Why the objection to using ticket gates?

[Moonshot]

At Loughborough the barriers are just a nuisance, accepting maybe 1/5 tickets! They only have 5 barriers and with many people arriving by bus(therefore all together) it become awfully congested, especially when people try to feed the barriers seat reservations(why?!).

I don't really use barriers elsewhere as they aren't installed but I'm quite happy to try, the main problem at Loughborough to be honest is the uncaring gateline attendant stood there insisting you try the ticket after he's looked at it, despite having tried it already in front of his face. Depending on his mood he then either makes you step about 1 foot behind the barrier(meaning when it opens you have to shift) or he just opens the barrier on to you!

That is easily done .....I ve done that myself more than once.

 

[ECML180]

That is easily done .....I ve done that myself more than once.

I can understand it if you've just grabbed it from your wallet...but these are people who've queued for 5 minutes staring at their tickets

 

[Moonshot]

I can understand it if you've just grabbed it from your wallet...but these are people who've queued for 5 minutes staring at their tickets

Makes you wonder why we have so many tickets just for a train journey !!

 

[ECML180]

Makes you wonder why we have so many tickets just for a train journey !!

Maybe we should just abandon tickets and barriers all-together and electrify everything. Then when people get on they all just stick 50p in the meter!

 

[47802]

I find the barriers to be a pain the arse for long distance journeys and the fact that a lot of tickets wont work the barriers.

I must admit when I was in London for a week last year I had an Oyster card Travelcard and I did think that passing your oyster card over the card reader was generally far easier and quicker than having to put a ticket in the slot, more tickets should work that way

 

[Class83]

I find the barriers to be a pain the arse for long distance journeys and the fact that a lot of tickets wont work the barriers.

I must admit when I was in London for a week last year I had an Oyster card Travelcard and I did think that passing your oyster card over the card reader was generally far easier and quicker than having to put a ticket in the slot, more tickets should work that way

Some kind of RFID/oyster photocard which could be programmed to open appropriate barriers would be useful, they would still need to issue the paper ticket for when the guard checked on train, but it would make things a lot faster at barriers.

 

[Katada]

If the success rate for Oyster cards was as low as 90% then there would be some serious congestion problems during the peak at many stations.

I'd say it's closer to 98 times out of 100.

No.

Having used one for years it is very very regular to mis-swipe it. I have done it and so have many others. Boarding a bus, the tube, you'll see it happen to people straight away.

 

[user15681]

Some kind of RFID/oyster photocard which could be programmed to open appropriate barriers would be useful, they would still need to issue the paper ticket for when the guard checked on train, but it would make things a lot faster at barriers.

The problem then becomes that you have two 'tickets' if you like. You could give the paper ticket to someone else to use for themselves and then use the card yourself.

 

[button_boxer]

I was in Montreal a few years ago and there the 1 and 3 day passes for the metro were single-use smartcards that you place flat on the reader rather than having to put them through the slot. I wonder how much it would cost to adopt that sort of technology here - you could have a ticket that works gates on the smartcard reader but still has the ticket details printed on the front for manual inspection.

 

[Holly]

Because dealing with a person is more pleasant than dealing with a machine. It affords an opportunity to smile and brighten the other person's day just a little and make them feel that their life is just that tiny bit more worthwhile.

In other words, because we are human is why. If we were robots we would probably prefer electro-mechanical barriers.

 

[Tibbs]

Again, season tickets. They do not get swallowed other than when the machine jams.

You've just answered your own question.

Season tickets are generally in a worse condition that regular tickets, so would (I imagine) get stuck more frequently.

 

[lincolnshire]

It always makes me laugh at the waste of money that barriers are as more often than not at London they are all set for wide open at arrival end and also departure end too.

At Lincoln the other day all the barriers were set to open and people were still putting there tickets into the slot to get off platform.

Another day the wide one was open and rest closed and still people was using the closed ones insread of walking un headed through the open one.

Nowt as queer as folks !

Happy New Year to all.

 

[David Goddard]

As I have said before, I find ticket gates/barriers to be the single most annoying aspect of rail travel in the 21st Century.

Process: This is another point where we the paying public are being PROCESSED and do not like it. Sheep going for dipping or shearing are treated in a more pleasant manner than the way some gatelines are arranged.

Rejects: The gates are AWFUL at rejecting perfectly valid tickets. Particularly when the user is starting short or making a break of journey but at other times as well, particularly shoulder peak (ie when the first off peak train from Reading is 0934 and they will not allow an off peak ticker through the gates until 0931). Another instance is Rovers - I had an East midlands Rover a few years back and it wouldn't work the gate at Derby (2 minutes and 20 feet away from when and where I bought it) or at Nottingham or Lincoln.

Retention: There are LOTS of reasons why a passenger may wish to retain their ticket at the end of their journey, and the retention programming turns this process into a faff. Reasons could be delay repay, expenses, personal records, sentimental or more. This ends up costing me more money as whenever I am travelling to a gated station I end up buying a ticket to a further point so that it will not be retained at my destination. Reading to Oxford this becomes Earley to Hanborough and so on.

Delays: The whole process is fine if passengers are not carrying anything. Add a suitcase, camera bag, laptop bag, paper bag with lunch in it and a steaming hot cup of tea and you have a recipe for disaster. I have in the past had aforementioned steaming hot cup of tea knocked out of my hand when using a barrier, and the outcome was not pleasant!

I would advocate removal of barriers from all major stations, particularly those on InterCity routes, and especially London terminal platform such as Kings Cross 0-8 and Paddington 2-5 and 10-11. A higher penalty fare and random "heavy checks" should support the tackling fare evasion piece, and for security well this is a complete misnomer which does not stand up at all.

 

[Tetchytyke]

If the success rate for Oyster cards was as low as 90% then there would be some serious congestion problems during the peak at many stations.

Nah, it's very easy to mis-swipe an Oyster: you hold it on the reader too long, or not long enough, or you're too close to the person in front, or the reader just doesn't feel like it.

Oyster works because you only have to wait a second or two and you can have a second attempt.

 

[dvboy]

Ticket barriers can't read nNetwork season tickets issued by National Express West Midlands.

 

[Chrisgr31]

I would advocate removal of barriers from all major stations, particularly those on InterCity routes, and especially London terminal platform such as Kings Cross 0-8 and Paddington 2-5 and 10-11. A higher penalty fare and random "heavy checks" should support the tackling fare evasion piece, and for security well this is a complete misnomer which does not stand up at all.

I wouldn't! I would have card reader barriers at both ends of a journey. Then passengers could either use pre-bought tickets that would be loaded on their card or a PAYG system or a combination of the two. The card would have to work nationally though!

 

[breadfan]

I've done a couple of ALRs in recent years and the only ticket barrier which did not reject the ticket as not being valid was Cardiff Central, and then only when exiting the station.
With other rover tickets, the operation of ticket barriers is, at best, capricious.

I once saw an elderly chap put his ticket into slot on his left as he approached the ticket barrier. As he stood waiting for the barrier in front of him to open, one of the group of teenagers passing through the barrier on the left took his ticket, much to their amusement. Poor bloke then was accused of not having a ticket and started to get some grief. I went to his aid and explained what I had seen and he was let through but there was no apology or even good grace about it. Well done, Leeds.

 

[Kettledrum]

As I have said before, I find ticket gates/barriers to be the single most annoying aspect of rail travel in the 21st Century.

Process: This is another point where we the paying public are being PROCESSED and do not like it. Sheep going for dipping or shearing are treated in a more pleasant manner than the way some gatelines are arranged.

Rejects: The gates are AWFUL at rejecting perfectly valid tickets. Particularly when the user is starting short or making a break of journey but at other times as well, particularly shoulder peak (ie when the first off peak train from Reading is 0934 and they will not allow an off peak ticker through the gates until 0931). Another instance is Rovers - I had an East midlands Rover a few years back and it wouldn't work the gate at Derby (2 minutes and 20 feet away from when and where I bought it) or at Nottingham or Lincoln.

Retention: There are LOTS of reasons why a passenger may wish to retain their ticket at the end of their journey, and the retention programming turns this process into a faff. Reasons could be delay repay, expenses, personal records, sentimental or more. This ends up costing me more money as whenever I am travelling to a gated station I end up buying a ticket to a further point so that it will not be retained at my destination. Reading to Oxford this becomes Earley to Hanborough and so on.

Delays: The whole process is fine if passengers are not carrying anything. Add a suitcase, camera bag, laptop bag, paper bag with lunch in it and a steaming hot cup of tea and you have a recipe for disaster. I have in the past had aforementioned steaming hot cup of tea knocked out of my hand when using a barrier, and the outcome was not pleasant!

I would advocate removal of barriers from all major stations, particularly those on InterCity routes, and especially London terminal platform such as Kings Cross 0-8 and Paddington 2-5 and 10-11. A higher penalty fare and random "heavy checks" should support the tackling fare evasion piece, and for security well this is a complete misnomer which does not stand up at all.

Totally agree with this.

I am often frustrated by being delayed by queues at automatic ticket barriers.

The queues are caused by sheer volume of passengers trying to get through them, some barriers being faulty and out of use, other barriers rejecting valid tickets, leading to the barrier being blocked by a genuine, frustrated passenger trying to get a valid ticket to work the barrier.

With millions being spent on the Midland Main Line to shave minutes off the journey, why are minutes then added to my journey at the ticket barrier at St Pancras?

Most of the time, there have been ticket checks on the journey, and the ticket inspectors have not been prevented from walking up and down the train by severe over crowding, so the barriers are completely unnecessary.

 

[Harbon 1]

They're just generally a pain to use. Tickets aren't accepted, you have to turn around against the massive queue of people that have already gathered, and that's annoying when you're already half in the barrier lane. I don't like putting ranger tickets in them because it's a nightmare getting them back having to take the front of the barrier off to get to the tube of tickets, and then carrying a bag you can get stuck in them. The ones on the underground are vicious!

Although they are funny. Lincoln leaves one barrier open sometimes, and still people queue up to go through the closed barriers

 

[TUC]

Getting a season ticket replaced once every few months is hardly a big deal surely? And I'm talking about the vast majority of passengers who use their season ticket from A to B to get on at A and get off at B, not loophole tickets.

Getting off at an intermediate station is not a loophole.

 

[GatwickDepress]

My season ticket never worked in the barriers at Brighton, I suspect the barriers were configured to reject it (or were simply confused) as it had a Sussex Student Card 34% discount applied to it.

On one occasion I had to wait twenty minutes at the barriers until the gateline staff had finished dealing with other customers. To the staff member's credit, he was exceptionally apologetic afterwards. Still insisted I try inserting my ticket before tapping me through!

 

[87 027]

I have a dual availability season ticket which has never worked the barriers at the alternative station, which I use about 40% of the time; every time I've tried it fails with code 116. Tonight there was an RPI block at the gateline at this station, I just waved the ticket and photocard as usual and got let through the manual gate no problem; the RPIs didn't even bat an eyelid. So I presume it's a known issue.

 

[D6975]

Not seasons, but rovers as others have mentioned, fail to operate almost all barriers.
Leeds is one of the few places where a NW rover worked, but even then it was unreliable. If you're in a hurry it's quicker to flash your ticket to the man on the gate.

 

[Holly]

... If you're in a hurry it's quicker to flash your ticket to the man on the gate.

Not just quicker, but more pleasant.

Even if it were slower it is worth the little extra time to brighten everyone's day with a little more human interaction.
Let the machines handle other machines and humans interact with humans. Since we are human it is wasting part of our lives to use a machine needlessly.

Why contribute, albeit in a very small way, to the long term downfall of humanity by using machines unnecessarily?

 

[ECML180]

Why contribute, albeit in a very small way, to the long term downfall of humanity by using machines unnecessarily?

Let's assume that the ticket gates are necessary-whether they are or not is a different debate

If they are necessary, imagine staffing levels needed to have all gates manually operated, you'd either end up with a reasonably short wait with very high fares to cover the staff costs, or only a few gates because it's otherwise too expensive.

If you didn't have gates it wouldn't matter who operated them, so I can't see how this really impacts on the 'downfall of humanity'. Like many cases it wouldn't be possible unless a machine could undertake this task.

 

[dannypye9999]

I remember about 10 years ago I travelled Manchester Picc to Gatwick Airport, taking the train via London Euston then cross city on bus to Victoria. But once at Victoria the barriers on the platform didn't accept my ticket for some reason, even though it had the '+' sign for cross London. So knowing I had a valid ticket I duck dived under the barriers and made way along the platform for the train only to be met by curious train staff who had seen me ducking beneath the barriers. I explained everything and was ok but ever since ive always had this kind of dislike to barriers. I prefer staff.

 

[bb21]

I was in Montreal a few years ago and there the 1 and 3 day passes for the metro were single-use smartcards that you place flat on the reader rather than having to put them through the slot. I wonder how much it would cost to adopt that sort of technology here - you could have a ticket that works gates on the smartcard reader but still has the ticket details printed on the front for manual inspection.

We already have that technology. Glasgow Subway have been using them for day passes for a while now.

 

[user15681]

I remember about 10 years ago I travelled Manchester Picc to Gatwick Airport, taking the train via London Euston then cross city on bus to Victoria. But once at Victoria the barriers on the platform didn't accept my ticket for some reason, even though it had the '+' sign for cross London. So knowing I had a valid ticket I duck dived under the barriers and made way along the platform for the train only to be met by curious train staff who had seen me ducking beneath the barriers. I explained everything and was ok but ever since ive always had this kind of dislike to barriers. I prefer staff.

Yeah the '+' tickets for cross London are temperamental I find. I make the trip between Euston and Victoria every day on a travelcard. One day though I had a ticket with '+' for one cross London journey, except mine was rejected at Euston and went through fine at Victoria.

 

[Holly]

Let's assume that the ticket gates are necessary-whether they are or not is a different debate
If they are necessary, imagine staffing levels needed to have all gates manually operated, you'd either end up with a reasonably short wait with very high fares to cover the staff costs, or only a few gates because it's otherwise too expensive. ...

Modernly, I see electric gates and high fares.
Previously, before electric gates were commonplace, it was manned gates and lower fares.

 

[CalderRail]

Another example is if you are using HS1 services as part of a longer journey.

Doing Wakefield to Maidstone return a year or two ago, would the barriers off the HS1 platforms let my perfectly valid ticket through? Would they hell as like.