Which buses do you dislike?

[CallySleeper]

This:

Utterly useless, slow, uncomfortable, rattly, hateful piece of crap.
Every Y reg Pointer in the fleet is sh*te, but 183 and 185 are the worst of the ones currently at my depot.

The 52 and 53 plate ones aren't too bad, but the Y reg ones are all crap.

The Y reg Pointers are the only buses I've had so far that trim pieces have fallen off while driving along the road.
They're horrible buses, and the sooner they're scrapped, the better.

I would absolutely have to agree with all of this, however I would probably go as far as say that even the 52 & 53s would also fall into the dump of "horrible rattly uncomfortable metal crapboxes". I don't understand considering their age(!) and condition(!!) why LB have kept them for so long, especially since they are short on singles. Seems to me like all the interest in new buses is in doubles. Why not scrap them and invest in a few more decent singles, of which there are many on parade (thanks TB)? Bad management?

 

[90019]

Why not scrap them and invest in a few more decent singles, of which there are many on parade (thanks TB)?

The Y reg ones should be going at some point this year.
Marine got 5 new Volvos for East Lothian, with another 10 that I think may be out in service this week. Central's about to get the 10 Volvo hybrids too, which I reckon will go out in service at the beginning of March.

 

[Blindtraveler]

Well tgept those 10 new volvos at Marine quiet. Guessing they wil be split between 40, 21 and 42?
How many Y Regs on fleat at all depots and will these plus Hybrids see them off?
Anything else new this year that you know of? As I say they kept these ones quiet

 

[90019]

Well tgept those 10 new volvos at Marine quiet. Guessing they wil be split between 40, 21 and 42?
How many Y Regs on fleat at all depots and will these plus Hybrids see them off?
Anything else new this year that you know of? As I say they kept these ones quiet

I've been told they're to go on the 21, and should be out at the start of February, at which point the rest of the Y reg pointers will move to Central. The Y regs have all just been renumbered over the weekend, too.

The 10 hybrids might get rid of some, but as there's such a shortage of single decks, I'm not sure how long it'll be before they're finally gone.

I'm not currently aware of any more single decks on order.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I'm not currently aware of any more single decks on order.

Apparently 5 more diesel single decks for Marine, on top of the 10 that are about to go out in service.

 

[RJ]

What is the top speed of buses? The Wrightbus Gemini 2 seems to cut out at just over 52mph.

I drove a 4 speed Voith Dennis Trident the other day. I got it up to 65mph and it wanted to keep going, but enough was enough.

I drive 5 speed ZF Dennis Tridents quite often but they're speed limited to 56mph. Driven a Pointer Dart at 56mph too. There's video me driving such a Trident - fast forward to 16:05 and I get to run the bus up to it's maximum speed - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ic2OmGeuXmI

I drove a Scania N94UB (Omnidekka) the other week and at 2200rpm in 4th it was doing 48mph, but it was limited to 50. I bet in 5th it could get up to 70mph+ without any issues.

I frequently drive Volvo Olympians (4 speed ZF) but they've been speed limited to 50/56mph.

The first phase of Volvo B7TL on 5 speed ZF, the one I drove was speed limited to 50mph but holding down the ignition allows the bus to go faster - presumably it could get up to 70mph but there's no way of knowing as the speedo needle freezes.

I understand 3 speed Voith buses reach max revs at around 50mph. I infinitely prefer ZF boxed buses for several reasons.

 

[David Goddard]

Remembered about the absolute worst vehicle I ever travelled on:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/peagreenbus/4654071310/
(see comment I added to the picture)

 

[aylesbury]

Most of the Darts that run in Aylesbury ,jerky ,poor seats ,and they are never clean.

 

[F1Ken]

I travel every day on First Essex's Harwich fleet of Dennis Trident 2 Plaxton Presidents and I love them to bit's.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/80052812@N00/8105660261

Good looking, nice engines. And for reasonably new buses they are quite full of character. We used to have Bristol VRT's

http://www.flickr.com/photos/58143384@N04/6806223261

and we had some brilliant Leyland Olympians which were great.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/21611052@N02/3762471100/

But in all honesty I like the Tridents that cover the 103/104 route now. They do a good job but they are starting to feel the impact of the trees with smashed windscreens and the top left hand corners being smashed completely off in some cases. They now have bars to protect them. Worst bus I have travelled on has to be the horrid Scania's. Nasty things anything with work done by Wright or Scania is bad. I don't mind Alexander Dennis.

There's my little history lesson about my route. Great Route by the way. Perfect windy roads for buses to get there teethe into.

 

[BestWestern]

I travel every day on First Essex's Harwich fleet of Dennis Trident 2 Plaxton Presidents and I love them to bit's.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/80052812@N00/8105660261

Good looking, nice engines. And for reasonably new buses they are quite full of character. We used to have Bristol VRT's

http://www.flickr.com/photos/58143384@N04/6806223261

and we had some brilliant Leyland Olympians which were great.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/21611052@N02/3762471100/

But in all honesty I like the Tridents that cover the 103/104 route now. They do a good job but they are starting to feel the impact of the trees with smashed windscreens and the top left hand corners being smashed completely off in some cases. They now have bars to protect them. Worst bus I have travelled on has to be the horrid Scania's. Nasty things anything with work done by Wright or Scania is bad. I don't mind Alexander Dennis.

There's my little history lesson about my route. Great Route by the way. Perfect windy roads for buses to get there teethe into.

The President is a smart looking body, I always prefer them the Alexander ALX400. But I would imagine yours are probably awful to drive, being ex-London I presume. Most London-spec buses tend to be utterly gutless and completely incapable on provincial hills, as well as being very well used in general.

I'm not a massive fan of Scania products, having had experience of the dreaded OmniCity effort, though I understand the older stuff is better. Wright are usually regarded as one of the best, I always found the Renown on Volvo B10BLE to be a very impressive beast, less so with the newer stuff.

 

[Ivo]

One I didn't add earlier to this thread:

Any of these. A series of roughly ten Dart SLFs sent to Bath from tbtc-land, and has he will agree (and has done before now) they are vile. I recall someone suggesting before that Darts like these were "luxury" - in this example, most definitely not.

Their gearboxes were basically destroyed by Sheffield's hills, leaving them revving high for ages before suddenly jumping (and I mean "jumping") into the next gear, they are terribly uncomfortable - and their interior are very poor. Needless to say, they don't fit Bath at all.

 

[Lewisham2221]

A general consensus that SLF Dart's are a bit crap then! I tend to agree.

 

[Ivo]

A general consensus that SLF Dart's are a bit crap then! I tend to agree.

Most Darts - or rather, Dart SLFs, because Step Darts are not nice vehicles to travel on - aren't too bad. They aren't particularly interesting, but they get the job done with minimal fuss. These ones however should have been sen to scrap a long time ago...

 

[F1Ken]

The President is a smart looking body, I always prefer them the Alexander ALX400. But I would imagine yours are probably awful to drive, being ex-London I presume. Most London-spec buses tend to be utterly gutless and completely incapable on provincial hills, as well as being very well used in general.

I'm not a massive fan of Scania products, having had experience of the dreaded OmniCity effort, though I understand the older stuff is better. Wright are usually regarded as one of the best, I always found the Renown on Volvo B10BLE to be a very impressive beast, less so with the newer stuff.

That's all true yes. Definitely ex London because underneath the white paint is red! The Drivers hate them. I was talking to one today on a older Scania on loan from Clacton because a Trident had broken down. I cheekily remarked "where did you get this thing from then" and he filled me in and said it was really nice to drive and when they drive something half decent it makes the job so much easier. Quite interesting really. Comfort wise it was not good.

The older scania's are okay I was harsh on wright. But I find them plastic and a bit boring. That's not the most important thing though.

 

[Qwerty133]

As well as what I have already said I tend to dislike anything that says 'first' on it 80% of busses that say 'arriva' and most veichles that are between 8-25 years old

 

[bronzeonion]

Scania Omnicity

 

[BestWestern]

Most Darts - or rather, Dart SLFs, because Step Darts are not nice vehicles to travel on - aren't too bad. They aren't particularly interesting, but they get the job done with minimal fuss. These ones however should have been sen to scrap a long time ago...

To take the specifics a bit further, there seems to be a particular issue with the Dart SPD - 'Super Pointer Dart' - which are the super long ones as per both the First and Lothian examples above. Stagecoach have some X-platers down on the south coast and most of their drivers think the gearboxes are awful on those too, ever since they were new.

Any well used Dart will eventually lose the ability to change gear properly, common ailments being revving flat out before slamming hard into the next ratio, or the particularly amusing 'back and forth' scenario where the transmission can't decide which gear to go for, and so jumps in and out constantly until you ease off or floor it (flooring it usually has very little effect however when the bus is that knackered). It isn't just Darts, I've known Tridents to do this too. Ultimately though, it isn't really the fault of the bus but more the fault of operators who won't replace clearly shagged components. Stuff wears out, you either replace it or you struggle with it until it dies completely. It's worth remembering that a Dart is, after all, essentially a light weight 'midibus', so it isn't going to last as well as a full size - and much more expensive - Volvo or similar, which will march on forever.

Scania Omnicity

Awful!

 

[90019]

To take the specifics a bit further, there seems to be a particular issue with the Dart SPD - 'Super Pointer Dart' - which are the super long ones as per both the First and Lothian examples above. Stagecoach have some X-platers down on the south coast and most of their drivers think the gearboxes are awful on those too, ever since they were new.

It seems to mostly be the older ones that are the problem - in the case of Lothian the Y reg ones - but the newer ones are alright.

 

[185]

Hardly a bus, but the Dennis Javelin. Bit noisy, but had much fun over the years with em.

A certain former colleague of mine took one out of gear on the A404 (M40>M4 road) and pushed it from 63mph to 77mph... slight wheel wobble & prop shaft nearly blew up Electrics nearly caught fire too.

Needless to say, I drove back :P

 

[61653 HTAFC]

These things...

Nothing majorly wrong with 'em, they're just a bit dull...

 

[BestWestern]

And really quite ugly!

Also really quite scarce and unregarded, considering it's from the same outfit who sold thousands of Pointer bodies to just about everywhere!

 

[ls2270]

Not a fan of Alexander Dennis (or Dennis before that). Their vehicles always seem so rattly. I remember when Arriva at Guildford got their 58 plate Enviro 200s they were like this even when new! And some older Dart SLFs are unbelievably bone shaking. A ride on a T reg one from Camberley to Guildford on the 34 comes to mind - I felt shaken to bits after an hour on that.
In terms of looks think that a Plaxton Primo has to be one of the ugliest vehicles ever made, run a close second by the Optare Solo SR.
To ride on, though, I like Optare vehicles. Much smoother than the equivalent Alexander Dennis products and with many fewer rattles. I am similarly impressed with Volvo/Wright combinations and Mercedes Citaros which always seem smooth and powerful.

 

[trentside]

Any well used Dart will eventually lose the ability to change gear properly, common ailments being revving flat out before slamming hard into the next ratio, or the particularly amusing 'back and forth' scenario where the transmission can't decide which gear to go for, and so jumps in and out constantly until you ease off or floor it (flooring it usually has very little effect however when the bus is that knackered). It isn't just Darts, I've known Tridents to do this too. Ultimately though, it isn't really the fault of the bus but more the fault of operators who won't replace clearly shagged components. Stuff wears out, you either replace it or you struggle with it until it dies completely. It's worth remembering that a Dart is, after all, essentially a light weight 'midibus', so it isn't going to last as well as a full size - and much more expensive - Volvo or similar, which will march on forever.

This sounds similar to the ex-Lincolnshire RoadCar Dennis Dart SLFs with East Lancashire Spryte bodies that are still used by Stagecoach East Midlands. There aren't too many left now, but the ones that are seem to be being used till they stop working - the earliest two have been withdrawn, reported on the fleet card as having a 'broken chassis'. It's only Scunthorpe depot that continue to operate them in any number, and most of them seem to have gearbox issues. They've definitely had their moneys worth from them!

 

[341o2]

Top of my list are (or were) the AEC Merlins & Swifts introduced late 60's to early 70's. These were the first generation of "off the peg" buses to take advantage of the Bus Grants and were a failure as the RT's they were designed to replace almost outlasted them.

They were longer and wider than anything ever operated before - when the RTW was introduced at 8 feet wide this led to police objections

One man operation with the inability of many passengers to have the correct fare led to delays. This was made worse by an almost total lack of policing regarding obstruction of bus stops and laybys by parked vehicles. This caused delay to other road users when buses were unable to pull into the kerb or layby . Admittedly unfair as this was not the fault of the bus

The SMS class originally had ticket machines and access to the passenger area by turnstile. The unreliability of these machines coupled with the inability of passengers to operate them - such as pushing the turnstile without walking through, eventually they were taken out of use, quicker to have the driver collect all fares.

Lack of seating earned them the nickname of "cattle trucks", on one occasion passengers made farmyard noises until the driver refused to take the bus any further until they stopped.

The next generation of Daimler fleetlines DM/DMS class was little better, within about 5-6 years members of the class were out of service, cannibalised to keep others going, while "old faithful" RT's were sent to garages which had previously finished with the class - route 230 (T garage) had never been RT operated, yet became 100% RT operated 1976/7

 

[34D]

The President is a smart looking body, I always prefer them the Alexander ALX400. But I would imagine yours are probably awful to drive, being ex-London I presume. Most London-spec buses tend to be utterly gutless and completely incapable on provincial hills, as well as being very well used in general.

I'm not a massive fan of Scania products, having had experience of the dreaded OmniCity effort, though I understand the older stuff is better. Wright are usually regarded as one of the best, I always found the Renown on Volvo B10BLE to be a very impressive beast, less so with the newer stuff.

Really omnicities are lovely buses: nice and solid to drive, a comfortable ride for everyone, what is the issue

One I didn't add earlier to this thread:

Any of these. A series of roughly ten Dart SLFs sent to Bath from tbtc-land, and has he will agree (and has done before now) they are vile. I recall someone suggesting before that Darts like these were "luxury" - in this example, most definitely not.

Their gearboxes were basically destroyed by Sheffield's hills, leaving them revving high for ages before suddenly jumping (and I mean "jumping") into the next gear, they are terribly uncomfortable - and their interior are very poor. Needless to say, they don't fit Bath at all.

Allison gearboxes have a life expectancy of between 2 and 3 years typically, so if these buses contain the same gearboxes that were "ruined by sheffield's hills" I would be most surprised.

Not that hills can ruin a gearbox in any case.

 

[RJ]

I don't drive the ones at my depot as I haven't been type trained! The other drivers always complain about them being slow off the mark and they're restricted to 40mph, which isn't great for the jobs I get.

Quite happy to stick with Olympians and N94UDs

 

[Ivo]

In terms of looks think that a Plaxton Primo has to be one of the ugliest vehicles ever made, run a close second by the Optare Solo SR.

The only problem with a Primo is the hard seating. Mind you, I've only been on one, and most won't have said seating

 

[Blindtraveler]

I quite like the premo, and wish ADL and OPtare could do0as well. No reason for it when y6u think about it, seeing as DDL and Plaxton are brothers!

 

[Shrimper]

I have a hatred for the Dennis Tridents at my garage - rattly, leaky with heavy steering and brakes which seem to operate differently to every other bus.

Meanwhile most of out Volvo/Plaxton vehicles are lovely despite being ex-London; most of them still shift

 

[Blindtraveler]

where are you based?

 

[90sWereBetter]

MB Citaro bendy-buses. Bloody awful things! I'm OK with travelling in cattle truck conditions on the Tube, I'm not OK doing it on a bus. And their tendency to catch fire, which scared the bejesus out of me back in 2004, as a nine year old.

Scania Omnicity double deckers are sterile plastic boxes on wheels, and have a horrible ride quality, not helped by the dreadful seats on those run by Stagecoach and London United. Give me an Enviro 400 or Volvo B9 any time of the day.

Locally, First Eastern Counties 43489 (R689DPW) is by far the worst Dennis Dart I have ever come across.

I actually really like Tridents though...