Will I get fined ?

[Islineclear3_1]

But only the OP can tell us, did the staff member use his (or her) mobile phone to take his photo?

And obviously, the OP wouldn't know but if the answer to the above is "yes", would the photo have been taken on a personal mobile phone or company issued one?

 

[Fluffyducky95]

But only the OP can tell us, did the staff member use his (or her) mobile phone to take his photo?

And obviously, the OP wouldn't know but if the answer to the above is "yes", would the photo have been taken on a personal mobile phone or company issued one?

It was on a phone. I don’t know if it was company or personal. But I am guessing company.

 

[WesternLancer]

It was on a phone. I don’t know if it was company or personal. But I am guessing company.

I think ref the photo issue you may be best waiting for a suitable period to see if you hear from Govia at all ref the incident. If after a period you do not, I think you should write to them (customer services I guess) and say on x date I was photographed by a member of your staff when I was seeking to make an excess fare payment. I would like to know
a) why I was photographed
b) where this photograph is stored
and
c) that this photograph is destroyed and no copies retained and I would like your written conformation that this has happened.

Given that you have clarified it was not part of a body-worn CCTV filming but an active photo of your identity this is of note as I do not recall other instances of this being reported on the forum so it may be a new thing that staff are doing when they question people about ticketing matters.

 

[Fluffyducky95]

I think ref the photo issue you may be best waiting for a suitable period to see if you hear from Govia at all ref the incident. If after a period you do not, I think you should write to them (customer services I guess) and say on x date I was photographed by a member of your staff when I was seeking to make an excess fare payment. I would like to know
a) why I was photographed
b) where this photograph is stored
and
c) that this photograph is destroyed and no copies retained and I would like your written conformation that this has happened.

Given that you have clarified it was not part of a body-worn CCTV filming but an active photo of your identity this is of note as I do not recall other instances of this being reported on the forum so it may be a new thing that staff are doing when they question people about ticketing matters.

Okay thank you, I will. How long does it usually take for them to send a letter?

 

[Islineclear3_1]

Okay thank you, I will. How long does it usually take for them to send a letter?

I think it's anywhere up to 6 months

 

[najaB]

I think it's anywhere up to 6 months

Just to expand on this, they have up to six months to lay charges before the court (if that's what they want to do), but typically it will be three to four weeks.

 

[Haywain]

I think ref the photo issue you may be best waiting for a suitable period to see if you hear from Govia at all ref the incident.

As there does not appear to be any reason for a prosecution to take place or any real prospect of one succeeding, I'm not sure why this action could not be taken immediately.

 

[nanstallon]

It is unfair to keep somebody worrying for months, especially when the case against him is thin or non-existent. He made a mistake when in a hurry, so did the machine and the staff who let him through. He paid the difference - as prescribed in the rule book, and that surely is the end of it. Taking his photo and name and address was just intimidation, and again I ask whether any other industry treats its customers in such a hostile way?

Criticising the ticket machine for issuing an off-peak ticket when it was still peak hours, could rebound. Many people find it convenient to buy an off peak ticket in peak hours - e.g. I want to travel on the 09.31 train, and off peak fares apply after 09.30. Obvviously, I don't want to have to wait till 09.30 before I can use the machine; there may not be a manned ticket office or there may be a queue there.

 

[rbannocks]

If I were you I would submit a Subject Access Request under the GDPR regulations and see what information they hold on you. In addition I would ask for a copy of their at data retention policy. I would also ask them if any documents have been redacted and for what reasons. That should give you some insight.

Template letters can be found on the ICO site

How to make a subject access request

ico.org.uk

 

[WesternLancer]

As there does not appear to be any reason for a prosecution to take place or any real prospect of one succeeding, I'm not sure why this action could not be taken immediately.

I'm sure it could of course. I would personally just leave things quiet for a bit to see what happens - but if the OP is concerned about his image being stored then they should consider taking the action suggested more promptly.

 

[Fluffyducky95]

Hi guys
So, I received a letter from the train company today with the letter explaining they intend to prosecute. They have given me the ability to write down my side of the story.
If you have any advice, it would be much appreciated.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Hi guys
So, I received a letter from the train company today with the letter explaining they intend to prosecute. They have given me the ability to write down my side of the story.
If you have any advice, it would be much appreciated.

@Fluffyducky95 . Can you upload a copy of the letter received, with your personal details (name and address etc.) suitably obscured?

 

[Darandio]

Hi guys
So, I received a letter from the train company today with the letter explaining they intend to prosecute. They have given me the ability to write down my side of the story.
If you have any advice, it would be much appreciated.

Crikey, your mail delivery person is dedicated!

It would probably be a good idea to attach a copy of this letter to the thread so people can see exactly what it says and advise accordingly. Obscure all personal details.

 

[najaB]

So, I received a letter from the train company today with the letter explaining they intend to prosecute. They have given me the ability to write down my side of the story.

Just to clarify: you have already paid the difference in fare and they still intend to prosecute?

 

[Fluffyducky95]

The letter

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 21 Nov 2021 ==

Just to clarify: you have already paid the difference in fare and they still intend to prosecute?

Hi
Yes I paid the difference in fare

 

[najaB]

Yes I paid the difference in fare

This is wrong.

By analogy: if you paid £10 for an item in a shop, got to the door and they said "Oh, that item is actually £15" and you paid the other £5 then they couldn't claim you were shoplifting/stealing.

Can show that you paid the additional amount requested?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Do you have evidence of the excess paid?

This seems very much like a "one arm doesn't know what the other one is doing" scenario.

 

[Fluffyducky95]

Do you have evidence of the excess paid?

This seems very much like a "one arm doesn't know what the other one is doing" scenario.

Hi,
Yes, it’s on my online bank statement. Should I attach it to this letter or should I just write my account?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Hi,
Yes, it’s on my online bank statement. Should I attach it to this letter or should I just write my account?

Shame you don't have the actual excess ticket, as that would be conclusive. But it can do no harm to attach any evidence you have in your favour with the letter, and any evidence of having paid the excess is certainly evidence in your favour.

 

[Fluffyducky95]

The top transaction is the accidental off peak ticket I brought. The second is the price difference

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 21 Nov 2021 ==

Shame you don't have the actual excess ticket, as that would be conclusive. But it can do no harm to attach any evidence you have in your favour with the letter, and any evidence of having paid the excess is certainly evidence in your favour.

Yes it is unfortunate. I should of been more clever about this.

 

[Hadders]

Ideally it would be best if you had the actual excess ticket you were issued.

I would write to them and politely point out that you were travelling on the train with an off peak ticket and, in accordance with condition 9.5 of the National Rail Conditions of Carriage you were sold an excess fare to convert this ticket to an Anytime ticket. Consequently the correct fare has been paid for the journey and no offence has been committed.

For information an Off Peak Day Return from Coulsdon South to Reigate is £5.10
The Anytime Day Return costs £9.10

This is consistent with the figures on the OP's bank statement.

 

[Fluffyducky95]

Ideally it would be best if you had the actual excess ticket you were issued.

I would write to them and politely point out that you were travelling on the train with an off peak ticket and, in accordance with condition 9.5 of the National Rail Conditions of Carriage you were sold an excess fare to convert this ticket to an Anytime ticket. Consequently the correct fare has been paid for the journey and no offence has been committed.

For information an Off Peak Day Return from Coulsdon South to Reigate is £5.10
The Anytime Day Return costs £9.10

This is consistent with the figures on the OP's bank statement.

Thank you for your advice.
I have prepared the letter and will send it tomorrow.
I am super worried this will backfire and they will find a way to take me to small court.

 

[robbeech]

Just to clarify: you have already paid the difference in fare and they still intend to prosecute?

You sound surprised, yet it’s not your first day here.

Do you have evidence of the excess paid?

This seems very much like a "one arm doesn't know what the other one is doing" scenario.

Or maybe it does. Send 100 of these out and a percentage will pay.

Can you just clarify (apologies if you did and I missed it first time around) that you did actually receive a printed excess in the first place for this additional fee. It wouldn’t be the first time someone hasn’t and then has had further issues.

 

[MotCO]

Can I also clarify that you approached the ticket inspector when you realised that you had erroneously bought an off-peak ticket to correct the position, rather than the ticket inspector 'caught' you either as a one-off inspection or as a ticket gate blockade. (i.e. you did not act to rectify the position only because you realised that you would be caught out by the presence of an inspector.)

If the former, that would also stand you in good stead and you may wish to mention this in your reply.

 

[Fluffyducky95]

You sound surprised, yet it’s not your first day here.

Or maybe it does. Send 100 of these out and a percentage will pay.

Can you just clarify (apologies if you did and I missed it first time around) that you did actually receive a printed excess in the first place for this additional fee. It wouldn’t be the first time someone hasn’t and then has had further issues.

Hi,
Yes I did recieve the printed excess

You sound surprised, yet it’s not your first day here.

Or maybe it does. Send 100 of these out and a percentage will pay.

Can you just clarify (apologies if you did and I missed it first time around) that you did actually receive a printed excess in the first place for this additional fee. It wouldn’t be the first time someone hasn’t and then has had further issues.

Hi
Yes I got a printed excess ticket when I paid the difference between the two ticket types. Unfortunately I have misplaced them and I have no idea where to find them.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 21 Nov 2021 ==

Can I also clarify that you approached the ticket inspector when you realised that you had erroneously bought an off-peak ticket to correct the position, rather than the ticket inspector 'caught' you either as a one-off inspection or as a ticket gate blockade. (i.e. you did not act to rectify the position only because you realised that you would be caught out by the presence of an inspector.)

If the former, that would also stand you in good stead and you may wish to mention this in your reply.

Hi
Yes I approached the ticket inspector at the station to ask to pay the difference because I accidentally brought an off peak ticket instead of the anytime ticket. I was let through by the ticket guard at Coulsdon South so I believed there was not anything wrong with my ticket beforehand.

 

[John Palmer]

I am surprised that GTR's letter as seen here contains no information whatsoever about the nature of the offence alleged, but I note from the image that it appears to bear additional text and the constituent companies' logos on the reverse. Does the reverse carry additional information about the allegations GTR intend to make? In the absence of such information the OP should be extremely cautious about making any admissions or assertions in a letter to GTR, for the company's determination to prosecute may have nothing to do with any excess fare having been due.

If the reverse of the letter the OP has uploaded does contain further details of GTR's allegations then it would be helpful for the OP to post an image of it, appropriately redacted as before, such redaction obscuring any draft response the OP may have already prepared.

 

[AlterEgo]

I would reply in a letter - not on the form - saying.

"Thank you for your recent letter, which I attach.

On the date I travelled, I was travelling with an Off Peak ticket (give full details of the journey) and your representative at Redhill noticed this was not valid at the time I was travelling. They then charged me the excess fare to correct the difference, the transaction for which I attach to this letter.

I trust that having paid the correct fare this closes the matter to everyone's satisfaction.

Yours faithfully"

 

[dastocks]

Last time I tried to purchase an off-peak ticket (for later travel) from a Southern TVM during the peak I was forced to enter the date and time of travel in order to get the off-peak fare. The process was so painful that it's hard to believe anyone could be unaware of what they were doing. However, this would have been at least two years ago and the TVM programming for the journey in question may be different.

 

[Hadders]

Last time I tried to purchase an off-peak ticket (for later travel) from a Southern TVM during the peak I was forced to enter the date and time of travel in order to get the off-peak fare. The process was so painful that it's hard to believe anyone could be unaware of what they were doing. However, this would have been at least two years ago and the TVM programming for the journey in question may be different.

That is not my experience with the ticket machines generally in use across the south east of England. In fact, quite the opposite which reminds me that I need to start a new thread sometime about my observations about the ticket machines at my local station as I believe there is overcharging going on at weekends due to the layout of the screens.

 

[najaB]

You sound surprised, yet it’s not your first day here.

Not surprised. Disappointed.