When will there be more Wi-Fi on Trains?

[dojo]

Having to pay in standard on Virgin Trains isn't true, I spent a good hour on facebook in the pendolino's shop coach (not even near 1st class, right?) without paying a penny.

 

[ukrob]

Having to pay in standard on Virgin Trains isn't true, I spent a good hour on facebook in the pendolino's shop coach (not even near 1st class, right?) without paying a penny.

But it hasn't launched officially yet, right?

 

[F Great Eastern]

Hull trains are planning to launch wifi when they refurb their 180's according to what I was told on the service a few weeks ago.

 

[dojo]

But it hasn't launched officially yet, right?

I don't think so - there was nothing saying WiFi was available...but maybe they're just playing it down until they're sure it's all working well or something?

 

[First ScotRail]

Its in Aprils Hotline, however i would expect a wider spread in the May issue on wireless.

It will be very popular especially on the Brum, Man and Liv runs. Glasgow as well i would think will be popular.

 

[Broken Viking]

VT have just launched wi-fi. The official launch date is 1st April, but it is already in use now. Coverage is full London - Birmingham/Manchester/Liverpool/Lancaster then a bit patchy between Lancaster and outer Glasgow, before getting better again.

The Virgin wifi is very good. I'm sending this now from the 1740 Euston - Manchester! I've just been emailing pictures to RAIL and they went through without a hitch. I doubt I'd have been able to do that from NXEC. Virgin's will be free in 1st but there will be charge in Standard.

Just out of curiosity regarding Virgins Wi-Fi: Do the access points in FC allow instant network access without a logon, or do FC passengers have to obtain a complimentary network access code from the on-train staff before connecting?

I'm just curious as to whether the old trick for getting "free" wi-fi from the buffet car on GNER services will also work on the Pendos...
(Although it's worth noting that the chassis on a Pendo does make a fairly effective Faraday cage, and that might inhibit wi-fi range between the buffet and the ajacent FC car. )

If nothing else though, it'll probabally work out cheaper to pay a £5.00 FC upgrade than pay for four hours SC wi-fi on a journey from London to Glasgow! 8)

 

[ukrob]

Just out of curiosity regarding Virgins Wi-Fi: Do the access points in FC allow instant network access without a logon, or do FC passengers have to obtain a complimentary network access code from the on-train staff before connecting?

I'm just curious as to whether the old trick for getting "free" wi-fi from the buffet car on GNER services will also work on the Pendos...
(Although it's worth noting that the chassis on a Pendo does make a fairly effective Faraday cage, and that might inhibit wi-fi range between the buffet and the ajacent FC car. )

If nothing else though, it'll probabally work out cheaper to pay a £5.00 FC upgrade than pay for four hours SC wi-fi on a journey from London to Glasgow! 8)

The shop on a Pendolino is sandwiched in the middle of standard class so I don't see how that trick would work? Or am I missing something?

 

[Broken Viking]

The shop on a Pendolino is sandwiched in the middle of standard class so I don't see how that trick would work? Or am I missing something?

[Googles up a Pendo layout diagram]
Oh, good point! hock: I was thinking of GNER's APT-U's - Where the resturant/buffet served as a divider between FC and SC, and (With the resturant being unclassified) one could legally stand in the vestibule at the FC end with an SC ticket! 8)

Looking at the Pendo diagram though, it'd be a simple matter of standing in one of the vestibules between carriages E and G with a laptop or netbook...Both areas can be used by SC ticket holders, and both should be within range of the wifi AP in carriage G!

 

[ukrob]

[Googles up a Pendo layout diagram]
Oh, good point! hock: I was thinking of GNER's APT-U's - Where the resturant/buffet served as a divider between FC and SC, and (With the resturant being unclassified) one could legally stand in the vestibule at the FC end with an SC ticket! 8)

Looking at the Pendo diagram though, it'd be a simple matter of standing in one of the vestibules between carriages E and G with a laptop or netbook...Both areas can be used by SC ticket holders, and both should be within range of the wifi AP in carriage G!

They may well have directional AP's though pointing inwards from the carriage ends with a wireless signal void in the vestibles between E and G. Thats not to say something with a strong antenna couldn't pick up the signal though.

As a sidenote, I didn't think you could legally stand in a first class vestibule with a standard class ticket - I seem to remember there was a high profile court case last year about this? My brain is telling me a woman on NXEA.

 

[Pumbaa]

They may well have directional AP's though pointing inwards from the carriage ends with a wireless signal void in the vestibles between E and G. Thats not to say something with a strong antenna couldn't pick up the signal though.

As a sidenote, I didn't think you could legally stand in a first class vestibule with a standard class ticket - I seem to remember there was a high profile court case last year about this? My brain is telling me a woman on NXEA.

You remember rightly - Mail reported it I think. She got chinged, appealled but I can't remember if it was overturned or not.

 

[Broken Viking]

As a sidenote, I didn't think you could legally stand in a first class vestibule with a standard class ticket - I seem to remember there was a high profile court case last year about this? My brain is telling me a woman on NXEA.

You remember rightly - Mail reported it I think. She got chinged, appealled but I can't remember if it was overturned or not.

Hang on a min...She got PFd and charged for using a vestibule with an SC ticket? Ye can't honestly class standing accommodation (IE: Vestibule spaces) as FC no matter what "rules and regs" ye try and use to justify it...And what about the usual issue on Pendos when standing passengers have crowded out every single nook and cranny of SC accommodation to three times safe capacity? hock::roll:

I could understand if she'd been taking a seat and/or travelling with a completely invalid ticket...But if VT (Or any TOC for that matter) try taking legitimate passengers to court when they've made reasonable attempts to fit on board the train somehow, then they're going to be finding themselves with a serious amount of negative press.
If ever I find myself on an unreasonably overcrowded service, then I'll be moving to stand in an FC vestibule as well. They can PF me, ching me and charge me all they like...But I'm quite sure Mr. Branson will finally see a little bit of sense if I manage to hold a fast-running Chainsaw blade to his throat!

Anyhow...On a much more pleasant issue - And as something of a white-hat Hacker - I'm going to have to take my netbook with me when I use VT next, and see how well (Or not) the APs in standard class have been secured! 8)

 

[ukrob]

Hang on a min...She got PFd and charged for using a vestibule with an SC ticket? Ye can't honestly class standing accommodation (IE: Vestibule spaces) as FC no matter what "rules and regs" ye try and use to justify it...And what about the usual issue on Pendos when standing passengers have crowded out every single nook and cranny of SC accommodation to three times safe capacity? hock::roll:

She lost her appeal too. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/essex/7404970.stm

 

[Sir_Clagalot]

The whole coach is 1st Class, and the coaches go from Gangway to Gangway... Removed a pax from the far end of FC once who was in the vestibule on a STD ticket!
Yes GC have wifi, and even though I have a 3G modem, I prefer to use the wifi as the connection is more reliable (at the moment).

 

[Royston Vasey]

She lost her appeal too. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/essex/7404970.stm

Going off topic a little, but...

"In this case, the customer was asked to move out of first class and there were in fact seats and standing room available in standard class"

Think by the sound of that sentence there is more to it than the Daily Outrage and the BBC would have you believe. If she's been asked to move to a vacant standard class seat or vestibule and decided to make an issue of it, I haven't got a great deal of sympathy. But twisted right it makes a headline... it's the Daily Mail, telling the full truth isn't what they do.

 

[Broken Viking]

The whole coach is 1st Class, and the coaches go from Gangway to Gangway... Removed a pax from the far end of FC once who was in the vestibule on a STD ticket!

If she's been asked to move to a vacant standard class seat or vestibule and decided to make an issue of it, I haven't got a great deal of sympathy.

Oh...I'd always thought that vestibules were unclassified, especially as SC ticket holders can (IIRC) legally board any part of the train and pass through FC to get to standard if necessary! hock:

Granted: If I'd taken a standing space in an FC vestibule because SC accommodation was badly packed out and overcrowded when I boarded, but then a reasonable amount of space became available in SC at a later stop, I'd normally move back to SC accommodation just to avoid falling foul of a grey area regarding classification.

However - As far as I'm concerned - If the number of passengers in SC is at a level where one cannot comfortably stand and have a bit of safety room (At least 6") around them, then I have every right to stand in any available part of the train wherever space exists. Where that space is found in an FC carriage, then I am still within the limits of fair play and decency provided I do not take a seat or use any other facilities in FC bar the lavatories.

After all, statutory consumer laws relating to transportation services clearly state that every passenger has the right to travel in complete safety and with a basic level of comfort and immediate personal space. Although those same laws do not guarentee passengers a seat or anything like that (On-board WCs aren't a legal requirement either) they do give passengers on any service the right to travel in a comfortable and safe environment. Packed out SC accommodation cannot be regarded as "safe", and TOCs can only deny passengers boarding "because the train is full" if both FC and SC accommodation has been filled to it's safe carrying capacity.

So in short - Even though I will only take FC vestibule space in dire need, and yield it once SC space becomes available - As far as I'm concerned, I and all other passengers have the right to take standing space in FC when reasonably accessible space in SC does not exist. 8)

Farewell...
>> Death <<

 

[First ScotRail]

As I type im onboard the 0940 Glasgow service to Euston. The wireless is fantastic and in my opinion much fater than National Express East Coasts.