What knock on effects would it have for the off peak Salisbury to Waterloo service?
I'm not doubting what you've said, just curious to know more.
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Why don't SWT Fasts Stop at Clapham Junction
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What knock on effects would it have for the off peak Salisbury to Waterloo service?
I'm not doubting what you've said, just curious to know more.
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R
RailUK Forums
There's an xx53 Alton service behind the xx50 Salisbury. The xx53 does call at Clapham but if you also called the xx50 then it would delay the xx53 by a couple of minutes. The xx53 then has to cross to the slow lines at Surbiton, and it is only booked 3 minutes ahead of an all stations Woking service.
This is a fascinating discussion. Surrey recently undertook a rail users consultation for which I replied. It included options for Clapham Junction, such as making it a hub. Personally if they are to introduce cross rail 2, then I think it would be nice if they allowed SWT mainline users to use it without having to take slow trains to reach it or change trains even to reach it.
For example if travelling from north London to Havant a passenger might have to change at any station between Clapham Junction and Surbiton and then join a slow train to Guildford, where they would then pick up a fast train to Havant. I guess they could change at Surbiton and then Woking but without 2 fast trains to Woking, they would have to get lucky with the connections.
Network rail are undertaking big projects on the Brighton mainline, such as the Gatwick Airport platform and the bridge through London Bridge. They are lengthening Suburban trains. Yet the over capacity of these trains is less than the SWT mainline and currently they are doing nothing beyond lengthening a few trains and the report states this isn't enough.
I think they should tackle the bigger problem. Of course the report also said if nothing was done growth might be less. Do they want growth? Perhaps they feel the growth isn't worth the costs or inconvenience. I did read that Waterloo was behind in longer term maintenance programmes because so many trains stop there. Therefore they patch up more than do things for the future.
Of course another things against Clapham Junction and trains stopping their is the fact even when they avoid it, they struggle to run their trains on time.
I started logging my journeys to and from work last year or the year before. I logged when my trains were late and when they were on time. My usual journey was Guildford Harrow and Wealdstone. Either via Clapham Junction or central London. I've not rechecked every entry but since January I've made a mental note as to whether all my trains were on time.
I can revel that on only 2 days did all my trains arrive and depart within 1 minute of their advertised time and I'm not include trains arriving early, just those arriving late! One of those days was a single journey in one direction and the other multiple journeys in 2 directions. Now I usually travel 5 days a week Monday to Friday and sometimes at weekends and like most commuters I have holidays when I'm not travelling or travelling irregularly. So it was a fair reflection I feel. If I went through my previous notes I am sure I would find this stat of 2 days would go back much further than January.
Started a new job recently and thought things would improve. They have in that my delays are less in time compared to London Midland but otherwise no.
The thing is, for most of these delays no one says a word. They don't apologise; explain why it happened. One evening I was 8 minutes late into Haywards Heath without a word as to why. Your more likely not to be told than are. National Rail Enquiries doesn't give out much info either other than show the number of minutes late a train is.
So if there is already slack in the timetable, perhaps there needs to be even more. But with even more, would that give an even greater incentive not to stop at Clapham Junction.
I can see the point of the working timetable including a later start time for trains but for arrival I don't see the point. It only occurs during the peak hours. Surely they should give everyone the same time. Then the guard won't tell passengers a train arrives at 8.09 when the public timetable says 8.11. After all companies only pay compensation based on the public timetable. So if you hear your train should have been in at 8.09 but it actually arrived 8.39, you can't claim but you might think you can. In the case of SWT make that 9.09.
I may going a bit off topic but I think arrive and departure times and trains stopping at Clapham Junction are linked. After all the more stations one stops at, the more chance of there being delays due to passengers. Not that passengers are the only cause of delays.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I wonder who decided that selective door opening was not considered suitable for SWT trains and their lines? I mean it was considered suitable for Southern trains and some of their trains use the same lines as SWT.
I always remember a 10 car train stopping at Fratton when their was heavy downpour. We were travelling north. All the passengers were under the canopy. They all then had to leg it because the only 5 carriages to open their doors were all in front of the canopy. Other times I use to see people run because either their was no announcement or they didn't listen with regard to which doors open. After all one might think here's the canopy so of course the doors will open here.
So what if their is a canopy and the main station buildings. Why should their presence have any bearing on which train doors open. That's not a fact which should ever be considered he says sarcastically.
Of course people are allowed to make mistakes. We are all human.
For example if travelling from north London to Havant a passenger might have to change at any station between Clapham Junction and Surbiton and then join a slow train to Guildford, where they would then pick up a fast train to Havant. I guess they could change at Surbiton and then Woking but without 2 fast trains to Woking, they would have to get lucky with the connections.
Network rail are undertaking big projects on the Brighton mainline, such as the Gatwick Airport platform and the bridge through London Bridge. They are lengthening Suburban trains. Yet the over capacity of these trains is less than the SWT mainline and currently they are doing nothing beyond lengthening a few trains and the report states this isn't enough.
I think they should tackle the bigger problem. Of course the report also said if nothing was done growth might be less. Do they want growth? Perhaps they feel the growth isn't worth the costs or inconvenience. I did read that Waterloo was behind in longer term maintenance programmes because so many trains stop there. Therefore they patch up more than do things for the future.
Of course another things against Clapham Junction and trains stopping their is the fact even when they avoid it, they struggle to run their trains on time.
I started logging my journeys to and from work last year or the year before. I logged when my trains were late and when they were on time. My usual journey was Guildford Harrow and Wealdstone. Either via Clapham Junction or central London. I've not rechecked every entry but since January I've made a mental note as to whether all my trains were on time.
I can revel that on only 2 days did all my trains arrive and depart within 1 minute of their advertised time and I'm not include trains arriving early, just those arriving late! One of those days was a single journey in one direction and the other multiple journeys in 2 directions. Now I usually travel 5 days a week Monday to Friday and sometimes at weekends and like most commuters I have holidays when I'm not travelling or travelling irregularly. So it was a fair reflection I feel. If I went through my previous notes I am sure I would find this stat of 2 days would go back much further than January.
Started a new job recently and thought things would improve. They have in that my delays are less in time compared to London Midland but otherwise no.
The thing is, for most of these delays no one says a word. They don't apologise; explain why it happened. One evening I was 8 minutes late into Haywards Heath without a word as to why. Your more likely not to be told than are. National Rail Enquiries doesn't give out much info either other than show the number of minutes late a train is.
So if there is already slack in the timetable, perhaps there needs to be even more. But with even more, would that give an even greater incentive not to stop at Clapham Junction.
I can see the point of the working timetable including a later start time for trains but for arrival I don't see the point. It only occurs during the peak hours. Surely they should give everyone the same time. Then the guard won't tell passengers a train arrives at 8.09 when the public timetable says 8.11. After all companies only pay compensation based on the public timetable. So if you hear your train should have been in at 8.09 but it actually arrived 8.39, you can't claim but you might think you can. In the case of SWT make that 9.09.
I may going a bit off topic but I think arrive and departure times and trains stopping at Clapham Junction are linked. After all the more stations one stops at, the more chance of there being delays due to passengers. Not that passengers are the only cause of delays.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I wonder who decided that selective door opening was not considered suitable for SWT trains and their lines? I mean it was considered suitable for Southern trains and some of their trains use the same lines as SWT.
I always remember a 10 car train stopping at Fratton when their was heavy downpour. We were travelling north. All the passengers were under the canopy. They all then had to leg it because the only 5 carriages to open their doors were all in front of the canopy. Other times I use to see people run because either their was no announcement or they didn't listen with regard to which doors open. After all one might think here's the canopy so of course the doors will open here.
So what if their is a canopy and the main station buildings. Why should their presence have any bearing on which train doors open. That's not a fact which should ever be considered he says sarcastically.
Of course people are allowed to make mistakes. We are all human.
I was unaware that SWT do not advertise CLJ on certain jnys departing from London Waterloo. Today, the 1453 service to Alton was advertised as 'first stop Surbiton' both onboard the train via the PIS and guard and at Waterloo, so I was suprised that it called there. I don't think I recall the same circumstance with Southern and Victoria departures, although nowadays you wouldn't know what is going where as the announcements are dreadful and break down! Bring back Phil!
Eagle
Established Member
That's because the service is pick up only at Clapham Junction.
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