Why are some stations only partially barriered?

[DesiroUK]

I suspect this has possibly been asked before, though I was unable to find anything searching.
I have recently been to a few stations with multiple entrances where some of the entrances have had ticket barriers and at least one entrance without barriers. A couple of stations I can remember are Bicester Village (Barriers on the two entrances on the west platform but no barriers on the entrance on the east platform, and nothing on the footbridge meaning it's possible to access both platforms without a ticket). Epping station is a similar situation with barriers on West platform entrance and no barriers on the East side entrance, from which both platforms are accessible.
I was wondering, since it's possible to totally bypass the barriers without a ticket, what is the point of installing and staffing barriers in only some entrances to a station?
To me it seems a pointless waste of money as anyone wanting to avoid paying will just use the other entrance?

 

[duffield]

Nottingham: Main entrance barriered, side entrances (to access the footbridge) nothing. This is due to a public footpath running right across the station. Occasionally there have been ticket checks on the platform at the bottom of the steps to the footbridge.

Leicester: I haven't used the car park entrance but it may not be barriered.

 

[JonathanH]

Cheshunt and Redhill both have a main entrance gated, but another entry point rarely shut.

There are plans to sort out the platform 3 access at Redhill, but it depends on a significant residential development on the front car park.

 

[Thames99]

Chorleywood. The down platform is always open to access the car park and underpass - possibly this is a public right of way? The up platform has barriers.

 

[yorkie]

what is the point of installing and staffing barriers in only some entrances to a station?

Cost, usually. Sometimes maybe space.

To me it seems a pointless waste of money as anyone wanting to avoid paying will just use the other entrance?

If they have the intelligence/knowledge to work that out. But if they were that intelligent/knowledgeable, they may also realise that such locations are also prime spots for revenue protection inspectors to catch people hoping to exit for free.

For example:

... At Stevenage, they concentrate themselves at the entrance/exits to the lifts, much used to fare dodge getting onto platforms 1/2 and 3/4...QS

 

[Basil Jet]

I suspect this has possibly been asked before, though I was unable to find anything searching.
I have recently been to a few stations with multiple entrances where some of the entrances have had ticket barriers and at least one entrance without barriers. A couple of stations I can remember are Bicester Village (Barriers on the two entrances on the west platform but no barriers on the entrance on the east platform, and nothing on the footbridge meaning it's possible to access both platforms without a ticket). Epping station is a similar situation with barriers on West platform entrance and no barriers on the East side entrance, from which both platforms are accessible.
I was wondering, since it's possible to totally bypass the barriers without a ticket, what is the point of installing and staffing barriers in only some entrances to a station?
To me it seems a pointless waste of money as anyone wanting to avoid paying will just use the other entrance?

Isn't the eastern entrance at Epping locked shut nearly all of the time, making the cost of barriers difficult to justify? A better example might have been Buckhust Hill, which has an extra entrance at the south western corner which I think is always open and unbarriered.

 

[Mojo]

Chorleywood. The down platform is always open to access the car park and underpass - possibly this is a public right of way? The up platform has barriers.

Chorleywood isn’t quite the same, as the Northbound platform is ungated but the subway doesn’t provide access to the Southbound platform which is gated, as the gate at the top of the ramp is ordinarily closed.

This contrasts with the next station down the line, Chalfont & Latimer, where there is an ungated entrance on the Southbound platform, but the station subway offers access to the Southbound platform.

 

[Old Yard Dog]

Liverpool Lime Street only has barriers for platforms 1-6 and A. Platforms 7-10 have no barriers.

P3 at Shrewsbury has no barriers but the other platforms do.

 

[Ianigsy]

Liverpool Lime Street only has barriers for platforms 1-6 and A. Platforms 7-10 have no barriers.

And the Merseyrail platform is accessible from the main concourse via the lift without passing through a barrier. You’ll occasionally see a ticket check either at the top or the bottom.

 

[507020]

Liverpool Lime Street only has barriers for platforms 1-6 and A. Platforms 7-10 have no barriers.

Only 1-5 and I’ve often come across these barriers all open when there aren’t enough staff.

And the Merseyrail platform is accessible from the main concourse via the lift without passing through a barrier. You’ll occasionally see a ticket check either at the top or the bottom.

These lifts allowing unbarriered access to platforms are exactly what this thread describes. There is another one even at Manchester Piccadilly, which provides access to the footbridge from street level outside, although sometimes this lift can have revenue stationed outside it, or be out of service, sometimes free access is possible.

At Crewe, there is a side gate leading to “The horse landing, accessed via platform 12 and the blue walkway” which is primarily used for passenger access to rail replacement buses, but is often left unsecured allowing access in and out of the station without ticket checks.

It seems that having staffed barriers at multiple entrances is considered too great an expense at many stations.

 

[JJmoogle]

Paddington has platform 1 unbarriered completely (it would be extremely difficult to barrier as it's also a major concourse for the station) and also I think 8 and 9 remain unbarriered I've never been quite sure why they remained without though.

 

[Mojo]

I believe the purpose of this thread is not to discuss examples like Liverpool Lime St or Paddington, where there are individual platforms ungated, but locations where some platforms are ungated but where it is possible to get to a platform that is otherwise gated from an ungated entrance

 

[mangyiscute]

Paddington has platform 1 unbarriered completely (it would be extremely difficult to barrier as it's also a major concourse for the station) and also I think 8 and 9 remain unbarriered I've never been quite sure why they remained without though.

I think 8,9 are unbarriered to provide access to the overbridge and the tube, shops and access to little venice without having to pass through ticket barriers - while you can go along platform 12 and up the escalators there, or up platform 1, since 8/9 is so wide it provides much better access to this. Also, there is a big bike rack between 8 and 9, so access to that needs to be provided too.
Anyway, moving back to the original question, you also often get situations where a side entrance will be barriered but much more often left open compared to the main entrance, an example I can think of being Reading's north entrance.
At Oxford, you have some gates that are used for exit only, but what happens with them is during super busy times, they'll be manned and shut, during quieter times (off peak) they'll be left open and during super quiet times (late at night, early morning) there will be shutters meaning you can't go out that route and have to go out the main entrance. Although the main entrance still has most of the barriers set to exit even when this other exit is in use - and there are certainly not enough barriers to enter because of that - thankfully there's the upgrade to the station happening soon so that'll fix this issue.

 

[swt_passenger]

Paddington has platform 1 unbarriered completely (it would be extremely difficult to barrier as it's also a major concourse for the station) and also I think 8 and 9 remain unbarriered I've never been quite sure why they remained without though.

I think originally, say 10 years ago or more, platforms 8&9 were intended to be dedicated to Hex and there’d always be ticket checks and sales on the train. By 2021 a planning application had been approved to add barriers to platform 8&9. The loss of the through route to the overbridge (mentioned in post #13) is part of the works applied for, there will be barriers at both ends.

Planning reference on Westminster planning site:
21/01351/LBC | Installation of Automatic Ticket Gatelines and CCTV at Platforms 8 and 9 and associated works.

 

[LowLevel]

Nottingham: Main entrance barriered, side entrances (to access the footbridge) nothing. This is due to a public footpath running right across the station. Occasionally there have been ticket checks on the platform at the bottom of the steps to the footbridge.

Leicester: I haven't used the car park entrance but it may not be barriered.

Leicester car park entrance is barriered and remotely monitored from the main gateline, but due to misuse is now mostly closed except for peak hours.

Nottingham, well. The gates on the middle overbridge are now closed and locked overnight to prevent undesirables from getting in. There will be a lot of unhappy "pay when challenged" otherwise respectable types if they end up locked during the day too.

 

[Watershed]

I suspect this has possibly been asked before, though I was unable to find anything searching.
I have recently been to a few stations with multiple entrances where some of the entrances have had ticket barriers and at least one entrance without barriers. A couple of stations I can remember are Bicester Village (Barriers on the two entrances on the west platform but no barriers on the entrance on the east platform, and nothing on the footbridge meaning it's possible to access both platforms without a ticket). Epping station is a similar situation with barriers on West platform entrance and no barriers on the East side entrance, from which both platforms are accessible.
I was wondering, since it's possible to totally bypass the barriers without a ticket, what is the point of installing and staffing barriers in only some entrances to a station?

The point is that not everyone will be aware of these unbarriered entrances. Indeed even as a very frequent traveller I was unaware of some of the examples cited above.

To me it seems a pointless waste of money as anyone wanting to avoid paying will just use the other entrance?

Those who know the layout, yes. But clearly it will have some effect. That being said I would imagine that some allowance has to be made for people will use alternative unbarriered entrances, in calculations of whether barriers are worthwhile installing.

 

[JJmoogle]

I just remembered, does Birmingham New Street still have its Subway?
I assume it got sealed off from the public with the refurbishment but it provided access to all platforms and then a lift out to the car park/taxi rank.
Sometimes there'd be someone checking tickets but it seemed to be a thankless task as any time spent dealing with people wouldjust leave others free to enter/exit the lift and sail on by.

 

[WizCastro197]

There are plans to sort out the platform 3 access at Redhill, but it depends on a significant residential development on the front car park.

Is this the same residential development that's been floating around for millions of years?!

 

[Kite159]

I just remembered, does Birmingham New Street still have its Subway?
I assume it got sealed off from the public with the refurbishment but it provided access to all platforms and then a lift out to the car park/taxi rank.
Sometimes there'd be someone checking tickets but it seemed to be a thankless task as any time spent dealing with people wouldjust leave others free to enter/exit the lift and sail on by.

If it still has a subway then it's been sealed off from public use.

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For some stations, such as Cheshunt & Rainham (Kent) where the main station building has barriers but there is a sidegate which is ungated, due to the sidegate being there for disabled access. I presume it is meant to be access controlled with someone showing a ticket [not sure how that would work for Cheshunt with oyster] before the gate is released.

 

[clagmonster]

Nottingham, well. The gates on the middle overbridge are now closed and locked overnight to prevent undesirables from getting in. There will be a lot of unhappy "pay when challenged" otherwise respectable types if they end up locked during the day too.

I agree with the premise of locking it off, but how do they get around it being a public right of way? I don't think you could barrier platform 7 fully, but I often wonder whether you could safely put barriers at the bottom of the stairs to the middle bridge, so as to maintain the right of way and properly maintain revenue.

 

[ChrisC]

Nottingham, well. The gates on the middle overbridge are now closed and locked overnight to prevent undesirables from getting in. There will be a lot of unhappy "pay when challenged" otherwise respectable types if they end up locked during the day too.

I do wonder how much money is being lost through passengers without tickets exiting Nottingham station this way. My experience of travelling into Nottingham on the Robin Hood Line recently has been of no ticket inspections on the train and then, with the train arriving beyond the centre bridge on Platform 1, the vast majority of passengers exit the station that way without passing through any barriers.

 

[LowLevel]

I agree with the premise of locking it off, but how do they get around it being a public right of way? I don't think you could barrier platform 7 fully, but I often wonder whether you could safely put barriers at the bottom of the stairs to the middle bridge, so as to maintain the right of way and properly maintain revenue.

The easiest way, albeit no doubt very unpopular as it punishes everyone equally, would seem to be as people keep objecting to the closure of the public footpath, close it to rail passengers and force everyone to use the main bridge and therefore the ticket gates, and simply have a revenue presence on platform 7. There's usually police on patrol around the concourse to flatten anyone jumping the barriers, job done. I suspect it would make a significant sum.

The gold plated way to do it would be to provide an alternative bridge at the east end for rail passengers.

Whether it will happen who knows but it is no secret that the railway has been trying to find a way to close the middle bridge for many years.

 

[Magdalia]

At some stations step free access is a consideration. Stevenage and Welwyn Garden City both have lifts where, on the footbridge, the lifts are outside the barrier line. Royston only has barriers on the up side: step free access to the down platform is via a narrow and inclined gateway unsuitable for barriers. At Royston this may change when the new footbridge opens, as this has lifts, but most of the car park spaces being on the down side is also a factor.

 

[Mikey C]

Euston Square westbound can be accessed without going through a ticket barrier, if you use the lift provided for step free access. Pretty sure it's the only central London Underground station like this.

 

[londonbridge]

Chorleywood isn’t quite the same, as the Northbound platform is ungated but the subway doesn’t provide access to the Southbound platform which is gated, as the gate at the top of the ramp is ordinarily closed.

This contrasts with the next station down the line, Chalfont & Latimer, where there is an ungated entrance on the Southbound platform, but the station subway offers access to the Southbound platform.

Indeed, I was travelling to Rickmansworth, dozed off and woke up as the train pulled into Corleywood. I wasn’t familiar with the station so went through the subway, up the ramp and found the gate to the southbound platform locked. Turned left and found myself on the street, then found the southbound entrance barriered. I was still tapped in but couldn’t see any staff, and was about to try and jump or crawl under the barriers when a staff member appeared and asked if I was okay, then opened the barrier to let me through after I explained the situation.

 

[Adtrainsam]

Euston Square westbound can be accessed without going through a ticket barrier, if you use the lift provided for step free access. Pretty sure it's the only central London Underground station like this.

The gateline at Euston Square was re-configured a while ago so the lift is inside the barrier now. The only (partly) non-barriered LU station in Zone 1 would be the Waterloo & City line at Waterloo I believe.

 

[Travelmonkey]

west Brompton is one springing to my mind no barriers for the NR lines buy you can easily acsess the district on its platforms. This means the station is partially step free,

 

[TheTallOne]

I just remembered, does Birmingham New Street still have its Subway?
I assume it got sealed off from the public with the refurbishment but it provided access to all platforms and then a lift out to the car park/taxi rank.
Sometimes there'd be someone checking tickets but it seemed to be a thankless task as any time spent dealing with people wouldjust leave others free to enter/exit the lift and sail on by.

Yeah, there’s still a subway for staff movements.

It was open for visitors to look around just before the commonwealth games. Two of the shots are the route to the actual subway and one of the subway itself.

 

[Travelmonkey]

Yeah, there’s still a subway for staff movements.

It was open for visitors to look around just before the commonwealth games. Two of the shots are the route to the actual subway and one of the subway itself.

View attachment 151120 View attachment 151121 View attachment 151119

Looks bit desolate & eeriy,

 

[JJmoogle]

Thanks for that, what a delightful relic, looks exactly the same as when I was last down there.

Looks bit desolate & eeriy,

It did when it was a public part of the station too, I didn't even know it was there for years and years until I discovered it was the easiest way to get somewhere you could smoke whilst waiting for a train.