German 'ch' as in 'ich' sound

Most people pronounce names of Celtic origin wrong when it comes to stress, my personal bones of contention are Inverness and Aviemore - inverNESS and avieMORE are the CORRECT pronounciations.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Locals pronounce it Slocht (o as in not, ch as in loch), the CORRECT way is to pronounce the 'd' as a 'k' thus /slochk/ 'ch' as in loch NOT church. -chd in Gaelic is pronounced IPA: /xk/

Hope that helps

Thanks for that explanation. It does help.

 

[Stewart]

there are people who work in my office who insist on pronouncing Harrogate as Harrow Gate.
I just ask where and when they say Harrow Gate, you know, near Leeds i say oh you mean arrogut

Both are correct. It's just different accents. I'd probably say something in between.

However Bath is correct, yet Baaaaaaaaaath is incorrect. There is only one "a", as in cap, tan bat, tap, and so many other words.

 

[Ivo]

I know there's little if any point in my saying this, but the more "correct" way to say certain words, as epitomised in the South-East, with an "a" in the middle is to say such words with a lengthened "a" sound, producing an "aaaaa"/"arrrr". Bath is such a word. The same is true of the city. Anyone whose accent is reminiscent of the Queen's English, or otherwise the "standard" accent of Received Pronunciation (as used by the BBC among others), will say "bath" in this style - the city included. And no, I'm not from a posh background. I lived on a council estate from 11 to 20. (I am admittedly "posh" its standards though )

Irrespective though, I can tolerate the short "a". What I can't tolerate are people saying "Baff"!

By using the word "correct" in this manner I have opened myself up to infinite criticism :roll:

 

[ert47]

I thought it was announced on the tube with a "long" A.

Nope, its pronounced "Chan-sery Lane" on the train. I pronounce it "Charn-sery Lane"

 

[PR1Berske]

This thread is superb :thumbup:

 

[fairysdad]

I know there's little if any point in my saying this, but the more "correct" way to say certain words, as epitomised in the South-East, with an "a" in the middle is to say such words with a lengthened "a" sound, producing an "aaaaa"/"arrrr". Bath is such a word. The same is true of the city. Anyone whose accent is reminiscent of the Queen's English, or otherwise the "standard" accent of Received Pronunciation (as used by the BBC among others), will say "bath" in this style - the city included. And no, I'm not from a posh background. I lived on a council estate from 11 to 20. (I am admittedly "posh" its standards though )

Irrespective though, I can tolerate the short "a". What I can't tolerate are people saying "Baff"!

By using the word "correct" in this manner I have opened myself up to infinite criticism :roll:

Surely the correct way to say any place name is the way that it is pronounced locally? Having said that, I've no idea how residents of Bath pronounce its name...

I always think the same should be said with countries' names... take Germany for instance - given that they call it Deutschland, surely everybody else should as well. Anyway, that has taken this somewhat off-topic

Carry on.

 

[dvboy]

Whether you use the long or short A to pronounce things like "Bath" is more to do with accent than how things should be pronounced properly. Neither is more correct than the other. Back to the Chancery Lane issue and if the tube announcer is pronouncing it with a short A then that's solely because of her accent, she is not pronouncing it incorrectly.

Nine years ago I did work experience as a journalist on a radio station in the south and was told I should pronounce things with a long A, and I told the news editor I would never do such a thing. I don't have a particularly strong accent, especially not when speaking formally, but it's quite clear that I'm from somewhere in the vague Midlands area.

I suppose certain voices are chosen for announcements in certain areas for example the automated announcements on FTPE are done by a woman with a Northern accent (I can't remember which). I always think the female automated announcer at Birmingham New Street sounds a bit odd because it is a quite strong RP accent, but wouldn't think twice if I heard it at a London terminal station.

Most manual announcements are more likely to be done by locals. There's one at BHM that is quite obviously local and a more recent female addition to the voices in which I think I detect an Asian twang. I have today heard a long A in "Lancaster" at Wolverhampton, I don't think that particular one is originally from the area.

The point is none of these are right or wrong.

 

[Ivo]

Surely the correct way to say any place name is the way that it is pronounced locally?

Does this mean London should be pronounced as either (a) Lon-don (with the "o" as in "rot") or (b) Landan? I think not

Having said that, I've no idea how residents of Bath pronounce its name...

It should be the way you pronounce "Spa", but it isn't They say it the way you would say "cat".

 

[Francis]

Many years ago I remember being invited into the cab of a DMU between Bridlington and Hull. The driver asked me - how do you think we pronounce that village over there - Aike, it was on my map. I suggested it looked like the word "ache" as in hurt. "Eee noh," he said, "we say: Yak. Yak-ovver-Arram", Arram being the neighbouring larger village.

English pronunciation is not phonetic, so you can never be sure you have it right. Take Doveridge between Uttoxeter and Burton. Is it Dove-ridge, Dover-idge, Dovveridge? I don't know. Ironically, Welsh names are phonetic, and if you know the rules you will get it right. So an English speaker who knows the rules of Welsh pronunciation may get the Welsh name correct, but the English version wrong.

For example, Presteigne in Powys, on the old branch from Leominster. Is it Presteen or Presteyne? I'm not sure. But in Welsh it is Llanandras which is quite straightforward.

 

[Scotty]

Surely the correct way to say any place name is the way that it is pronounced locally? Having said that, I've no idea how residents of Bath pronounce its name...

I always think the same should be said with countries' names... take Germany for instance - given that they call it Deutschland, surely everybody else should as well. Anyway, that has taken this somewhat off-topic

Carry on.

What about football teams? It's interesting what us English call the team who are due to play Chelsea in the Champions League Final.

We call them Bayern Munich, which cross references German and English. Surely we should call them Bavaria Munich, or Bayern Munchen - and not a mixture of the two!

 

[northernrailer]

I have looked at the first 5 pages only, so i apologise if these have been already mentioned.

Teignmouth - pronounced as Tin muth
Wymondham - pronounced as Wym dam
Llanelli - pronounced as Clan ethley
Ruswarp - pronunced as Rus ap
Keighley - pronounced at Keith ley
Meols - pronounced as Mells

these are the only ones i can think of.

 

[Ivo]

Llanelli - pronounced as Clan ethley

Maybe it's time to drop the Welsh stations. Apart from the occasional local dialect and/or slang, they are always pronounced as one would expect (assuming the stations have Welsh names anyway).

I wouldn't agree that it is "Clan" anyway. It's closer to "Thlan".

 

[dvboy]

I thougth Wymondham was pronounced Wind-ham, not Wim-dam - the latter is harder to pronounce correctly.

 

[Stephen55a1960]

I thougth Wymondham was pronounced Wind-ham, not Wim-dam - the latter is harder to pronounce correctly.

I have it on good authority (someone who works there) - pronounced Wind-ham.

 

[johnnychips]

As I found out today on the EVR, Idridgehay is EYE-dridgehay.

 

[37 418]

Maybe it's time to drop the Welsh stations. Apart from the occasional local dialect and/or slang, they are always pronounced as one would expect (assuming the stations have Welsh names anyway).

I wouldn't agree that it is "Clan" anyway. It's closer to "Thlan".

I would agree with that.