York to Hull routeing

[YorkC]

Just wondering if anyone knew of a reasonably priced ticket that allowed travel on anything in addition to the direct train (once every two hours), either via Doncaster or Leeds. There's not via Doncaster and any permitted routed tickets but the latter is quite a bit more expensive. York to Cottingham used to be valid via Doncaster but no longer is.

The really frustrating thing about this one is that there is no single ticket that permits travel via Leeds, when this seems an eminently sensible route (albeit with a double back through Garforth) and for quite large chunks of the day is the journey that would get you from York to Hull fastest.

Would be very grateful for any help on this, via PM if necessary!

 

[brompton rail]

York -Hull is hourly during the week. The Any Permitted ticket (priced by VTEC/LNER) is valid via DONCASTER and GOOLE. As a York to DONCASTER ticket is valid for travel via Leeds and Wakefield you could get to Leeds on it, but still require a new ticket Leeds to Selby!

Incidentally there is really no time advantage in going via Doncaster as ECML services from the north don’t connect well with most services to Hull.

 

[YorkC]

York -Hull is hourly during the week. The Any Permitted ticket (priced by VTEC/LNER) is valid via DONCASTER and GOOLE. As a York to DONCASTER ticket is valid for travel via Leeds and Wakefield you could get to Leeds on it, but still require a new ticket Leeds to Selby!

Incidentally there is really no time advantage in going via Doncaster as ECML services from the north don’t connect well with most services to Hull.

Ah okay, thanks for this. I only made the journey for the first time this weekend. Even so, it seems a bit of a ridiculous situation that the fastest route for quite big chunks of the weekend has no available ticket!

 

[mikeg]

Via leeds is a historically valid route according to the original routeing guide. However at some point ATOC have seen fit to remove it. This was done unlawfully as in an foi request daft said they couldn't find when it ceased to be a permitted route. Given they are required to be consulted this is pretty poor. I've been fighting this battle for a while as it makes travel between thirsk and hull particularly time consuming.
However to give you an indication of what I'm up against tpe for example ignored my question and sent me an email about service patterns and that they would pass it on to their train planning department. Whether this was incompetence or dodging the question I'm not sure$

 

[yorkie]

The really frustrating thing about this one is that there is no single ticket that permits travel via Leeds, when this seems an eminently sensible route (albeit with a double back through Garforth)

I agree with mikeg; it was historically valid via Leeds. Perhaps @Max can comment on the history?

If it was valid via Leeds Group then any double-back is irrelevant; all stations between LDS and MIK are members of Leeds Group.

 

[mikeg]

The issue appears to have been fixed for stations using York as a routeing point in the pdf version of the routeing guide according to the routeing guide updates page yet strangely the journey planners are not implementing it yet. Also this creates the odd situation where tickets from Northallerton are still not valid to Hull via Leeds.

 

[YorkC]

LNER will give me itineraries via Leeds for an any permitted routed ticket but not for a not via Doncaster one...

 

[Paul Kelly]

LNER will give me itineraries via Leeds for an any permitted routed ticket but not for a not via Doncaster one...

That will be down to Easement 700479:

Customers travelling from Hull to York in possession of tickets routed "not via Doncaster" may not travel via Leeds. This easement applies in both directions

 

[brompton rail]

That will be down to Easement 700479:

Isn’t the York to Hull ticket via Doncaster (priced by LNER) the Any Permitted, and the Northern priced ticket the Not Via Doncaster ticket?

York to Doncaster is permitted via Leeds and therefore it follows York to Hull via Doncaster is permitted via Leeds. However it doesn’t follow from that, that York to Hull via Leeds and TPE (Selby) is permitted.

 

[IanXC]

York to Doncaster is permitted via Leeds and therefore it follows York to Hull via Doncaster is permitted via Leeds.

I'm far from convinced it does follow!

Perhaps someone has been reading this thread...

Review of York to East Yorkshire routeing points. To add where possible additional permitted routes or mapped shortest journeys

Goole (GOO) and York (YRK) - added sequence 'HO+YM'
This journey now has mapped routes via Gilberdyke.

Hull (HUL) and York (YRK) - added sequence 'NP'
This journey now has mapped routes via Leeds.

National Routeing Guide update thread.