Why are 57s so loud?

[TheEdge]

This maybe a very stupid question. If it is please ignore it!

My understanding of the 57s is they have a slightly older version of the engine found in 66s. So why, simply, do they seem to be so much louder than the 66s?

Always notice that while 66s passing seem to be relatively quiet, even when powering, 57s are always making a total racket regardless of if they are powering or just idle.

 

[Domh245]

Just my half-asleep musings, but with the 57, they've had to shoehorn an engine into an existing space, whereas with the 66, they could build the loco around the engine. It is more likely then that the 57 installation is more compact, and therefore hotter and in need of more cooling, which in turn would mean larger fan flow-rate and noise.

It may also be age related. Think of a modern car engine and one from a few years prior. The older ones are usually louder for whatever reason, and this may extend to rail engines.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

I always thought they were quieter personally.....

Think you may find 37's, 50's and even 185's to be far noisier than a bodysnatcher!

 

[grumblingalong]

Must agree the 57's on RHTT duties are very loud. Very very loud.

Good PR though you can't miss them ??????

 

[SPADTrap]

Must agree the 57's on RHTT duties are very loud. Very very loud.

Good PR though you can't miss them ��

So good the good folk of Broxbourne demanded them off the West Anglia RHTT because of the noise!

 

[NSEFAN]

So good the good folk of Broxbourne demanded them off the West Anglia RHTT because of the noise!

And so they lost their RHTT and now their train service is compromised?

 

[scott118]

And so they lost their RHTT and now their train service is compromised?

Not quite - it's the Anglia side of AGA that has suffered with the wheel flats, not the west Anglia part. Anglia services are covered by units, working out of Norwich...

 

[SPADTrap]

And so they lost their RHTT and now their train service is compromised?

Replaced with 66s and some noise barriers in the sidings at Broxbourne

 

[sprinterguy]

I'd never considered a class 57 to be particularly loud, especially not compared to, say, a class 66.

It's been mentioned before on this forum that class 57s seem to constantly work at high revs when providing train supply - though clearly on an RHTT this wouldn't be a requirement.

 

[Phil.]

'scuse the ignorance but what is an RHTT?

 

[scott118]

'scuse the ignorance but what is an RHTT?

Rail Head Treatment Train

 

[PYROOGOBBO]

Didn't 57's have the Same Engine as 56's? They both sound rather similar, could be wrong.

Oddly enough talking of age relations, im wondering how a 47 always seemed so quiet to me? seen one or two pass at my local station and they always seemed so quiet.

 

[sprinterguy]

Didn't 57's have the Same Engine as 56's? They both sound rather similar, could be wrong.

No, but (at least some of) the 57s are fitted with reconditioned alternators from class 56 locos (Certainly the 57/0s are). There's barely any similarity between the sound of a 56 and a 57, IMO.

Oddly enough talking of age relations, im wondering how a 47 always seemed so quiet to me? seen one or two pass at my local station and they always seemed so quiet.

They make a heck of a racket taking power at speed, but, yeah, otherwise seem fairly quiet at idle or starting a train.

 

[Ash Bridge]

Didn't 57's have the Same Engine as 56's? They both sound rather similar, could be wrong.

Oddly enough talking of age relations, im wondering how a 47 always seemed so quiet to me? seen one or two pass at my local station and they always seemed so quiet.

No, the class 56 are fitted with a Ruston Paxman 16RK3CT engine whereas the 57's have a reconditioned GM 645? two stroke unit related to the type installed in class 59s.

Edit: must agree with sprinterman about the 47s, example of a perfect place to witness the deafening roar of its Sulzer power unit was Meadowhall Station when one was powering out of Sheffield on a northbound Crosscountry service, earsplitting!

 

[PYROOGOBBO]

No, the class 56 are fitted with a Ruston Paxman 16RK3CT engine whereas the 57's have a reconditioned GM 645? two stroke unit related to the type installed in class 59s.

Edit: must agree with sprinterman about the 47s, example of a perfect place to witness the deafening roar of its Sulzer power unit was Meadowhall Station when one was powering out of Sheffield on a northbound Crosscountry service, earsplitting!

Ah i see . I remember reading something been shared between the two and i noticed both trains seem to like a good old scream which is probably why i thought the two were similar.

I really need to see more loco's *_*.

 

[Phil.]

No, the class 56 are fitted with a Ruston Paxman 16RK3CT engine whereas the 57's have a reconditioned GM 645? two stroke unit related to the type installed in class 59s.

Edit: must agree with sprinterman about the 47s, example of a perfect place to witness the deafening roar of its Sulzer power unit was Meadowhall Station when one was powering out of Sheffield on a northbound Crosscountry service, earsplitting!

"Earsplitting"?
You've never heard a baby Deltic with a heavy load. Now that was earsplitting!

 

[Ash Bridge]

"Earsplitting"?
You've never heard a baby Deltic with a heavy load. Now that was earsplitting!

Would have dearly loved to have seen one in action, was it a similar sound to their much larger and famous brothers?

 

[trac]

Would have dearly loved to have seen one in action, was it a similar sound to their much larger and famous brothers?

You might not have that long to wait...

 

[Ash Bridge]

You might not have that long to wait...

I assume you refer to the project to rebuild 37372, indeed I await to see the end result with great interest

 

[trac]

I assume you refer to the project to rebuild 37372, indeed I await to see the end result with great interest

Not sure how much work is left to be done.

 

[33056]

57s loud? No way.
Irish Rail 071s and Croatian Railways 2044 have the same engine with a Turbo blower and are both far louder and as for the 16 cylinder roots-blown version in the Croatian 2062s and Slovenian 664s, well, bring some ear plugs

 

[Kentish Paul]

Only heard a few 57s and they seem fairly quiet.

Went to see a Deltic leaving Ramsgate on the short lived Saturday Crosscountry service and that was impressive. Actually a Deltic was fairly loud when on idle and totally different to any other diesel power plant thanks to the 18 cylinders and 36 opposed pistons x two.

Don't forget a Valenta powered HST. Nice.

 

[PYROOGOBBO]

Only heard a few 57s and they seem fairly quiet.

Went to see a Deltic leaving Ramsgate on the short lived Saturday Crosscountry service and that was impressive. Actually a Deltic was fairly loud when on idle and totally different to any other diesel power plant thanks to the 18 cylinders and 36 opposed pistons x two.

Don't forget a Valenta powered HST. Nice.

I remember being on a 170 Going past one of the Depots (The one i forget the name of but it's the one outside glasgow queen street) and there was a Deltic with 2 Wagons parked up (Possibly doing a Unit move that day) and i can hear And feel that beautiful rumbling it makes while it's idle, lovely noise.

In terms of loudness, Loudest i've heard was a pair of DRS 37's on Freight going full pelt Past my Local station (It was the occasional freight service going from Fort William to Mossend Yard i believe) while under the small tunnel. sure as hell walked home shaken that day :'D.

 

[Ash Bridge]

Having lived close by the railway here for most of my life, I always found the noisiest of the English Electric classes that used to pass were the 40's with the class 50's a close second (especially doubled up on Anglo Scottish trains) followed by the 37's and 20s, Peak class 45/46's could also make an impressive scream coming up the 1/137 bank from Heaton Norris too.

 

[Phil.]

Would have dearly loved to have seen one in action, was it a similar sound to their much larger and famous brothers?

Nope. Much higher in tone with a true two-stroke engine sound. Think un-silenced two-stroke motorcycle times nine. Whereas you felt the big ones through your body the little ones really went through your head. I've never experienced one but I'm told by people who have that the Crossley two-strokes on the class 28s were similarly noisy.

 

[TheEdge]

Well it seems this query is entirely subjective!

 

[Phil.]

Well it seems this query is entirely subjective!

It certainly is, I've never thought of the 47s as particularly loud.

 

[Kentish Paul]

It certainly is, I've never thought of the 47s as particularly loud.

Quite. I always thought they were virtually silent compared to a 52 on full chat.

 

[Ash Bridge]

Quite. I always thought they were virtually silent compared to a 52 on full chat.

Now we are talking class!

I'm trying not to get too carried away here but...

Did anyone ever see/hear the Western engined Brush class 53 in action?

Phil. Maybe?

 

[Phil.]

Now we are talking class!

I'm trying not to get too carried away here but...

Did anyone ever see/hear the Western engined Brush class 53 in action?

Phil. Maybe?

Yes I did. Although nominally allocated to coal trains in south Wales it occasionally "escaped" to Paddington on relief trains in the summer when a lack of a train heating boiler/ETH wasn't a problem and much of the western main line coaching fleet was air braked (the 53 being train air brake fitted only). Having the same engines as a 52 it sounded the same. I'm told that from a Driver's view it was somewhat "livelier" than either or 47 or 52. It's a pity that mass production was stopped in favour of the 47. The 53's twin engine redundancy equalled a greater chance of getting home after an engine failure plus one could be shut down for light engine moves or on a light train.
What I would like to have heard was one of the Sulzer V engined class 48s.