Why all the violence against the BNP?

[anthony263]

Just been watching the news about the BNP news conference turning violent after some anti facist protesters started throwing eggs and getting violent.

I dont see what is the point of all the violence. In my opinion if the anti facist groups are accusing the bnp of being thugs i think they should take a look at themselves, seing what happened today i think has just lost them some support and given more media coverage to the BNP.

In my opinion it seems like the smaller politcal parties are the only ones that seem to be in touch with the general public and the 3 main parties only seem to want to speak to the public when there is an election.

 

[richa2002]

It's a bit of a failing on free speech's part if the BNP can't at least say what they want to say even if you disagree. That's what a democracy. It would seem the three main parties support these violent protests too.

 

[37401]

well a few years back i joined the young comunist mailing list for a laugh (no way am i one of them!) and ive read some of the stuff they put up and its just a load of c**p have they never heard of free speech

 

[Mojo]

Violence is quite rare - especially when in comparison to the violence the BNP might inflict on citizens of this country should they ever gain power.

 

[djw1981]

also, the BNp seem reluctant to actually debate their policies. They seem more intent on attacking perceived injustices. Thus people who want to debate with them and get a better 'airing' of their policies get frustrated. The same has happened before with Ruth Kelly & John Prescott.

However, as has been mentioned, if you think egg throwing is violence then you should read more about some BNP members actions, and their histories in the National Front, Combat 18 and other groups.

 

[Metroland]

Firstly, I don't have any sympathy with the BNP. I do not agree with their racist and homophobic policies. I do not think the white working class has been marginalised by immigrants, more likely housing policies and educational opportunities as well as the mindset of doing things for yourself rather than letting the state sort out every problem.

However, I do not feel debate should be shut down, these people should be taken on through the power of argument. Egg throwing is not surprising, in some ways violence isn't, given the height of feeling. Nevertheless, I think they should be allowed to speak and taken on rationally and logically.

 

[djw1981]

Hopefully their new platform will allow the public to explore their policies in more detail (hopefully in the next 12 months). 5% of popular vote is thankfully not enough for a seat in the First Past The Post system*.


*unelss there were 21 parties all polling almost equally.

 

[NSEFAN]

I read a little while back on the news about a BNP member who was attacked and injured with a hammer. If you go around blatently supporting a party that basically represents racism and xenophobia, then you are kinda asking for it.

Attacking BNP members is not at all right though. It's disgraceful for people to act like that in our "civilised" country. It has already been rightly said that this is a free country where we are entitled to our own opinions. This means that we have to accept the possibilty that their might be an opposing viewpoint. It seems that some people just can't handle this.

If these protesters are so superior, perhaps they should start acting like it. I hate the BNP, but I don't go and attack their leader out of spite. If you don't like a politcal party, then don't vote for them. Don't sink to their level. As metroland has said, we should allow the BNP viewpoint to speak so that it can be taken on sensibly.

 

[90019]

If there's nothing wrong with supporting the BNP, why was there such a big outcry when the list of people who support them was published?
If they think there's nothing wrong with them, why are they hiding the fact they're associated with them?

 

[berwickspotter]

I support them and i dont hide the fact

 

[RJ]

Even free speech is subject to restrictions. You all do know that it's illegal to publicise defamatory comments, slander and incite racial hatred...

 

[richa2002]

To be honest, I saw what Mr Griffin had to say on BBC Breakfast today and nothing he said was racist. He only has problems with people who don't contribute to society regardless of race. It's not that outrageous to suggest someone who comes to live in this country contributes to society, we're not a charity? Unfortunately though, the BNP does attract skinhead types who are racist and that's why them coming to any position would be horrific.

Let's try and get something good from these two BNP MEPs being elected and let the main political parties know that peope are starting to feel the need to vote for the extreme parties because they're all so practically identical. Can we please go back to the days when Labour were actually left wing and the Tories were right wing so we actually have a choice?!

 

[me123]

This is a racist party. No matter what face they put on it (and beleive me, what you're seeing from them is a front for the real BNP), they are a racist and facist party. Whilst I disagree with plenty of parties, not one of them is as despicable as the BNP. Their councillors have been pathetic in the past, and I have low expectations for the new MEPs.

As much fun as it was to see them being attacked, I don't think it's a good idea. If they can play the "victim" card (which they have been doing), they can use it to gain more support. And of course, as people have already said, assault is illegal. It's not sensible to take them down this way.

 

[Metroland]

The BNP actually have a lot of policies a good deal of people agree with, however there are several things that cause them problems:

1. The British National Party stands for the preservation of the national and ethnic
character of the British people and is wholly opposed to any form of racial
integration between British and non-European peoples. It is therefore committed
to stemming and reversing the tide of non-white immigration and to restoring, by
legal changes, negotiation and consent, the overwhelmingly white makeup of the
British population that existed in Britain prior to 1948

2. The British National Party is pledged to the maintenance of a private-enterprise
economy operating within a broad framework of national economic policy. It is
opposed to international monopoly capitalism and to laissez-faire free trade and
free movement of plant and capital. The British National Party is implacably opposed to
Marxism and liberal-capitalist globalism, which undermine our standard of living,
human and ecological welfare, freedom and national identity.

3. The British National Party represents the collective National, Environmental, Political,
Racial, Folkish, Social, Cultural, Religious and Economic interests of the indigenous
Anglo-Saxon, Celtic and Norse folk communities of Britain and those we regard as
closely related and ethnically assimilated or assimilable aboriginal members of the
European race also resident in Britain. Membership of the BNP is strictly defined
within the terms of, and our members also self define themselves within, the legal
ambit of a defined ‘racial group’ this being ‘Indigenous Caucasian’ and defined ‘ethnic
groups’ emanating from that Race as specified in law in the House of Lords case of
Mandla V Dowell Lee (1983) 1 ALL ER 1062, HL.

http://bnp.org.uk/Constitution 9th Ed Sep 2005.pdf

The definition of racism is:

1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

Therefore 1 and 3 may come under the definition of the above, you decide.

I would suggest 2 gets the capitalists worried, which wouldn't chime well with big business.

 

[yorkie]

I saw the video and couldn't see much in the way of violence, but if it's convictions (including violence) you're looking for, then I think you will find them on the other side...

I support them and i dont hide the fact

Do you agree with this Griffin statement "I am well aware that the orthodox opinion is that six million Jews were gassed and cremated and turned into lampshades. Orthodox opinion also once held that the world is flat ... I have reached the conclusion that the 'extermination' tale is a mixture of Allied wartime propaganda, extremely profitable lie, and latter witch-hysteria"?

 

[Aussie_Rail]

Sounds like a party that's in Australia called 'One Nation', they were considered as racist as they were against the migration of Asian people from South East Asia etc, this was big in the news over 10 years ago, but I think they are still around now, mostly exist up in Queensland.

But at the moment I think its parties like that that will end up changing the way people live, here in Australia we are currently having a few problems with Indian/Pakistani people where by a few of them have been attacked in Victoria and New South Wales and now they are all out roaming the streets in gangs trying to protect each other.

Even the Indian Government has been whinging about it and some Bollywood group has boycotted Australia, not that it worries me as I personally cannot stand it, but its amazing how something quite minor can snow ball into something unbelievable.

Either way, its not good for Australia, we are supposed to be a peaceful, easy going place with good weather and nice people and these Indian folk are trying to convince otherwise by causing trouble. So as you can imagine there are a lot people here that don't have much sympathy for them.

And the bit that really gets up my nose is they had a protest in Melbourne and blocked the busiest intersection in the middle of the City and ended up throwing things at Flinders Street station damaging hundred year old clocks and smashing the stained glass window, for that, the lot of em can go home.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I saw the video and couldn't see much in the way of violence, but if it's convictions (including violence) you're looking for, then I think you will find them on the other side...

Do you agree with this Griffin statement "I am well aware that the orthodox opinion is that six million Jews were gassed and cremated and turned into lampshades. Orthodox opinion also once held that the world is flat ... I have reached the conclusion that the 'extermination' tale is a mixture of Allied wartime propaganda, extremely profitable lie, and latter witch-hysteria"?

Isn't denying the Holocaust a Crime? Or just really bad taste?

 

[Metroland]

I saw the video and couldn't see much in the way of violence, but if it's convictions (including violence) you're looking for, then I think you will find them on the other side...

Do you agree with this Griffin statement "I am well aware that the orthodox opinion is that six million Jews were gassed and cremated and turned into lampshades. Orthodox opinion also once held that the world is flat ... I have reached the conclusion that the 'extermination' tale is a mixture of Allied wartime propaganda, extremely profitable lie, and latter witch-hysteria"?

The more I read about Griffin, the more dangerous I think he is. They are very keen on stuff like Peak Oil (see their website), because they see it as an excuse to get rid of the people they don't like and reduce the population. Which includes 'White scum'. I quote

“the rich are gentically superior to the poor” and that under a BNP government “white working class scum will be eliminated”.

and

'The BNP’s Manifesto contains a number of key points which would help greatly in reducing the
impact of a Peak Oil crisis on Britain, with our plans to encourage population reduction'

http://bnp.org.uk/peakoil/resources/worldwithoutoil.pdf

This is opposed to the Green party, who want to find innovative solutions.

http://policy.greenparty.org.uk/policypointers/pbpeakoilbriefing.pdf

I googled the quote, and he does appear to have made the comment you posted.

Other quotes are:

In 1985 Griffin praised black separatist Louis Farrakhan in Nationalist Today. He said, "White Nationalists everywhere, wish Farrakhan well for we share a common struggle for the same ends: racial separation and racial freedom."

In the Panorama interview, Griffin said, "We haven't given up on our principle that mono racial countries... mono ethnic countries are more stable, it's far easier to preserve human rights and freedom within those whereas multi-racial societies always end up going right down the road of tyranny."

---------

In 1997, Nick Griffin published a booklet entitled "Who are the Mind Benders?". It claimed to prove that Jewish people controlled the British media and thereby were able to brainwash white British people into accepting multiculturalism.

---------

Between 1995 and 1997, Nick Griffin edited 'The Rune'. Griffin referred to the Holocaust as a "Holohoax".

In 1998 Nick Griffin said, "I am well aware that the orthodox opinion is that 6 million Jews were gassed and cremated and turned into lampshades. Orthodox opinion also also once held that the Earth was flat... I have reached the conclusion that the "extermination" tale is a mixture of Allied wartime propaganda, extremely profitable lie, and latter witch-hysteria."

---------

In 1995 Griffin, wrote an article in the Rune. He said, "Mass alien immigration and suicidally low birthrate mean that the White Race is poised on the brink of a precipice of rapid and irreversible decline. If we do not step back now, we face political and then physical extinction. A stark choice. UNITE OR DIE!"

---------

Griffin wrote an article for Spearhead in June 1999 after the Admiral Duncan pub bombing. He said, "The TV footage of dozens of gay demonstrators flaunting their perversions in front of the world's journalists showed just why so many ordinary people find these creatures so repulsive."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/static/in_depth/programmes/2001/bnp_special/the_leader/beliefs.stm

Finally, this is the reason I'm opposed to government spying and huge databases. Could you imagine how dangerous those would be with the BNP in charge?

 

[Mojo]

Thanks for all those tidbits, Metroland, they were very interesting and worrying to read. I would really like to know who supports them, as I've never met anyone in real life who claims to agree with them.

Nick Griffin is a very intelligent man; a History & Law graduate from Cambridge; and the way he speaks to make his cause sound legitimate is in itself quite worrying. I personally do not believe there is such as thing as "political correctness," nor about St George's Day being banned or anything else. If political correctness is trying to ensure all people are treated the same, regardless of any factor they can not choose, such as disability, race or sexuality, then I guess I'm guilty.

 

[gordonthemoron]

surely St George doesn't count as 'British' (or english) under the BNP race rules?

 

[Mojo]

Good point. I've never understood the obsession about people being English, Scottish and Welsh. So many people I know describe themselves as "English," but do people from the US call themselves "Californians" instead of Americans? Slightly different, I know, but IMO England isn't a proper country.

 

[asylumxl]

Majority of the English are infact migrants at some point in history. Damn those Anglo-Saxons! Send them back where they came!

What amuses me further is I know of a number of people in the SW who consider themselves "proper english", yet are majority Irish or Scottish! Where is the logic in that?!

The BNP (Bloody Nazi Party) should have no place in legitimate politics. Unfortunately, it seems that fear mongering is a legitimate campaign strategy for politics nowadays.

Maybe us ethnic types should get busy and multiply and multiply till we become the majority?

 

[Metroland]

I do wonder about the influence of right wing newspapers like the Daily Mail and Sun, with their simplistic headlines based on political correctness (And there is no doubt some rules are silly, but that's not the minorities fault!) have in whipping up hatred against other human beings.

It starts getting dangerous when the misguided start voting for parties like the BNP without really knowing what they stand for and how unrealistic it is to prevent everyone mixing in an age of international communications and travel. There may well be a debate to be had about immigration, but returning Britain to the ethnic state it was in 1948 is fantasy.

It makes me laugh that they claim this idea of intolerance is 'much more stable'. I don't think so, any right minded person knows its wrong, and you only have to look at the war years to see the result of last time fascists were voted in. Only this time we have more weapons to blow the world up several times over.

What is worrying is they got 6.25% of the vote, just 10% behind the party who now form a government.

Griffin may well be intelligent, but he comes from a wealthy background and I dare say he has lots of strange ideas about people the that he views are genetically inferior: Jewish, poor, gay, black, Asian and so on and this needs to be remembered this is nothing more than narrow minded naked hatred and will never be a solution to any of societies problems.

 

[RJ]

I suspect that the majority of people who support them haven't actually read what any of their policies involve. Their superficial public statements are a far cry from what is actually in their manifesto. If they get into power, the UK will go into an economic meltdown tenfold worse than what we're in now and they will make enemies with the wrong people, like the USA. Opting out of the EU is tantamount to diplomatic and economical suicide.

There are always going to be people who can't stand people of different origins for whatever reason and they're entitled to harbour those opinions in their own private environment. Take the racial disintegration that was practised in Zimbabwe by their tyrant leader, and look at the economic state of the place now. Whether you like it or not, there are skilled people out there who are not white, who are needed in this country.

I don't think that people understand the concept of parliamentary sovereignity, which is a potentially perilous thing if the wrong people get into power. If the European Communites Act 1972 is opted out of, those in parliament can make up their own laws which have to be upheld. That can include anything from legalising cocaine use to orders for all working class people being shot on the spot.

To be honest, I saw what Mr Griffin had to say on BBC Breakfast today and nothing he said was racist. He only has problems with people who don't contribute to society regardless of race. It's not that outrageous to suggest someone who comes to live in this country contributes to society, we're not a charity?

Unfortunately, there are many people with this sort of attitude who are willing to believe everything they're told and clearly haven't the foggiest what the BNP stand for. After all, politicians never lie do they?

 

[Geezertronic]

Reading some of these posts, it seems to me that some of you are no better than the people you are complaining about. The last post from Metroland with the attached picture of Holocaust victims is a prime example of the scaremongering the BNP and parties like them are accused of themselves.

Works both ways I am afraid, you have to stop falling into the trap.

 

[richa2002]

Unfortunately, there are many people with this sort of attitude who are willing to believe everything they're told and clearly haven't the foggiest what the BNP stand for. After all, politicians never lie do they?

I was just trying to offer some balance. We may as well not listen to anything any politcian says though if we assume they all lie. Democracy be dead!

After seeing the BNP constitution though, what a farce of a party!

 

[asylumxl]

The last post from Metroland with the attached picture of Holocaust victims is a prime example of the scaremongering the BNP and parties like them are accused of themselves.

Hardly, the photo is contemporary factual documentary evidence of what went on during the Holocaust. Its occurrence is accepted fact.

The BNP has no real evidence to back its claims, it's all purely wild speculation and takes advantage of people's insecurities to suit the parties agenda. That is scaremongering.

 

[Metroland]

Reading some of these posts, it seems to me that some of you are no better than the people you are complaining about. The last post from Metroland with the attached picture of Holocaust victims is a prime example of the scaremongering the BNP and parties like them are accused of themselves.

Works both ways I am afraid, you have to stop falling into the trap.

There's no scaremongering, the quotes were taken from their own documents or respected news sources like the BBC. The Holocaust is something Griffin denies, which says a lot about the sort of man he is and the party he leads. Read their constitution yourself, they don't hide it, its there in black and white! (excuse the pun!)

 

[Geezertronic]

But why do you feel you need to make a big deal about what the BNP are and what they stand for? Surely you realise you are giving them free publicity just like the mainstream politicians do?

The average Joe/Josette will make his/her mind up anyway. Parties such as the National Front didn't last long once their real agenda's were publicy known (hence thei renaming and low(ish) profile). And we don't need members of the UAF denying Nick Griffin his right to speak otherwise how are we expected to form our own opinions in this supposedly democratic country?

 

[RJ]

I support them and i dont hide the fact

Do you mind explaining why? The way I see it, their policies are going to seriously mess up the country.

 

[me123]

I found this video, which strongly suggests that the BNP is a front for an even more sinister agenda.

[youtube]bfwdNAT8sWU[/youtube]

"Instead of talking about racial purity, talk about identity"

To be fair, I don't think most voters agree with them. They claim that they didn't have another choice after the expenses scandal. I don't buy this at all; every ballot paper had more choices than just Labour, Lib Dem, Tory, Green and BNP on it. UKIP is the most prolific non-mainstream party. A Green vote would be worthwhile. Plenty of others as well.