When carriage lights fail at night…

[Jurg]

The lights failed on a train I was travelling on in the New York subway a few years ago, as we were passing through the Bronx, and stayed off for a few stops. Judging by the reaction of the other passengers this wasn't a regular occurrence, but it was quite an enjoyable ride as everyone saw the humour in the situation and most spent the entire time talking and laughing with each other. The look on the faces of the passengers waiting on the platform to board, when the doors opened and they were faced with a dark space, was priceless.

 

[edwin_m]

It always seemed quite alarming when the A Stock was entering/leaving Baker Street. Banging and crashing over some fairly rough pointwork and most of the lights went out for a couple of seconds. This is 1980s, not sure if the later refurbishment included anything to keep the lights on.

 

[peterinsurrey]

Happened to me once on the Metropolitan Line. First train of the day Wembley Park onto Uxbridge, so I assume more forgotten than failed:
Made a nice timelapse:

Peter Marsden Cinematographer on Instagram: "Travelling home on dark mornings"

69 likes, 1 comments - petermarsden on January 25, 2020: "Travelling home on dark mornings".

www.instagram.com

 

[bramling]

It always seemed quite alarming when the A Stock was entering/leaving Baker Street. Banging and crashing over some fairly rough pointwork and most of the lights went out for a couple of seconds. This is 1980s, not sure if the later refurbishment included anything to keep the lights on.

No, they were like it to the end - indeed the 72 and 73 stocks still are. 92 stock is the first of the current stocks where lighting stays on constantly.

The modern method is for lighting to be fed from batteries, which themselves are charged when the car is on current. Lights do still go off when cars are off current, however are subject to a timer (something in the region of 15-30 seconds IIRC) so it’s something you won’t normally see unless the car actually stops over a gap and remains there.

 

[greyman42]

I remember travelling from Sheffield to York around 1980 on a cross country service in a carriage without lights. There was snow on the ground which made visibility even better.

 

[Dr_Paul]

I recall in the 80s travelling a long distance in the dark on a Mk2 which involved a stop at Basingstoke (so either a Midlands to Poole service or Waterloo to Exeter?). I really enjoyed the experience, as you could see the various town and country lights much more clearly than one normally would from inside a lit carriage, and it felt a much more relaxing experience. Appreciate not everyone would enjoy it though and that safety these days is considered much more carefully than in the past.

I also liked looking out of the window from an unlit carriage.

 

[Skie]

It always seemed quite alarming when the A Stock was entering/leaving Baker Street. Banging and crashing over some fairly rough pointwork and most of the lights went out for a couple of seconds. This is 1980s, not sure if the later refurbishment included anything to keep the lights on.

Frequent on Merseyrail too with the lack of a bus bar in some units. Iirc there was a project to give them all an interconnect but they didn’t complete it so many units still momentarily go dark in certain locations like Liverpool Central.

 

[Bow Fell]

Frequent on Merseyrail too with the lack of a bus bar in some units. Iirc there was a project to give them all an interconnect but they didn’t complete it so many units still momentarily go dark in certain locations like Liverpool Central.

That’s to do with the MA (Motor Alternator)

On 507’s the lighting is fed from the batteries, so this powers the lights still.

However on 508’s the lighting is fed from the MA so when the MA slows down over pointwork, section gaps, you very briefly lose the lighting.

One of the reasons the train comes out of service with a failed MA apart from being on emergency lighting is the batteries will only last so long before the unit just shuts down completely, you also lose the resistor grid fans, so out of the way and ECS is why this is done, to give it a good run, rather than stop/start.

 

[Bletchleyite]

That’s to do with the MA (Motor Alternator)

On 507’s the lighting is fed from the batteries, so this powers the lights still.

However on 508’s the lighting is fed from the MA so when the MA slows down over pointwork, section gaps, you very briefly lose the lighting.

I wonder why the difference? With 508s being later than 507s, was there an advantage to this?

It does explain why some units lose lights over gaps and some don't - I did wonder.

 

[4COR]

Remember returning from Folkestone to London fast service in the days of slam door and sitting in a compartment with failed lighting - a glorious, crisp, clear winter evening around dusk. Super!

 

[Western 52]

Preserved railways also get their lighting failures particularly on Mk1 stock when low speeds mean the dynamos don't sufficiently charge the batteries. I remember trying to clean carriages after December Santa trains by torchlight as the batteries were flat! I think some railways have modified the dynamos to charge at lower speeds.

 

[Bow Fell]

I wonder why the difference? With 508s being later than 507s, was there an advantage to this?

It does explain why some units lose lights over gaps and some don't - I did wonder.

And when I say lost the lighting, sorry, I mean the unit goes on emergency lighting.

 

[bramling]

That’s to do with the MA (Motor Alternator)

On 507’s the lighting is fed from the batteries, so this powers the lights still.

However on 508’s the lighting is fed from the MA so when the MA slows down over pointwork, section gaps, you very briefly lose the lighting.

One of the reasons the train comes out of service with a failed MA apart from being on emergency lighting is the batteries will only last so long before the unit just shuts down completely, you also lose the resistor grid fans, so out of the way and ECS is why this is done, to give it a good run, rather than stop/start.

One reason why the control attitude of “as long as the train is moving” isn’t always the best one.

I can think of an occasion when a train had defective auxiliaries, it was kept in service as no one understood the implications, and eventually failed in a very inconvenient place when the batteries drained.

 

[EveningStar]

Many years ago, Liverpool to Leeds in a crowded TSO early mark 2 without lights. Entering Standedge Tunnel, in pitch darkness rowdy group of lads further up the carriage got rowdier until there was a sudden crash, then silence until we emerged into the light at Marsden. To this day am sure there was one less rowdy lad then when we went into the tunnel ...

 

[miami]

Happened to me once on the Metropolitan Line. First train of the day Wembley Park onto Uxbridge, so I assume more forgotten than failed:

Shortly after moving to London in 2003, I had this on the Victoria line, I think from Oxforc Circus to Green Park. Lights were fine as far as Oxford Circus, then they were all turned off (entire train seemed to be turned off), then we set off (pretty full train) south in pitch black. Before the days of video phones, but a fair few screens were lit up. In true British fashion nobody said a word. Arrived at Green Park, after a minute or so they lights came on, and we continued on our way.

 

[Peter Wilde]

A long time ago I commuted for a couple of years from Crowhurst to London on Hastings DEMUs. When one of the 2 power cars in the 6 car unit failed, all lights went out in the 3 cars supplied from that end. This happened to me a couple of times. People mostly remained sitting where they were, though they did have the option of moving to the other 3 cars. Not a bad experience, watching the darkened countryside go by, despite the train being much slower to complete the rest of the journey with only one engine running. Guess it would not be such a happy experience for anyone feeling vulnerable though.

 

[Trackman]

It always seemed quite alarming when the A Stock was entering/leaving Baker Street. Banging and crashing over some fairly rough pointwork and most of the lights went out for a couple of seconds. This is 1980s, not sure if the later refurbishment included anything to keep the lights on.

I remember this too, there were some 'hot spots'.
Thing was they didnt dim or anything it was a case of everything off in a split second.

 

[thaitransit]

I prefer the lights off too as you can see out better and on regional routes that means spectacular million star views of the night sky.

Western Queensland routes are great for this as after 9pm they switch off the carriage lights to make sleeping easier on these very long overnight trips. Also as there is zero mobile reception on most of those Western Queensland routes. the phones stay in there pockets. thus near total darkness and excellent night views.

For me there are bigger issues than failed lights on a train such as broken toilets and broken air-conditioning. had more than my fair share of sauna like trips on trains and coaches especially when its in the low to mid 40s outside!