Worst (current) train interior

[gimmea50anyday]

The 185s are just like the 350s but with louder diesel engines. Can't see anyone really wanting to do Man Airport to Edinburgh or Liverpool to Newcastle on one!

I don't have a choice!!!!!

Still the engines sound superb at full throttle screaming out of Darlington or thru standedge tunnel!

 

[sprinterguy]

I agree, the XC MK3s are absolutely superb. They're a pleasure to travel in and as close to a brand new train as you're going to get with 1970s slam door stock.

I'm sure they do get very full, but that's not really a fault with the train, and a 7 coach XC HST has to be a better bet than a 4 or 5 car Voyager??!

I entirely agree. I am surprised to see criticism levelled at the Crosscountry HSTs for exactly the reasons that you have set out, as a 7 carriage HST formation offers considerably more seating than a 4 or 5 carriage Voyager! I have never come across a Crosscountry HST overcrowded, and I have travelled on peak time workings out of Birmingham on multiple occasions.

 

[northwichcat]

I don't have a choice!!!!!

Newcastle-Sheffield-Liverpool is a permitted route, so you can do it using a Voyager and a 158 instead of 185s. Until the Newcastle-Liverpool express starts going via Sheffield is only 10-20 minutes slower.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

Newcastle-Sheffield-Liverpool is a permitted route, so you can do it using a Voyager and a 158 instead of 185s. Until the Newcastle-Liverpool express starts going via Sheffield is only 10-20 minutes slower.

Err, nope, I REALLY don't have any choice, otherwise TPE will be cancelling trains!!!

 

[northwichcat]

Err, nope, I REALLY don't have any choice, otherwise TPE will be cancelling trains!!!

So your a crew member then.

There's only currently one direct Liverpool-Newcastle train a day and I would have thought it would have a crew change somewhere en route.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

No there isn't. Newcastle staff work I all the way through to Liverpool and back as far as Manchester. I'm on it today and will be again tomorrow

It will be changing soon. Liverpool Newcastle trains but via Manchester Victoria and chat moss, missing out Piccadilly and warrington apparently in addition to the existing Newcastle airport trains

 

[EM2]

The 185s are just like the 350s but with louder diesel engines. Can't see anyone really wanting to do Man Airport to Edinburgh or Liverpool to Newcastle on one!

I've done Edinburgh to Preston on a 185 with no bother at all. Decent seat, reasonable size table, pretty quiet, good lighting, and a 350 from Euston to Crewe was just the same.

Clapham Junction to Abergavenny on an Alphaline 158 was challenging, but acceptable.

 

[Wolfie]

Anything with Longitudinal seating only, so at the moment that's only the 378's (excluding all LU stock). As somebody who likes to look out of a train window and watched the details of the world go by, not being able to do so infuriates me!

I would beg to differ. The 378s were designed for a purpose and do that very, very well.

They are a million percent better than the clapped out 313s which preceeded them.
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Class 350s and 450s, the seating is too firm, the seat backs are bolt upright, the airline style seating bits are too cramped, the seats are not wide enough to accommodate a person properly, this is coming from someone who is very long and skinny. The interiors are too garishly bright, and the automatic announcements never shut up.

I would moan about the 378s but someone has done that for me.

While I agree your general comments about the Siemens EMUs I find them bearable in 2+2 but awful in 2+3! The interiors of the diesel variant (185) are more or less identical.....
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The original interiors is basic but functional, the bus bench interiors offer more legroom than the Merseytravel seated examples as well as a marvellously unobstructed view on the scenic routes that they operate over.

Merseytravel 142s certainly get my vote for worst train interior, followed by 319s in second place.

I don't have much experience of Pacers, thnak the Lord, but have found them all dire when I have encountered them Awful seats which feel only loosely fixed to the train body, no leg room, noisy as hell - frankly I have seen better hen-coops!

I remember the 319s being introduced. The big problem with their interior is that FCC has done absolutely no maintenance/refurbishment. There is little wrong with the basic design (except the awful 3+2 sections) which isn't much different to that in 317s and 321s.

 

[MattRobinson]

I think the car seat 142s are worse than the Mersey Rail 142s, personally.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2

 

[northwichcat]

I've done Edinburgh to Preston on a 185 with no bother at all. Decent seat, reasonable size table, pretty quiet, good lighting, and a 350 from Euston to Crewe was just the same.

You must have picked one of the quietest services. I've seen Scottish TPE services leaving Preston with around 20 standing north of Preston and at crush point south of Bolton.
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It will be changing soon. Liverpool Newcastle trains but via Manchester Victoria and chat moss, missing out Piccadilly and warrington apparently in addition to the existing Newcastle airport trains

The timetable TPE submitted to the ORR for 2014 shows the Newcastle service replaced by two hourly services:
* Newcastle to Liverpool via Manchester Victoria
* York to Manchester Airport.

So Newcastle won't the Airport service as well, although I understand that long term (post electrification) Newcastle to Liverpool is set to be half-hourly.

 

[atomicdanny]

Personally I would say either the Class 376s while they are probably designed for their purpose as metro trains, they are horrible with mostly plastic seating with very little of any sort of seat covering. To add to this i would also say the Class 375/9s which aren't as bad but still horrible to sit on, especially if they are doing the longer routes (e.g. London Victoria - Ramsgate / Dover or Charing Cross to Margate / Sandwich!)

 

[EM2]

You must have picked one of the quietest services. I've seen Scottish TPE services leaving Preston with around 20 standing north of Preston and at crush point south of Bolton.

I meant quiet in the sense of engine noise, harshness etc., but as you mention it, it wasn't a particularly busy service leaving Edinburgh Waverley at 18:11.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

The timetable TPE submitted to the ORR for 2014 shows the Newcastle service replaced by two hourly services:
* Newcastle to Liverpool via Manchester Victoria
* York to Manchester Airport.

So Newcastle won't the Airport service as well, although I understand that long term (post electrification) Newcastle to Liverpool is set to be half-hourly.

That's more than what I have been told!!!! Whilst we understand there is more work coming tpe's way, no one has told me what is actually happening. The only thing I am hearing is rumours and heresay. The magical 5th path was allegedly going to be the ncl-LIV to run in addition to the man air stuff and the existing sca, hul and MBR patterns, but then other stories state the Scarborough will be joined onto the Blackpool stuff via hebden bridge, and that the Liverpool train would run to Newcastle instead. Some of the stories depend on the ordsall curve tho so any truth in the rumours will not be revealed for some years yet!

 

[elarchibaldo]

I have to say that the "original" Northern 150's are terrible, with next to no legroom. Also, the 156 Northern refresh units, as they feel like there is hardly any cussion. The ATW 153 is uncomfortable too.

 

[387star]

southerns 377s have nasty cheap third world high density astro turf ugly seats in the 3+2 configuration

 

[Manchester77]

southerns 377s have nasty cheap third world high density astro turf ugly seats in the 3+2 configuration

Third world countries would probably be elated to get 377s to go to work on!!

Anyway 377s are nice. They're a god train which have been built to meet the needs for commuters and longer distance travellers.

 

[Jack1989]

FGW class 158's.

 

[starrymarkb]

IIRC the SA Electrostars have 376 seating...

Mind you so did one of FGWs HST coaches for a while (as part of the Seat Back TV trials in 2005ish)

 

[D365]

Third world countries would probably be elated to get 377s to go to work on!!

Gautrain?

 

[Crossover]

I've only ever seen an internal door open on a Voyager when the button has been pressed.

The double leaf doors are fine, the single heavy doors. Bit of cant on the track where the cant speed is higher than what the train is actually doing, grind slam CLICK! Grind slam CLICK! Every 3-4 seconds! As the train attempts to close the door but the door fights back. And if the drive belt is slipping its even worse! If all of the doors were of the double leaf type the problem would be eliminated.

To be honest it doesn't need even that. I've had the odd one (for an hour at a time :cry where even on flat track, it will be opening a bit, motor kicks in, BANG....repeat ad-infinitum!

The 185s are just like the 350s but with louder diesel engines. Can't see anyone really wanting to do Man Airport to Edinburgh or Liverpool to Newcastle on one!

I don't have a choice!!!!!

Still the engines sound superb at full throttle screaming out of Darlington or thru standedge tunnel!

The engines are awesome! I have to say I don't usually notice them that much, but I was on 185148 through Morley Tunnel a couple of days ago, and the driver gave it full throttle as we entered

I'm doing a couple of the Edinburgh diversion services in April, which will be 185 to Man Picc, 185 to Edinburgh via Cumbernauld, and 185 from Edinburgh via Newcastle back to Yorkshire. Is it wrong that I'm looking forward to it? :P

To be honest you can't get much worse than the original bus type interiors of the 142's there isn't anything to complain about in the interior because there's hardly anything there..

I don't find them too bad - that said, it is probably because I have had a few ex FGW ones up in the North, and they have been relatively well maintained - though I can imagine at full load, they can be a bit cramped. Still comfier than the ex Merseytravel things though!

Every time I go on such Northern examples (still with FGW moquette seats), they do seem to be getting grubbier and grubbier....thanks Northern!

 

[TEW]

Mind you so did one of FGWs HST coaches for a while (as part of the Seat Back TV trials in 2005ish)

Now that was a really inappropriate choice of seat. Had that horrible garish lime green interior as well. The coach stuck around for a while even after the TV screens were removed as well so all the pain of those seats but without the benefit of the TVs.

 

[Bevan Price]

1. Class 390. Claustrophobic, poor layout of seats relative to windows, seats a bit too narrow.

2. Class 142, especially Merseyrail units.

3. Class 153 - not enough legroom.

4. Class 378 - dislike longitudinal layout on these. That layout is just about OK for short journeys on London Underground, but less than ideal for anything longer, and makes it difficult to see where you are when there are lots of standing passengers.

 

[Manchester77]

1. Class 390. Claustrophobic, poor layout of seats relative to windows, seats a bit too narrow.

2. Class 142, especially Merseyrail units.

1) :roll::roll:

2) Merseytravel

 

[43021HST]

Am I on my own, in thinking that the voyagers aren't as bad as some people make out to travel in, sure there's not enough, leg room or luggage space but, generally I think the ergonomics are quite nice, far better than a claustrophobic pendo anyway.

 

[Qwerty133]

Am I on my own, in thinking that the voyagers aren't as bad as some people make out to travel in, sure there's not enough, leg room or luggage space but, generally I think the ergonomics are quite nice, far better than a claustrophobic pendo anyway.

As I've never been on a claustrophobic pendo (but I have been on a not claustrophobic VT one)I am unable to compare but voyagers are nice units inside and out they may not be long enough but other than that i have found them perfectly acceptable infact nicer than HSTs on all my journeys on them (and before anyone says anything this includes both XC and VT)

 

[BestWestern]

...I am unable to compare but voyagers are nice units inside and out they may not be long enough but other than that i have found them perfectly acceptable infact nicer than HSTs on all my journeys on them (and before anyone says anything this includes both XC and VT)

I really have no idea how on earth anybody could sensibly reach that conclusion.... But, each to their own!

 

[Manchester77]

As I've never been on a claustrophobic pendo (but I have been on a not claustrophobic VT one)I am unable to compare but voyagers are nice units inside and out they may not be long enough but other than that i have found them perfectly acceptable infact nicer than HSTs on all my journeys on them (and before anyone says anything this includes both XC and VT)

I'm catchin' ya' drift

390s,220/221s do have flaws. But they are quality trains which have been built for a modern market. But being a regular MAN-EUS commuter the 390s aren't that bad. Firstly the modern day commuter doesn't have nothing to do. Most people have iPads, laptops, net-books and if its not them it's a kindle or an e-reader or even an actual book! And on top of that most people have a smart phone and/or an ipod/personal stereo. There are other things to occupy them besides the blurred view from the window as the train rushes past at 100+mph. On 390s the toilet smell is a flaw but it isn't so noticeable unless you sit right at the end of each coach with the vestibule doorway open.
The voyagers (220s and 221s not 222s) are a brilliant train. They're a modern DEMU caipable of high speeds. Their biggest issue is that they're a few carriages short! This opinion is shared with a fair few and it is that I the voyagers were 8 even 6 coaches long, then they would be a pretty darn good HST replacement on XC. But they're not because they're shorter and following the XC upgrade more people started using them.
And XC HSTs and HSTs in general. I'm not about to say that they're bad trains but I do feel that they're over rated. I was on one a few days ago and sure it was nice not having to stand but they're awfully noisy and rattley. I felt like I'd been well shaken after my jaunt...
I don't mean to cause offence but I do feel that once a few people start to say that pendolinios and voyagers are horrible cramped etc then a lot of people jump onto that band wagon...

 

[Muzer]

To be honest it doesn't need even that. I've had the odd one (for an hour at a time :cry where even on flat track, it will be opening a bit, motor kicks in, BANG....repeat ad-infinitum!

The 158s used to have this issue a lot with their pneumatic (?) internal doors, but I haven't had it recently. I don't know what the actual problem was, it seemed like they weren't quite building up enough pressure to close the door, and assumed there must be an obstacle in the way so reopened the door before trying again a few seconds later.

I still remember the "hissssssssssss...hiss! hissssssssssss...hiss!" etc

If I was sat near one, I would usually hide from the sensor, then when it started trying to close, help it along a bit by pulling on it. Sometimes I had to do this whenever anyone walked through; sometimes it seemed to be enough to fix it for the rest of the journey. I've also seen a guard neatly slot a blank ticket into the space around the sensor (a perfect fit!) to keep them open.

 

[Blindtraveler]

@Crossover, Edinburgh 185 diversions? What are these avoiding, there certainly news to me!
Whats route?

 

[gimmea50anyday]

@Crossover, Edinburgh 185 diversions? What are these avoiding, there certainly news to me!
Whats route?

West coast weekend closures between Carlisle and Edinburgh, so Newcastle TPE services are being extended to Edinburgh via the ECML