Would you consider Plusbus tickets and multi operator tickets a step toward integration?

[175mph]

I know that for a very good reason we always complain about the public transport in the UK being fragmented, but would you consider Plusbus tickets where you take a rail journey, then once at your destination, you can use the local buses with the exact same ticket or if you don't use the trains but use the buses around a city, a multi operator ticket to be an example of integration instead of fragmentation?

I know it might seem obvious, the answer to my question, but when I noticed something advertised in Hull city a smart card I think is called Hull Card which you costs almost £15 a week, but can be used on both Stagecoach and East Yorkshire buses operating within Hull and a couple of it's surrounding areas such as Hessle and Cottingham, I thought asking this question would spark up a nice debate here.

 

[smsm1]

Yes it's an integration. Other examples are All York tickets, and the One Ticket in the Lothians. Anglia Plus rangers have a similar integration with some bus operations.

Plusbus is starting to roll out to smart cards in some areas, including Scotrail, and c2c: http://www.plusbus.info/news. I'm looking forward to seeing this roll out further including for example being able to buy using the Greater Anglia app, place the ticket on my smart card via the phone's NFC, and get on a bus with the rail ticket. That will be the future. Buses which have the newer ticket machines also have a barcode reader (First use them for validating printed return tickets, mobile, etc), so the physical tech is there for supporting mobile plus bus tickets.

 

[175mph]

Yes it's an integration. Other examples are All York tickets, and the One Ticket in the Lothians. Anglia Plus rangers have a similar integration with some bus operations.

Plusbus is starting to roll out to smart cards in some areas, including Scotrail, and c2c: http://www.plusbus.info/news. I'm looking forward to seeing this roll out further including for example being able to buy using the Greater Anglia app, place the ticket on my smart card via the phone's NFC, and get on a bus with the rail ticket. That will be the future. Buses which have the newer ticket machines also have a barcode reader (First use them for validating printed return tickets, mobile, etc), so the physical tech is there for supporting mobile plus bus tickets.

Our local operator Hornsbys uses the same Ticketer ticket machines as First do, along with the contactless card payments and barcode scanning.

 

[smsm1]

It's annoying when I find a bus company that has the new Ticketer ticket machines which support contactless payments, and they haven't got the contactless payment setup yet.

 

[Megafuss]

In some ways, yea. But If Plusbus change the rule to allow rail tickets between two station inside the same Plusbus area to be included in the scheme then you could have a proper integrated scheme within cities

 

[smsm1]

I suspect you'd need 2 prices for that to happen, one with a rail ticket, and another without. The plus bus tickets are usually cheaper than the operator own tickets, so the operators wouldn't allow it due to the loss of revenue.

 

[edwin_m]

It's a step towards integration but not a very big one. For example:

• You can't buy one on the bus, even for a short distance train journey. This makes it unusable if you need a bus at the start of your journey, unless you've managed to obtain your ticket by other means.
• I don't think they work with print at home or mobile tickets, two of the other means of getting a ticket without going to the station.
• The coverage, rules and prices vary widely, as they are a series of local agreements rather than a unified national product.
• The exact limits of the area aren't always very clear.
• At least one ticket website (the one we have to use for work) doesn't offer them.

 

[route101]

Ive only used them in Edinburgh , never really had a problem . Cheaper than getting an all day . I dont think many people use them.

 

[radamfi]

Participation in the scheme is entirely at the whim of the local operator(s). For example, Ensign is unashamedly anti-rail, so there is no Plusbus in Grays.

Also, the price is sometimes expensive compared to a single journey. Not everyone needs a day ticket when connecting with the train. However, the £2 offer in June and July is probably cheaper than most single fares where the offer is available.

 

[radamfi]

DB's City-Ticket is free on journeys over 100 km and is automatically included in the fare. Where not free, you have the choice of a single or day ticket (bearing in mind "single" in Germany allows interchange).

 

[krus_aragon]

DB's City-Ticket is free on journeys over 100 km and is automatically included in the fare. Where not free, you have the choice of a single or day ticket (bearing in mind "single" in Germany allows interchange).

I read that, almost to the end, thinking you were talking about Dublin Bus...

 

[Hophead]

In some ways, yea. But If Plusbus change the rule to allow rail tickets between two station inside the same Plusbus area to be included in the scheme then you could have a proper integrated scheme within cities

The Brighton & Hove PlusBus explicitly permits this (you have to scroll to the bottom of the page to find out, though).

Multi-modal travel ticket:
Are you making a local train journey (betwen two stations within the Brighton & Hove area)? Then you can buy (with your train ticket) a Brighton PlusBus ticket for use on all the buses around Brighton & Hove area.

I have found that, when checking online, the rules for other areas are, shall we say, not strictly enforced.

 

[paul1609]

The Brighton & Hove PlusBus explicitly permits this (you have to scroll to the bottom of the page to find out, though).



I have found that, when checking online, the rules for other areas are, shall we say, not strictly enforced.

The Brighton PlusBus is basically a renamed Brighton Railbus ticket. It was first issued in 1996 and was the daddy of plus bus.

 

[Citistar]

Participation in the scheme is entirely at the whim of the local operator(s). For example, Ensign is unashamedly anti-rail, so there is no Plusbus in Grays.

Participation also relies on the local TOC having any interest in getting bus companies involved. *cough*GWR*cough*.

 

[Welshman]

I used a Bradford Stations PlusBus along with two advance singles - Chester to Bradford and Return - to try out the new Chester-Leeds service last Tuesday. The two rail tickets were £6.60p each plus £2 PlusBus [ all with Senior Card], making a total of £15.20p.

I was amazed on checking the PlusBus website to find the PlusBus included the whole West Yorkshire area, not just the environs of Bradford, which seemed too good to be true, so I went expecting an argument with bus drivers, especially as my tickets were printed by a gateline assistant as the machine had broken down, and were in paper form. It would an interesting experience to see what happened when I produced the flimsy paper ticket on various buses.

First Yorkshire drivers accepted it without question, even though their machines could not read the code on the PlusBus ticket, and one Tiger driver remarked that it was good value. The only challenge came from a TLC driver, who scrutinised the ticket carefully and then reluctantly allowed me on board with a face which gave the impression he'd have to make-up my fare personally out of his own pocket!

So-to cut a long story short - yes, it was exceptional value, and I'll think twice about driving the M56, M60 and M62 in future.

 

[smsm1]

I think it depends on which PlusBus area it is. I've come across a few where the place I want to go is a stop or two outside the area. With more bus operators supporting card payments it is getting easier to pay on buses without having the right change of an unknown amount, as fare info is so hard to get sometimes.

 

[Megafuss]

Participation also relies on the local TOC having any interest in getting bus companies involved. *cough*GWR*cough*.

It's a good point. One TOC I know of will not allow bus operators to put timetables or an info posters inside the station, but they have those god awful "Onward Connection" posters which look like they've just been auto generated. Meetings with local operators are just a box ticking excercise to them

 

[northken]

Participation also relies on the local TOC having any interest in getting bus companies involved. *cough*GWR*cough*.

That's surprising to me because they seem really good in Bristol (admittedly, maybe it's just because it's a First stranglehold). The Freedom Pass here is actually an intermodal ticket. Ok, virtually no one knows about it and you have to teach staff what it is, but it exists. They're even advertising it now.

 

[PeterC]

There are 2 issues with multi-operator tickets:
1. Not all operators in the area may accept them
2. Operators may also sell operator specific tickets.

Both are confusing for users. I have seen arguements on buses where a passenger has seen the poster about tickets being valid on any service and doesn't realise that he had actually been sold a single operator return ticket on the outbound service.

 

[Mitch in Notts]

Train conductor was unable to sell me a Sheffield Plus Bus (£4.00 then) on train. Single bus tickets to the hospital were only £1.50 so the conductor saved me money(paid £3 instead of £4) by being unable to sell me the ticket I asked for!