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Worried about fare evasion charge

cycolasme

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Afternoon all,

I am really concerned about a fare evasion that I was given after using my sister's Oyster card for some time. I'm currently a pharmacy student, and the card was taken today by inspectors. I am really concerned about what might happen and how it will affect my criminal record. If anyone has any knowledge then please let me know

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They mentioned that I would receive a letter in about 10 days on the next course of action, and I plan to take a plea. I was thoughtless in using it and thought I could save money, but instead it may jeopardise my future career
 
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Haywain

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So, were you stopped by TfL inspectors? And was your sister's Oyster card actually one that provides free or heavily discounted travel?
 

cycolasme

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So, were you stopped by TfL inspectors? And was your sister's Oyster card actually one that provides free or heavily discounted travel
So, were you stopped by TfL inspectors? And was your sister's Oyster card actually one that provides free or heavily discounted travel?
It was the 11-15 one for free travel

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I don't have the finances to
afford a solicitor, and I'm worried it may affect my record. I have no criminal record currently and I'm worried that this might lead to a criminal conviction.
 

John R

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Assuming it was a card offering free or discounted travel, you need to be aware that TfL treats this type of fare evasion very seriously, and its standard practice is to proceed to prosecution. We do see cases where the intervention of a solicitor specialising in such cases results in a final warning being given, but there is no guarantee that prosecution can be avoided, and for either outcome the legal fees, typically several hundred pounds, will need to be paid. If you are prosecuted, then given that presumably TfL has all the evidence it needs to secure a conviction, you will have a criminal record.

I'm guessing that for a career in pharmacy, evidence of high integrity is a given, so you need to think carefully about your attitude to law breaking and generally "doing the right thing", and whether it needs to change, should you continue to pursue your chosen career.
 

SECR 65

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Forum members can provide the details of solictitor firms which people have used in the past. It's best to use someone who specialises in or has experience in fare evasion, ideally with TFL. Unfortunately, a solicitor is the only realistic chance you have of not being prosecuted.
 

cycolasme

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Assuming it was a card offering free or discounted travel, you need to be aware that TfL treats this type of fare evasion very seriously, and its standard practice is to proceed to prosecution. We do see cases where the intervention of a solicitor specialising in such cases results in a final warning being given, but there is no guarantee that prosecution can be avoided, and for either outcome the legal fees, typically several hundred pounds, will need to be paid. If you are prosecuted, then given that presumably TfL has all the evidence it needs to secure a conviction, you will have a criminal record.

I'm guessing that for a career in pharmacy, evidence of high integrity is a given, so you need to think carefully about your attitude to law breaking and generally "doing the right thing", and whether it needs to change, should you continue to pursue your chosen career.
if a prosecution is expected, what
Assuming it was a card offering free or discounted travel, you need to be aware that TfL treats this type of fare evasion very seriously, and its standard practice is to proceed to prosecution. We do see cases where the intervention of a solicitor specialising in such cases results in a final warning being given, but there is no guarantee that prosecution can be avoided, and for either outcome the legal fees, typically several hundred pounds, will need to be paid. If you are prosecuted, then given that presumably TfL has all the evidence it needs to secure a conviction, you will have a criminal record.

I'm guessing that for a career in pharmacy, evidence of high integrity is a given, so you need to think carefully about your attitude to law breaking and generally "doing the right thing", and whether it needs to change, should you continue to pursue your chosen career.
is there anything else that i can do
 

cycolasme

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Is there anything that I can do in the mean time. Or should i just sit out and wait for the letter to come and the eventual prosecution
 

AlterEgo

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Is there anything that I can do in the mean time. Or should i just sit out and wait for the letter to come and the eventual prosecution
You should instruct a solicitor when the verification letter comes. Bear in mind solicitors can't invent mitigation for you, they can only write on your behalf, and TfL are pretty strict about what sort of mitigation they will consider. See Section 8 of their prosecution policy: https://content.tfl.gov.uk/revenue-enforcement-and-prosecutions-policy.pdf

The most likely outcome from this, if you are an adult, is a conviction in the magistrates' court for a criminal offence under the TfL Bylaws. The result will be:

- A fine based on your income (the sentence for the offence and discounted by a third if you plead guilty at the first opportunity)
- A surcharge of 40% of the value of the fine
- A contribution towards TfL's costs
- Compensation for the fare avoided

You should get in touch with your student union and your course leader about any impact on your fitness to practice.
 

cycolasme

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I've spoken to my course leader, and I have a meeting on Friday about it, and I've emailed the student union. I honestly wasn't aware that the fare evasion was this big of a criminal offence (genuinely), and I thought I would get a slap on the wrist 100 pound fine. But I am really worried about this issue, and the fact that I may be removed from my course because of it.

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I honestly don't think I can sleep tonight after this
 

Titfield

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Try not to worry but there is nothing you can do as regards TfL until the letter arrives. Did your course leader say what action if any the university may take? You need to speak with the student union asap and preferably before the meeting with the course leader.
 

Haywain

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I've spoken to my course leader, and I have a meeting on Friday about it, and I've emailed the student union.
In this respect, you are doing the right thing. You need to be aware of how a conviction might affect you, and it's best to know this before you engage a solicitor. You also need to be aware that a solicitor will cost you something in the range of £750 to £1200 and that will be additional to the fine and costs if you are convicted. Whether TfL will consider a warning may depend, partially at least, on how many times you have used your sister's Oyster card.
 

cycolasme

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I've emailed the student union about it, but they haven't responded yet. My course leader did respond and told me that informing her was the right thing to do. I have used it frequently so I am worried about it since it was my main mode of transportation for university. I can't seem to be able to eat or sleep properly, and I'm extremely worried as I can't afford a solicitor. I was told by relatives that all I would get is a fine since it's my first offence, but everyone here states otherwise and that I've risked my career.

What else can I do? Honestly, I have an internship coming up soon, and I'm concerned about how I'm going to juggle that, work and this. I truly regret ever using my sister's oyster to try to reduce costs (as I was paying for university)
 

AlterEgo

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There really is very little else you can do at this point. Wait for the letter, and if you cannot afford a solicitor, we can help you write a response. But be under no illusions, without a solicitor a covncition is almost certain. With a solicitor you may have a small chance.

TfL prosecute between 10,000 and 20,000 cases a year of this sort. About 60 people every working day.
 

WesternLancer

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I was told by relatives that all I would get is a fine since it's my first offence, but everyone here states otherwise and that I've risked my career.
Yes. You would get a fine, from a court. That’s the punishment and there is a record of that punishment. Known as a Criminal record. You would not go to
Prison.

But that’s not the same as the £100 penalty fares you see on posters at stations. They are not fines, though your relative might think they are. Perhaps that is the cause of confusion about this.
 

cycolasme

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Should I just give up on pharmacy, considering that I'm most likely gonna get a damning conviction which will ward off any future job opportunities
 

blimmo

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Should I just give up on pharmacy, considering that I'm most likely gonna get a damning conviction which will ward off any future job opportunities
It may not affect your future job opportunities much if at all... or it might. This is what you need to ask the student union/course leader etc. about.
 

WesternLancer

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Should I just give up on pharmacy, considering that I'm most likely gonna get a damning conviction which will ward off any future job opportunities
Definitely don’t do this. It’s a minor conviction in the great scheme of things.
 

cycolasme

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Definitely don’t do this. It’s a minor conviction in the great scheme of things.
The GPhC states that dishonesty (due to a fraud charge) could be a potential reason for getting struck off the registry

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There also some cases where a pharmacist who didn't disclose her three train fare evasions was struck off

I genuinely feel hopeless about this. I don't have a lot of money, and I barely have a wage and I don't know how I'm going to resolve this issue
 

furlong

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If you are otherwise doing OK on your course while it may be uncomfortable and awkward for a while, it need not be fatal for your career: What we saw happen once before I think was someone in a similar situation having to write an essay to explain how they understand that what they did was wrong in the context of their anticipated career, how they'd learned from the experience etc.

In situations like this TfL does not normally prosecute for fraud. Rather they normally prosecute for a single instance of evading just the one fare at the time when you were caught - but they do ask the court to require you to pay back all the other fares you avoided. This would mean it gets recorded as a single minor criminal conviction and as long as you don't attempt to hide it regulators won't necessarily consider it to be a serious problem. (You may need to use some of the content of the essay to provide appropriate context for them when declaring it.)
 
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cycolasme

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If you are otherwise doing OK on your course while it may be uncomfortable and awkward for a while, it need not be fatal for your career: What we saw happen once before I think was someone in a similar situation having to write an essay to explain how they understand that what they did was wrong in the context of their anticipated career, how they'd learned from the experience etc.

In situations like this TfL does not normally prosecute for fraud. Rather they normally prosecute for a single instance of evading just the one fare at the time when you were caught - but they do ask the court to require you to pay back all the other fares you avoided. This would mean it gets recorded as a single minor criminal conviction and as long as you don't attempt to hide it regulators won't necessarily consider it to be a serious problem. (You may need to use some of the content of the essay to provide appropriate context for them when declaring it.)
I really hope so, I understand how bad this will look on my record once I graduate, but if its better than being kicked out, I'll take it. My only worry is paying of the fine, since it is a hefty amount
 

ikcdab

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What you will get here is really good advice on how do deal with the letter when it arrives. The impact on your career is between you and your university and only they can help you with that.
 

SECR 65

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I've emailed the student union about it, but they haven't responded yet. My course leader did respond and told me that informing her was the right thing to do.
Generally in matters like these, honesty is the most important thing. It's very good that you've taken proactive steps to talk to people about what's going on.
I have used it frequently so I am worried about it since it was my main mode of transportation for university. I can't seem to be able to eat or sleep properly, and I'm extremely worried as I can't afford a solicitor.
As hard as it may be, at this stage there isn't much you can do. You'll just have to wait for TFL to get in contact.
I was told by relatives that all I would get is a fine since it's my first offence, but everyone here states otherwise and that I've risked my career.
Unfortunately from your perspective, TFL almost always prosecute. Other train operating companies usually settle outside of court but this isn't something TFL do. So your relatives aren't entirely wrong, this sadly just does not apply to TFL.

Seeing as money is tight you might want to start thinking about how you could pay any fine imposed by the court. I don't know if it would be possible to borrow from a relative or anything but that isn't really my or anyone on here's business.

Understandably this seems now like a massive disaster, and yes, you may be likely to be prosecuted in court, but it isn't the end of the world in the grand scheme of things. Hopefully other forum members can confirm or elaborate on this, but I think being prosecuted for fare evasion doesn't show on your records forever, and the conviction expires after a certain number of years? Need someone to confirm that though.

Whatever happens you will find a way out of this situation and everything will be ok in the end.
 

Haywain

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The GPhC states that dishonesty (due to a fraud charge) could be a potential reason for getting struck off the registry
You will be prosecuted for a byelaw offence, not for fraud. It will not necessarily be seen as dishonesty.
 

duffield

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...
There also some cases where a pharmacist who didn't disclose her three train fare evasions was struck off
...
Non disclosure of offences when you are explicitly required to do so is typically viewed as being much worse than the actual offence itself (for this sort of offence), so assuming you disclose as required (if convicted), the case you quote has no real relevance one way or another to your situation.
 

Fawkes Cat

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Non disclosure of offences when you are explicitly required to do so is typically viewed as being much worse than the actual offence itself (for this sort of offence), so assuming you disclose as required (if convicted), the case you quote has no real relevance one way or another to your situation.
To amplify this, it might be worth having a read of https://www.chemistanddruggist.co.u...rmacist-struck-off-over-unpaid-train-tickets/, which I think is the case that the OP had spotted and mentioned in post #19. Unfortunately the underlying case report doesn't seem to be available any more, but it's worth noting that

- in the reported case, there were three convictions: so far the OP hasn't been convicted of anything but what we usually see with TfL is conviction for one instance, with other occurrences taken into consideration. To my mind, these may level out at the same sort of seriousness
- another difference (unhelpful to our OP) is that in the reported case the convictions were historic rather than current
- in the reported case, the FtP committee noted that the unpaid train ticket convictions were “relatively minor on the spectrum of criminal offending”.
- in the reported case, what aggravated the matter was that 'that the convictions “must be considered in the round with [her] subsequent sustained and systematic dishonesty in her dealings with her employer and her regulator”' and that the pharmacist hadn't engaged with the hearing: 'It added that her punishment may have been less severe “if the registrant had participated in these proceedings”.'

What this says to me is that all is not lost for the OP. This probably won't be easy to deal with, but talking to their institution (their course leader in the first place) is the right thing to do. They will be in a better position than we are to know exactly what view the regulator will take of this.
 

jumble

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The GPhC states that dishonesty (due to a fraud charge) could be a potential reason for getting struck off the registry

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

There also some cases where a pharmacist who didn't disclose her three train fare evasions was struck off

To amplify this, it might be worth having a read of https://www.chemistanddruggist.co.u...rmacist-struck-off-over-unpaid-train-tickets/, which I think is the case that the OP had spotted and mentioned in post #19. Unfortunately the underlying case report doesn't seem to be available any more, but it's worth noting that

- in the reported case, there were three convictions: so far the OP hasn't been convicted of anything but what we usually see with TfL is conviction for one instance, with other occurrences taken into consideration. To my mind, these may level out at the same sort of seriousness
- another difference (unhelpful to our OP) is that in the reported case the convictions were historic rather than current
- in the reported case, the FtP committee noted that the unpaid train ticket convictions were “relatively minor on the spectrum of criminal offending”.
- in the reported case, what aggravated the matter was that 'that the convictions “must be considered in the round with [her] subsequent sustained and systematic dishonesty in her dealings with her employer and her regulator”' and that the pharmacist hadn't engaged with the hearing: 'It added that her punishment may have been less severe “if the registrant had participated in these proceedings”.'

What this says to me is that all is not lost for the OP. This probably won't be easy to deal with, but talking to their institution (their course leader in the first place) is the right thing to do. They will be in a better position than we are to know exactly what view the regulator will take of this.
I really hope so, I understand how bad this will look on my record once I graduate, but if its better than being kicked out, I'll take it. My only worry is paying of the fine, since it is a hefty amount
The GPhC states that dishonesty (due to a fraud charge) could be a potential reason for getting struck off the registry

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

There also some cases where a pharmacist who didn't disclose her three train fare evasions was struck off

I genuinely feel hopeless about this. I don't have a lot of money, and I barely have a wage and I don't know how I'm going to resolve this issue
Please try and be positive It seems that at the moment you think you are the only person who might have to report having a single bylaw conviction to the regulator. I am confident is saying you would not be the first and would not be the last. No sensible person wants to ruin someone else's life because they have made a stupid mistake as a young student which is why TFL go for a single charge
( as an aside I suspect there is no one here advising you including me who has not done really stupid things when younger)


 

furlong

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I really hope so, I understand how bad this will look on my record once I graduate, but if its better than being kicked out, I'll take it. My only worry is paying of the fine, since it is a hefty amount
While the essay seemed like a punishment, it could also be seen as that institution's way of teaching them what they would need to know so they would be properly prepared and know how best to explain it when asked about it by future employers or regulators.
 

whirlybird

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To amplify this, it might be worth having a read of https://www.chemistanddruggist.co.u...rmacist-struck-off-over-unpaid-train-tickets/, which I think is the case that the OP had spotted and mentioned in post #19. Unfortunately the underlying case report doesn't seem to be available any more,

The case report can be found at https://files.pharmacyregulation.org/determinations/D023541/D023541.pdf

What I found interesting was this part of the evidence from the pharmacist's line manager, who had interviewed her:

[The line manager] was “100% confident” he had asked the Registrant about her DBS check because at around that time he had interviewed another pharmacist who had declared an issue with their DBS at interview and, as a result, [the pharmacy chain] had looked into it and, having done so, subsequently made an offer of employment.

The report doesn't mention what the "issue" was for the other pharmacist, but this does at least indicate that having an "issue" show up on a DBS check (providing it is declared at the appropriate time) isn't an automatic bar from employment.
 

WesternLancer

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The GPhC states that dishonesty (due to a fraud charge) could be a potential reason for getting struck off the registry

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

There also some cases where a pharmacist who didn't disclose her three train fare evasions was struck off

I genuinely feel hopeless about this. I don't have a lot of money, and I barely have a wage and I don't know how I'm going to resolve this issue
I’m pretty sure You won’t be facing a fraud charge. Even if they send out letters that mention fraud.

Court fines can be paid in instalments. Pretty much the only good thing about them I suspect.
 

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