Why do most charter train operators favour Victoria or Paddington over Waterloo?

[AY1975]

I have noticed that at least in the last few years a lot more charter trains seem to have run from London Victoria or Paddington rather than Waterloo. I wonder why this is. More spare capacity at Victoria and Paddington than at Waterloo, maybe?

For example, Railway Touring Company and Steam Dreams tend to use Victoria rather than Waterloo as discussed in entry #6 of this thread on the pros and cons of different tour operators: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/pros-and-cons-of-different-railtours-operators.255978/ Steam Dreams trains have run out of Waterloo in the past but mostly seem to use Victoria these days if going anywhere on the Southern Region.

That said, Waterloo does still see the occasional charter train, either as a starting or terminating point or as an intermediate calling point (obviously involving a reversal en route).

 

[30907]

Can't answer about Paddington, but Victoria (South Eastern side) is less busy and platforms 1-2 are a little away from the main passenger flow. It also has access to a whole range of destinations via the various connections in the Stewarts Lane area.

 

[Anonymous10]

Can't answer about Paddington, but Victoria (South Eastern side) is less busy and platforms 1-2 are a little away from the main passenger flow. It also has access to a whole range of destinations via the various connections in the Stewarts Lane area.

I'd assume Paddington is similar given its access to destinations across Wales and the South west as well as via Reading ect to the Midlands.

 

[renegademaster]

Waterloo is hardly the prettiest station. Lots UK Railtours ones start from Waterloo, but they are more armed at enthusiasts. Belmont Pullman have got a shop front at Victoria, not sure if Paddington have anything similar

 

[43096]

Can't answer about Paddington, but Victoria (South Eastern side) is less busy and platforms 1-2 are a little away from the main passenger flow. It also has access to a whole range of destinations via the various connections in the Stewarts Lane area.

There is also much easier access to and from Stewarts Lane depot from Victoria.

 

[TheHSRailFan]

I think it's just easy with the idea that waterloo is very busy.

 

[StephenHunter]

Can't answer about Paddington, but Victoria (South Eastern side) is less busy and platforms 1-2 are a little away from the main passenger flow. It also has access to a whole range of destinations via the various connections in the Stewarts Lane area.

1 and 2 are easier to restrict access to as well. They were historically used for the boat trains, like the Golden Arrow and Night Ferry.

https://www.networkrail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2023/08/London-Victoria-Station-Map.pdf

 

[fgwrich]

There is also much easier access to and from Stewarts Lane depot from Victoria.

In addition to your post, Paddington used to have the legacy of Old Oak Common depot on its approach - so a lot of Riviera tours started from there. Now it's largely the WCRC (and to some extent LSL) operated tours which start and finish from there due to stock stabling at Southall.

 

[zwk500]

I have noticed that at least in the last few years a lot more charter trains seem to have run from London Victoria or Paddington rather than Waterloo. I wonder why this is. More spare capacity at Victoria and Paddington than at Waterloo, maybe?

Largely depot location - DB/VSOE have the Stewart's Lane shed for Victoria, LSL and WCRC have sheds at Southall for Paddington. Also platform 2 at Victoria is very long and SouthEastern are well practiced in accommodating the VSOE, so the departure times are more stable than they would be from Waterloo. Victoria also has easy access to everywhere via the West London Line and Ludgate connections whereas the connections from Waterloo (Sheepcote lane curve/Linford street flyover) are barely used. Waterloo also has restrictions on certain coaching stock in certain platforms, so if you aren't heading for somewhere that really needs to use Waterloo like the SW region then it makes sense to use Victoria.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Waterloo is hardly the prettiest station. Lots UK Railtours ones start from Waterloo, but they are more armed at enthusiasts. Belmont Pullman have got a shop front at Victoria, not sure if Paddington have anything similar

I doubt architecture is a major consideration. If it was, I wouldn't describe Waterloo as particularly unsightly, at least it doesn't have a shopping centre dumped on top of it like Victoria does.

 

[StephenHunter]

I doubt architecture is a major consideration. If it was, I wouldn't describe Waterloo as particularly unsightly, at least it doesn't have a shopping centre dumped on top of it like Victoria does.

Victoria's Southeastern side is fine. It's the Southern bit that has the shopping centre on top.

 

[MarkyT]

Largely depot location - DB/VSOE have the Stewart's Lane shed for Victoria, LSL and WCRC have sheds at Southall for Paddington. Also platform 2 at Victoria is very long

About 360m. #1 is 260m, a little longer than most Southern platforms. At Waterloo there are no platforms capable of routinely handling trains longer than a standard 12x20m or 10x23m SWR formation.

and SouthEastern are well practiced in accommodating the VSOE, so the departure times are more stable than they would be from Waterloo. Victoria also has easy access to everywhere via the West London Line and Ludgate connections whereas the connections from Waterloo (Sheepcote lane curve/Linford street flyover) are barely used. Waterloo also has restrictions on certain coaching stock in certain platforms, so if you aren't heading for somewhere that really needs to use Waterloo like the SW region then it makes sense to use Victoria.

Literally, every single mainline heading out of the capital in all directions can be accessed from Victoria's Chatham side via various convoluted cross-London routes without a reversal so the terminus is highly suitable for steam-hauled excursions.

 

[StephenHunter]

Victoria Platform 2 used to take Load 15 boat trains in fact.

 

[Peter Wilde]

It’s not just “in the last few years”. There have been more steam charter departures from Victoria than from Waterloo, for a very long time; for the reasons others have given.