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Why you can't trust local papers

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Samtron2000

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Don't trust the MEN full stop. The quality of reporting is terrible. Even simple stories seem to have factual errors. The bus in this article was a connect 88. The report states it runs between Wilmslow and Knutsford. It actually goes between Wilmslow and altrincham via Knutsford c The buses are even branded with the route.
 

northwichcat

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Don't trust the MEN full stop. The quality of reporting is terrible. Even simple stories seem to have factual errors. The bus in this article was a connect 88. The report states it runs between Wilmslow and Knutsford. It actually goes between Wilmslow and altrincham via Knutsford c The buses are even branded with the route.

It's Knutsford-Wilmslow-Altrincham not Wilmslow-Knutsford-Altrincham but the bus still wouldn't have originated at Wilmslow, as stated.

They originally claimed it was a minibus and only changed that today which is why I linked to Google's cache not the actual article (they probably wrongly assumed a bus crash at 11am with 11 passengers injured means it wouldn't have been a normal bus.)

Saying minibus and not a normal service bus could mean people worry about a minibus full of children not returning on time because it got delayed in heavy traffic.
 

starrymarkb

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Ours has just announced that it is becoming a weekly.

It used to be an Evening Paper, then they shut the press in the city and so it currently publishes following morning and now it's going once a week in September. (TBH I'm not surprised, most people buy it weekly on Cars/Flat Rentals/Jobs/Homes for Sale day. I don't know anyone who buys it for news
 

scotsman

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As someone who writes a column for a local paper, and having done a week working in the Editorial Dept. of said paper, I have to say I find this pretty insulting.

Local journalism is dying, mainly because of reader apathy. You have to remember that these journalists are not experts on transport, they may be on the local area or, perhaps even sport. Newsrooms have been slashed, with sub-editors and journalists being cut and the remainder trying to do the work of those who have lost their positions.

Sometimes, the hacks can't even get out to see the scene for themselves and have to rely on phone calls, press releases or accounts from members of the public. It would be absurd to suggest that journalism is 100% is, or should be, error free.

Now, what we have here is a simple mistake. A small bus - a minibus? - crashed, it was on the way from Wilmslow and Knutford. Correct. It just happened that it's final destination was Altrincham, now - if you're not local (and let's face it, these guys likely live and work in Manchester) then it's possible to make a simple mistake on a bus' destination.

I think we need to have a slight reality check here. The Sun, the best-selling daily newspaper in the UK, has been running barely justified stories, which border on invading privacy, on celebrities for decades. They've been hiring people to hack the phones of thousands of people.

Now, if you ask me, that's a considerably bigger crime - yet, you seem intent on vilifying a local newspaper (one of the last daily locals) for some petty fact-checking error (the bus route isn't even worthy of that) - so why not ignore something worth ignoring!
 

WestCoast

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Local journalism is dying, mainly because of reader apathy. You have to remember that these journalists are not experts on transport, they may be on the local area or, perhaps even sport. Newsrooms have been slashed, with sub-editors and journalists being cut and the remainder trying to do the work of those who have lost their positions.

Yes, errors are going to happen, but some of the very basic mistakes (not really specialist either) I have seen in my local paper are quite frankly very poor. Such basic things as getting Councillors' names wrong or even naming the wrong company on a planning issue!

Sorry, but I can't be bothered paying money for that. The editors/journalists can be insulted all they want, but you have to maintain basic standards.

Anyone trying to keep quality journalism in a local paper gets my support! It does still exist but it is getting thinner.
 
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strange6

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The Wigan Evening Post is also terrible for reporting things wrong. I can well remember a few months ago when they reported on a sabotage incident at Gathurst and referred to the train as a locomotive and the cab as the footplate.
 

talltim

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So why will the road need to be closed for a month? That seems to be a bigger error/omission in the articlethan any of the things mentioned
 

BestWestern

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As someone who writes a column for a local paper, and having done a week working in the Editorial Dept. of said paper, I have to say I find this pretty insulting.

Local journalism is dying, mainly because of reader apathy. You have to remember that these journalists are not experts on transport, they may be on the local area or, perhaps even sport....

You make a valid point. However, an observation I would have to make here is that often the inaccuracies appear only to occur because a reporter insists on going overboard with the detail, inserting information which the average reader doesn't need to know and has no interest it, presumably either to sound more factual or simply to bulk out the story. This is where much of the sloppiness comes in, with said 'facts' sometimes seemingly plucked out of the air or based on other completely unrelated info (for a relevant example see the endless mention of every bus in the vicinity of London being a 'Routemaster', etc etc). I guess the common sense rule really ought to be, if you don't know it, don't mention it!
 

scotsman

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Sorry, but I can't be bothered paying money for that. The editors/journalists can be insulted all they want, but you have to maintain basic standards.

I've seen similar comments directed at staff of TOCs...:roll:

Errors happen from time to time, yes, but I fail to see how any of these listed on this thread are unforgivable. Getting someone's name wrong is daft and embarrassing, but if you've got a list of planning applications/councillors in front of you it's not hard to attribute something to the wrong person.

I once wrote a story where I had a spokesperson for a local sports club giving me information contradicting the promotional literature for a company they were working with. I/the paper could have looked rather daft if I hadn't noticed that the company was in fact not 'local' in anyway - contrary to what I was told.

It's not easy...
 

northwichcat

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A solo is a 'minibus' to me! :P

:lol::roll:

It was an Optare Versa that crashed though, not it's baby brother the Solo.

Sometimes, the hacks can't even get out to see the scene for themselves and have to rely on phone calls, press releases or accounts from members of the public. It would be absurd to suggest that journalism is 100% is, or should be, error free.

I agree it can't always be 100% error free but I've seen local newspaper stories with basic spelling and grammar errors in. Surly journalists have spell checking facilities, even though it's easy to not spot one or two mistakes by proof reading.

In my local paper a reader's letter referred to a road called Middle Walk. For some reason the letter was edited so it said Middlewich Walk - there is no such road.

Now, what we have here is a simple mistake. A small bus - a minibus? - crashed, it was on the way from Wilmslow and Knutford. [Correct. /quote]

Wrong. It wasn't a small bus - it was an off-peak bus service near it's terminus that had only 11 passengers on board. Someone obviously assumed because there were 11 passengers it was a small bus.

This is the exact type of bus that crashed (possibly the exact bus):
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2653/4058846010_e8bd828502.jpg If you call that a minibus then anything that isn't a double decker or a bendy bus must also be a minibus.

It just happened that it's final destination was Altrincham, now - if you're not local (and let's face it, these guys likely live and work in Manchester) then it's possible to make a simple mistake on a bus' destination.

For anyone who knows someone who was travelling on 88 bus service on Thursday the most important thing would be which service it was and in which direction it was going. If you don't provide the reader with that information then it can spark panic because they might wrongly assume someone they know was on the bus that crashed, when in fact they're on another bus which was delayed because the road was closed afterwards.
 

scotsman

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I agree it can't always be 100% error free but I've seen local newspaper stories with basic spelling and grammar errors in. Surly journalists have spell checking facilities, even though it's easy to not spot one or two mistakes by proof reading.

Yes because I write my posts in a word processing program with spelling and grammar checks and get someone to proof read before publishing. :roll:

You're contradicting yourself just a wee bit here. As it happens, when I was working in the office, it was with a programme that didn't have spelling or grammar checking.


In my local paper a reader's letter referred to a road called Middle Walk. For some reason the letter was edited so it said Middlewich Walk - there is no such road.
Reader with dodgy handwriting?

For anyone who knows someone who was travelling on 88 bus service on Thursday the most important thing would be which service it was and in which direction it was going. If you don't provide the reader with that information then it can spark panic because they might wrongly assume someone they know was on the bus that crashed, when in fact they're on another bus which was delayed because the road was closed afterwards.
I don't think so. The description of the route was factually correct, the bus did go to those places - it just terminated elsewhere. It won't spark panic either, it's a local newspaper released several hours after the incident - there were only 11 people hurt. The main purpose of the article is to inform the reader of what happened, not to inform them that a friend was possibly injured.
 

MCR247

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It was an Optare Versa that crashed though, not it's baby brother the Solo.

Sorry, looked like a Solo SR to me. Couldn't see where the destination box was!

Just google Connect 88, and it is a versa :oops:
 

WestCoast

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I've seen similar comments directed at staff of TOCs...:roll:

Sorry but there's a major difference between choosing not to buy the local rag, and choosing not to buy a ticket because you are unhappy with the service. In the second scenario, you are using the service without paying, which has no relevance to the first scenario.

It's worth mentioning that quality in a local paper does certainly vary, with some maintaining higher standards than others.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
when I was working in the office, it was with a programme that didn't have spelling or grammar checking

That seems really daft. Surely a bit of investment (it's not going to be that costly!) in spelling and grammar tools would make a journalists life easier...

Anything can be checked online for free now as well.
 
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northwichcat

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You're contradicting yourself just a wee bit here. As it happens, when I was working in the office, it was with a programme that didn't have spelling or grammar checking.

How am I contradicting myself?

I was making the point that my posts don't go through the same process of checking as I was expect a newspaper to go through.


Reader with dodgy handwriting?

More likely that someone from the town of Middlewich was typing out the letter and automatically wrote the 'wich' bit after 'Middle' out of habit.


The description of the route was factually correct, the bus did go to those places - it just terminated elsewhere. It won't spark panic either, it's a local newspaper released several hours after the incident - there were only 11 people hurt. The main purpose of the article is to inform the reader of what happened, not to inform them that a friend was possibly injured.

Right, you're misunderstanding something key here. Originally on Thursday the MEN published a story talking about a minibus crash where 11 passengers were taken to hospital. They then got a picture of the crashed bus and changed the online article so it didn't refer to a minibus and referred to a specific bus route.

The first thing I heard about the bus crash was someone saying a minibus has crashed and the road had been closed. They'd obviously got the information from the MEN. When I heard that I automatically assumed it was not one of the two bus services that operate on that road as neither are operated by a minibus.

I don't know how quickly the operator got a replacement bus and driver on the route but it's quite possible the MEN reported the 'minibus crash' before the operator had sorted out a replacement bus and driver meaning telling the public what route it was would have been useful.
 

Xenophon PCDGS

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I would like to enter the debate here with one solitary reminder of a mistake made by the Manchester Evening News many years ago during the riots at Strangeways Prison, when the main evening edition went to press with the banner headline

2 0 .. D E A D

Of course, this was a total fallacy and journalism of the worst kind. The paper took years to live this down.
 

bus man

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One of the bigest problem with some journilists is there total lack of knowledge of public transport and there inability to see anything that is in front of their eyes.

If there is an accident that involves any bus company with the word "Express " in the title our local paper automaticlay assumes its "National Express" even when the words "Stagecoach " or "Aston" appear in the photo in the article.

One of our problems (like other areas) is that the evening paper "The Star" is now a morning paper and is published at 5am so there is a huge lead in time , indeed , unless its an appeal for witnesses by the police it very rarely tells you when the incident occured.

There can also be a huge bias against public transport.

With regard accracey a press reported spent two hours with my boss who was wearing a name badge - they didnt even get that right in the paper.
 
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northwichcat

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I would like to enter the debate here with one solitary reminder of a mistake made by the Manchester Evening News many years ago during the riots at Strangeways Prison, when the main evening edition went to press with the banner headline

2 0 .. D E A D

Of course, this was a total fallacy and journalism of the worst kind. The paper took years to live this down.

The Sun still hasn't lived down the headline of 'The Truth' on a story about the Hillsborough disaster when all tabloids started printed unverified accusations about the football fans who died, but The Sun's headline made both Liverpool and Everton fans boycott the paper.
 

bb21

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Sorry, but I can't be bothered paying money for that. The editors/journalists can be insulted all they want, but you have to maintain basic standards.

I don't think this is a good choice of words here. The editors/journalists might make elementary mistakes from time to time. That doesn't mean they can be insulted.
 
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