Worst towns in Britain?

[MCR247]

Andover Derby Spalding Minehead

Derby isn't that bad!

 

[londonmidland]

Although I don't live in London people say that Brixton, Hackney and Walthamstow are the worst, is this true?

 

[4SRKT]

OK. So we've settled on population as our criterion. We've agreed that population statistics calculated by using local authority area is not ideal. So surely we must first need to define city area to then ascertain the most ideal population statistics? How do you do this? This would also give us a figure for area too, which is a bit of a bonus. Hinterland would be another good indicator. Population of hinterland though. As you have pointed out, some rural towns may include a vast area of wilderness. On the other foot, some towns may share hinterlands with others.
When defining your boundary, I think the smallest possible units you could use would be parish boundaries, to enable easy access to population statistics, but I may be wrong about this.

I guess the best way to do it would be a lower level of postcode division than the post town. In the case of Newcastle this would mean you could exclude NE18, NE19 and NE20 (Stamfordham, Rochester, Ponteland) as these are clearly outside the built up area. Also NE16 (Whickham) and NE17 (Chopwell) which are south of the river: unless there was a good reason for including these that is. NE15 is mostly in the built up area, but NE15 sector 0 (Heddon on the Wall) would probably be considered to be outside it, so that sector would be left out. A complete list of all postcode sectors making up a town or city, rather than districts or the full post town, would give a pretty accurate population as urban postcode sectors are rarely larger than a square mile or two, so the exclusions would be quite precise.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Although I don't live in London people say that Brixton, Hackney and Walthamstow are the worst, is this true?

I wouldn't say any part of London except around Kensington and Primrose Hill were 100% nice, but around the East End, and in the central South East are particularly bad, the worst are probably:
Brixton
Barking
Hackney
Camden
Nunhead
Deptford

Parts of Acton, Battersea, Hendon, West Ham, etc are bad too.

 

[Mojo]

The City of London is pretty grotty, too many monstrous brutalist estates like Barbican and Mansell Street.

 

[londonmidland]

I wouldn't say any part of London except around Kensington and Primrose Hill were 100% nice, but around the East End, and in the central South East are particularly bad, the worst are probably:
Brixton
Barking
Hackney
Camden
Nunhead
Deptford

Parts of Acton, Battersea, Hendon, West Ham, etc are bad too.

I agree with you on Barking and West Ham, you see some ugly council estates and flats, you can see it from the C2C line. Also in the days St Pancras used to be a s***h***, drunks and druggies around the station! It's all changed now

 

[37372]

Hmm, I'd say (in no particular order)
Wolverhampton
Barking
Rotherham
Leicester
Skegness
Maryport

 

[Mojo]

I wouldn't say any part of London except around Kensington and Primrose Hill were 100% nice, but around the East End, and in the central South East are particularly bad, the worst are probably:

The problem with London is that areas can change so fast from nice to grot it's hard to decide if an area is nice or not. Get off the DLR at Poplar station and on one side of the water is Canada Square, the Marriott and others, the other side is a grotty block of flats.

Camden

The majority of Camden is very nice; it has half of Fitzrovia, plus Bloomsbury, Hampstead, most of Primrose Hill, Chalk Farm, parts of Regents Park (although facilities are provided by the CEPC), and so on. The former local authority estates around Euston and Mornington Crescent and Silverdale are very well to to areas now. Certainly wouldn't say Camden isn't a nice area!

 

[londonmidland]

Hmm, I'd say (in no particular order)
Wolverhampton
Barking
Rotherham
Leicester
Skegness
Maryport

What's wrong with Leicester?!

 

[4SRKT]

Uh-oh!

Fight! Fight! Fight!

 

[37372]

What's wrong with Leicester?!

Whats right with it?

 

[londonmidland]

Whats right with it?

C'mon, Leicester ain't bad, you don't get no rough people there now do you? And the City Centre- Town is quite good. We've got Highcross, John Lewis, Leicester Market and more great things. What do you don't like about Leicester?

 

[Spaceflower]

I guess the best way to do it would be a lower level of postcode division than the post town. In the case of Newcastle this would mean you could exclude NE18, NE19 and NE20 (Stamfordham, Rochester, Ponteland) as these are clearly outside the built up area. Also NE16 (Whickham) and NE17 (Chopwell) which are south of the river: unless there was a good reason for including these that is. NE15 is mostly in the built up area, but NE15 sector 0 (Heddon on the Wall) would probably be considered to be outside it, so that sector would be left out. A complete list of all postcode sectors making up a town or city, rather than districts or the full post town, would give a pretty accurate population as urban postcode sectors are rarely larger than a square mile or two, so the exclusions would be quite precise.

Why exclude areas outside the main urban area? Geographical features and planning restrictions prevent uncontrolled urban sprawl, but, they shouldn't be discounted surely?
Take Durham for example. Many of its estates are seperated from the main urban centre due to very tight planning restrictions, but are still part of Durham City are they not?
Also, why are you obsessed with postcodes? Do you work for Royal Mail?

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Skegness I will give you, I was there twice in one day in summer, my God was it horrid. Full of chavs too, especially from Boston, was quite unpleasently suprised

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Epsom is rapidly degenerating into a clone of Croydon and hopefully one day we will have enough cash to be able to move out of Epsom...

 

[W-on-Sea]

Swansea
Dundee
Great Yarmouth
Dagenham (seriously worse than Barking, though that is bad enough)
Gravesend
Leven (and adjacent towns Methil and Buckhaven)
Woolwich
Jaywick (aka "West Clacton".)
St Helens

The two worst new towns I know are
Basildon (especially the Pitsea/Vange end; oh and especially the Laindon end too; and
especially the bit inbetween too)
Stevenage
(although Craigavon in Northern Ireland - which is already falling into ruin aged 40 or so - is in a different league of awfulness entirely)

 

[Ivo]

Basildon (especially the Pitsea/Vange end; oh and especially the Laindon end too; and especially the bit inbetween too)

So, uh... Which is worst to you then? For me, it would be the area around Laindon Shopping Centre, and that the area immediately south of Pitsea Broadway is the best (which given the location of Pitsea Broadway does say a lot...!).

And I agree on Jaywick. Vile dump

 

[W-on-Sea]

I don't know, Ivo, they're all really bad, and the prolonged and uninterrupted decline over the last 20-30 years (at least) really noticeable. (I know the Pitsea and Barstable end a lot better than I do the Laindon end, or indeed Vange, so perhaps can't really say)

I guess when you say "the area immediately south of Pitsea Broadway" you aren't referring to either the Tescos, or the collection of drive-thru fast food places next to the A13! I suppose the bit uphill on Pitsea Mount is not so bad, but it is still strictly relative.

Waltham Cross is really disappointing for somewhere with a bit of history. Or even for somewhere without.
Ongar is a nasty little place too.


(I disagree with you about Brentwood though. Part of it is a bit brash culturally for sure, but there are some attractive buildings, especially around the cathedral and school, and some lovely forests very close by)

 

[MCR247]

Skegness I will give you, I was there twice in one day in summer, my God was it horrid. Full of chavs too, especially from Boston, was quite unpleasently suprised

The people of Nottingham have got to on holiday somewhere

 

[Ivo]

The people of Nottingham have got to on holiday somewhere

Yes indeed. It's called Grimsby

 

[Spaceflower]

 

[142094]

Either way, I'm sure you can agree that Sunderland is hardly a small County Durham town. Yes probably less important than Teesside and Tyneside, but that's about it.

No-one who ever calls himself a Geordie would admit to that. That is why I still say it is a small town in Durham.

4SRKT certainly does know his postcodes, wish I knew mine as well as he does.

 

[4SRKT]

.

4SRKT certainly does know his postcodes, wish I knew mine as well as he does.

It goes with the territory in the parcel industry!

 

[scotsman]

Leven (and adjacent towns Methil and Buckhaven)

Well said!

 

[4SRKT]

Why exclude areas outside the main urban area? Geographical features and planning restrictions prevent uncontrolled urban sprawl, but, they shouldn't be discounted surely?
Take Durham for example. Many of its estates are seperated from the main urban centre due to very tight planning restrictions, but are still part of Durham City are they not?
Also, why are you obsessed with postcodes? Do you work for Royal Mail?

You would choose what you wanted to leave in or exclude based on a knowledge of the local green belt and zoning etc (which I don't have), and each city would be a case of looking at the sector map and deciding the closest correspondence to the built up area. The point is the postcode sector is the best building block because in urban and semi-urban areas it is pretty small. In the case you give of DH1 you'd probably leave most of it in, but NE19 is post town Newcastle upon Tyne, but that would definitely need to be excluded as most of it is closer to Jedburgh than central Newcastle. In short there is very little logic to how Royal Mail post towns are named, but the sector sub-division provides a useful urban building block.

I don't work for Royal Mail, but am the network designer for a nationwide parcel company.

 

[Sun Chariot]

I second W-on-Sea's suggestion of Woolwich. Not even a Rileys's pool club stops it from being an utter hole.

And I'll throw (up) in Castleton, near Rochdale. It really has nowt.

 

[142094]

It goes with the territory in the parcel industry!

I'd be quite worried with my orders if you didn't. Imagine if you had to know zip codes as well (other than 90210)

 

[GNERman]

Sunderland, Doncaster - Neither are that bad, not scary at midnight anyway...

Suggestions:

Keighley
Bradford
anywhere in Lancashire...

 

[4SRKT]

I'd be quite worried with my orders if you didn't. Imagine if you had to know zip codes as well (other than 90210)

This is the beauty of the UK postcode system, in that it has some reference to the town containing the main sort centre in it. Other postcodes are numeric only (except Canada) and it's both harder to associate the code with a place or region, and much less flexible because a 5 digit number has far fewer combinations than an up to 7 character alpha-numeric string. For once in the modern world Britain does something hugely better than anyone else

Still, when I worked for TNT Express Worldwide in the 1990s I did manage to work out which parts of Germany the initial digit of Deutsche Post's codes referred to....

 

[smudge.efc]

Just thought I'd throw Stockton-on-Tees into the mix. Had the misfortune of spending the last 3 years there. It's the most soul destroying place I've seen. It just seemed to have no hope, desire or motivation to better itself.