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Will 225s replace Voyagers?

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59CosG95

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Corby/Oakham is included under Manton.

I too don't think 225s are the answer for MML, but god no, please, no Pendolinos. Horrible stuff.

Maybe the 'baby Pendo' could be an overhaul e.g. A Class 802, with a revised layout similar to MkIVs, and bigger, taller windows (my big Pendo gripe). Or just get a tilting Traxx loco or similar from Alstom or Siemens, and gear the MkIVs for tilt as they were originally designed.
 
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tbtc

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I'll never understand why people seem to think that Traxx could haul trains any distance other than 'the last mile' and certainly not at any useful speed...

It's either "run it with Traxx" or "run it with a version of a 444" with enthusiasts! :lol:

(also never understood why a bi-mode Traxx is The Best Thing Since Sliced Bread" when the same people complain about "wasteful" IEP carting round the weight of two fuel types - but that's another story)
 

NotATrainspott

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Maybe the 'baby Pendo' could be an overhaul e.g. A Class 802, with a revised layout similar to MkIVs, and bigger, taller windows (my big Pendo gripe). Or just get a tilting Traxx loco or similar from Alstom or Siemens, and gear the MkIVs for tilt as they were originally designed.

Non-tilting Baby Pendolinos wouldn't be able to use the EPS125 paths on the Southern WCML and thus would be pretty useless. Although there's lots of talk about them being used for Manchester/Birmingham - Scotland they still need to be able to do runs like Holyhead (attached to a new-build loco) to Euston.

The fact that the Mk4s were designed with a tilt-compatible bodyshell doesn't necessarily make them worth converting once they're 30 years old. They have worked very hard in their time and have repaid their building costs already, so unless the work would allow them to do enough work to earn back the cost of the tilt retrofit it simply isn't worth it. IIRC Mk4s are wired just as normal LHCS rather than being like HST trailers so if all else fails they don't absolutely need to be used on a mainline at 125mph.

When the French converted a TGV to a tilt prototype they didn't bother with the powercar, so I don't think tilting locomotives are necessary (apart from the driver's seat).
 

Eagle

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(also never understood why a bi-mode Traxx is The Best Thing Since Sliced Bread" when the same people complain about "wasteful" IEP carting round the weight of two fuel types - but that's another story)

Because locomotives are beyond criticism purely by virtue of being locomotives, and the more loco-hauled services there are in the UK the better for reasons that don't need to be spoken because they are obvious. Therefore we need a nice big order of passenger locos (and Bombardier Traxx is the only one we've heard of).

Oh wait, that should have gone in the railway myths thread.
 

Peter Mugridge

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When the French converted a TGV to a tilt prototype they didn't bother with the powercar, so I don't think tilting locomotives are necessary (apart from the driver's seat).

Does tilt actually reduce forces on the rail or does it merely get rid of the sideways feeling on high speed curves?

TGVs between Paris Montparnasse and Bordeaux run at up to 135mph on conventional lines below Tours, some bits of which have very noticable reverse curves ( similar to the Trent Valley and weedon sectors of the WCML in the 1980s ) without problems - and it's also very much more enjoyable than the constant up and down feeling on the 390s...
 

HSTEd

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Does tilt actually reduce forces on the rail or does it merely get rid of the sideways feeling on high speed curves?

TGVs between Paris Montparnasse and Bordeaux run at up to 135mph on conventional lines below Tours, some bits of which have very noticable reverse curves ( similar to the Trent Valley and weedon sectors of the WCML in the 1980s ) without problems - and it's also very much more enjoyable than the constant up and down feeling on the 390s...

Its just to reduce the effects on the passengers, it can't beat the laws of physics and reduce the forces on the railhead.
 
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