What would you do?

[Anon Mouse]

A family group of two adults and two children board at a major station travelling home to an unstaffed station. On the outward journey from the unstaffed station they claimed the Guard did not come down (plausable due to a sporting event en route). However dispite walking past ticket issuing facilites upon exit from the major station and upon returing to the major station for the return journey they boarded the train expecting to get CDR's on a FAM railcard. They claimed that they always use the Railcard on the train and that by informing me they travelled on a train where no Guard came down that they were being honest in claiming this fact.

What ticket would the Guards & Revenue staff on here issue?

For the record I followed ATOC & my TOC's policy and sold undiscounted SDS tickets which led to a bit of 'feedback' and obscene jestures as the train passed them at their destination station.

 

[MikeWh]

Seems the correct decision to me. My only doubt would be if the only ticket issuing facilities were a TVM which couldn't sell the exact ticket that they needed/used. But if it was a staffed ticket office then they've no complaints.

 

[wintonian]

A family group of two adults and two children board at a major station travelling home to an unstaffed station. On the outward journey from the unstaffed station they claimed the Guard did not come down (plausable due to a sporting event en route). However dispite walking past ticket issuing facilites upon exit from the major station and upon returing to the major station for the return journey they boarded the train expecting to get CDR's on a FAM railcard. They claimed that they always use the Railcard on the train and that by informing me they travelled on a train where no Guard came down that they were being honest in claiming this fact.

What ticket would the Guards & Revenue staff on here issue?

For the record I followed ATOC & my TOC's policy and sold undiscounted SDS tickets which led to a bit of 'feedback' and obscene jestures as the train passed them at their destination station.

Ok I'm not staff but as a passenger:

How much were the tickets discounted/ undiscounted?

In any case that seems fair to me along with polite advice that as a guard you are only permitted to sell discounted tickets if there was no opportunity to buy before boarding, hence if they don't see the guard on the first train then they should buy when they get off the train.

 

[island]

Seems entirely reasonable, especially considering they could have gone to the booking office before their return train and bought discounted singles instead of paying the CDR.

 

[Anon Mouse]

Seems the correct decision to me. My only doubt would be if the only ticket issuing facilities were a TVM which couldn't sell the exact ticket that they needed/used. But if it was a staffed ticket office then they've no complaints.

They boarded at a very busy mainline station with TVM's and a huge open ticket office!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Ok I'm not staff but as a passenger:

How much were the tickets discounted/ undiscounted?

In any case that seems fair to me along with polite advice that as a guard you are only permitted to sell discounted tickets if there was no opportunity to buy before boarding, hence if they don't see the guard on the first train then they should buy when they get off the train.

The difference in fares were quite high due to the CDR's on that route being much lower than the ordinary SDS & SDR fares. However they had ample opportunity to buy desired tickets before they boarded my train
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Seems entirely reasonable, especially considering they could have gone to the booking office before their return train and bought discounted singles instead of paying the CDR.

Cheers, this was the advice I gave them

 

[yorkie]

You did the right thing, and their abuse at the end demonstrates that they did not deserve to be treated leniently or be shown discretion.

 

[Anon Mouse]

You did the right thing, and their abuse at the end demonstrates that they did not deserve to be treated leniently or be shown discretion.

Exactly and in anticipation of their complaint I informed Control about the situation and advised them to check the CCTV at their station!

 

[clagmonster]

I think there is actually a very strong case for an undiscounted SDR (rather than SDS), issued from the original origin so the right way around, so as to cover for the outward journey they have previously used but not paid for.

I don't think the TVMs at the major station make a difference as they can't issue tickets from the home station, but the ticket office makes the difference as it can issue said ticket the right way round.

 

[Greenback]

Clearly they should have gone to the ticket office and bought their tickets either when they got off the first train, or before getting on the one to go home.

Though in fairness, since the probably only use their railcards when travelling from the unstaffed station, they may have thought it was quite acceptable to get tickets on the train.

 

[4SRKT]

Very amateurish fare dodging IMHO. Having got a freebie on the outward journey, they should have counted their blessings and bought discounted singles for the return. They got greedy, and greed has its consequences it seems.

 

[Flamingo]

You did right, if your manager has a pair you should hear no more about it.

 

[Anon Mouse]

I don't belive it, same shift as last week and the same senario twice!

the first group accepted CDS and FAM could not be sold onboard and paid the correct fare, the second group kicked off and wound up leaving at the next stop on their own accord without paying anything at all! The disputed everything I said, told me I did not know my job and demaned to see "the rulebook which says they cant use the FAM onboard". Even when I produced the poster onboard stating discounted tickets cannot be bought onboard the still disputed this saying they were going to report me. They were awful to me, aggresive and rude yet were adamant I was "trying to rip them off". Anyway hey ho, usual Saturday shennanagans!

 

[WestCoast]

I see the "buy before you board" for the cheaper tickets message still isn't getting through. The thing is, on a certain TOC that operates local services across the North of England, discounted tickets would often be sold in this situation, using the old "paytrain" model.

 

[Anon Mouse]

I see the "buy before you board" for the cheaper tickets message still isn't getting through. The thing is, on a certain TOC that operates local services across the North of England, discounted tickets would often be sold in this situation.

Well, some of my collegues sell the CDR's and give railcard discounts to save aggro which makes some passengers think they are right and those doing tickets as per ATOC stipulation are wrong. (without knocking those who chose to sell them as its their train and their discretion)

 

[BestWestern]

To be honest a lot of this dispute depends on where people are used to travelling, and where they might be travelling on this particular day. I, and most of my colleagues, sell CDR's etc as a matter of course, despite operating largely within an alleged PF area. This is standard practise, officially or otherwise, and any customer who was told they couldn't have an off-peak ticket onboard would be likely to feel short changed. With TVM's which are known as being highly unreliable and no way of knowing what is or isn't happening at the booking office (without making tedious phone calls every 5 minutes), the options are very limited indeed. This is not an ideal situation, but as some TOC's are woefully poor at their revenue collection & protection, there are some areas where it is generally seen as acceptable. If one of these generally fairly honest customers was to travel further afield and use somebody else's trains, they could quite easily assume that the same policy applies elsewhere. Keep in mind that most passengers have more interesting things to read than a copy of the NRCoC!

Having said all of that, I'd clarify that I too would consider the OP's actions to be perfectly fair, and would agree that a two-fingered salute (particularly from people who have children in their 'care') verifies that any discretion would have been undeserved!

 

[Greenback]

I also agree that the Op has acted correctly, but the inconsistency across the system does not help to manage customer expectations.

 

[185]

Sometimes using the pre departure announcement a good minute before departure is a back covering exercise, "told ya so".