What should I do after get caught by avoid pay full ticket?

[122elaine]

This happened on 07/14/2024.

My route was from Oxford Parkway to Marylebone and back on the same day with Chiltern Railway.
I am really stupid enough for only pay the return ticket from oxford to bicester, and Wembley statium to London Marylebone.
The ticket officer caught me in the Marylebone station for trying to lie about where I start my journey. I said I am willing to pay the fine or any charges immediately. But he took pictures of my ID and ask me to go home and wait for the results. And he didn't give my return ticket back, I was too nervous and forgot to ask about my return ticket at all.

In the evening, When I backed to the Marylebone station and asked the infromation desk about if I can get my return ticket back, since in this way I dont need to pay the second time for the 'London Marylebone to Wembley stadium' and 'bicester to oxford parkway' ticket, and that 'information people' said I was trying to steal money from them. Surely, I wont make the same mistakes again, but I guess he thought I will. And I paid the full journey(from Marylebone to oxford parkway) price as he asked, since I dont want to get into more trouble. I am worried if this information officer will say somethingt to the officer who caught me in the daytime tomorrow, and this might affect my investigation result.

My questions are:

1. Will I receive a criminal record, or will I just need to pay a fine if I receive one later?
2. Will this affect my immigration application?
3. If I receive a fine, will I only need to pay £50 plus the full price of my journey if I pay within 21 days?

I would really appreciate any comments and help with these questions.

Many thanks

 

[Hadders]

Welcome to the forum!

What you've done here is called doughnutting - buying short distance tickets to get through the barriers at each end of your journey but leaving a gaping gap in the middle. The inspector was right to take your ticket off you as it was not valid for travel.

As for what happens next Chiltern's Prosecutions Department, or a company called Transport Investigations Limited who they often use to carry out some of their work, will write to you. The letter will typically take a couple of months to arrive but can be sooner although it shouldn't take longer than six months. The letter will use quite threatening language and say that they have received a report, are considering prosecuting you and asking for your version of events before deciding how to proceed. It is important that you engage with and reply to this letter. You might want to include the following in your reply:

- That you are sorry for what has happened
- What you have learned from the incident
- That you are keen to settle the matter without the need for court action
- Offer to pay the outstanding fare and the train company's administrative costs in dealing with the matter

Chiltern/TIL are usually prepared to offer an administrative settlement (commonly known as an out of court settlement) to people who engage with the process and who haven't come to their attention before. We cannot guarantee this and Chiltern/TIL are within their rights to prosecute you in the magistrates court if they want to.

Be aware that Chiltern/TIL will research your online ticket purchase history and if this shows frequent purchases of tickets to enable doughnutting then they will almost certainly want to ask you about these cases as well.

If you are offered a settlement expect to have to pay the outstanding fares at the full Anytime rate with no credit given for the invalid tickets you did purchase. You will also have to pay an admin fee, typically around £150, to reflect Chiltern/TIL's costs in dealing with your case. You will need to be in a position to pay the settlement in full within a few days of it being offered - they will not allow payment in installments. An out of court settlement might appear to be a fine, but it isn't and you won't have a criminal record as a result of accepting one.

Feel free to post a copy of the letter once it arrives (with personal details redacted) along with your draft reply in this thread and forum members will be happy to proof read it for you.

 

[122elaine]

Thank you very much for the reply, It is really helpful. I will update all the information I have on time.

 

[island]

This happened on 07/14/2024.

When communicating with the railway I would not recommend writing the date in the American format; you are in the UK so it should be written with the day before the month.

My questions are:

1. Will I receive a criminal record, or will I just need to pay a fine if I receive one later?

If you are taken the court and convicted, either because you pleaded guilty or a case is proven against you, you will receive a fine and, depending on what you are charged with, a criminal record.

Only a court can issue a fine.

As Hadders mentions above, the more likely outcome is an out of court settlement. I shall not repeat his excellent advice.

2. Will this affect my immigration application?

By law, only certain qualified and licensed people can give immigration advice. As such, we cannot answer this.

3. If I receive a fine, will I only need to pay £50 plus the full price of my journey if I pay within 21 days?

No. You are describing a Penalty Fare, which is a resolution sometimes offered where a passenger has mistakenly paid the wrong fare. You have clearly been intentionally avoiding your fare by only paying for tickets to get through ticket gates, which is a serious matter. You will have a lot more to pay than £50.

 

[AlterEgo]

It is worth mentioning the train company may audit your ticket purchasing accounts to see how many times you have perpetrated this ruse before, and you may be asked to pay more fares back if they detect other offences.

 

[John R]

It is worth mentioning the train company may audit your ticket purchasing accounts to see how many times you have perpetrated this ruse before, and you may be asked to pay more fares back if they detect other offences.

And just to add to this point and reiterate that made by @Hadders, if they do find other instances on your account, they are likely to ask for £79.60 for each return journey, being twice the Anytime Single fare for your journey.

Only you will know how many times you have done this, but if it adds up to a substantial sum then you would be best advised to work out how you might have the funds available to pay them quickly, as any settlement offer will usually need to be paid within 14 days to avoid prosecution.

 

[122elaine]

Thank you for mention that, I am trying to calculate how much money I need to prepare in advance.
Regarding to audit my ticket purchasing history, do they have access to all the railway company or just chiltern railway? Since I noticed that I have one trip to somewhere but with two companies.

Any suggestions will be appreciated!

 

[CyrusWuff]

Thank you for mention that, I am trying to calculate how much money I need to prepare in advance.
Regarding to audit my ticket purchasing history, do they have access to all the railway company or just chiltern railway? Since I noticed that I have one trip to somewhere but with two companies.

Any suggestions will be appreciated!

The usual process would be that they'll ask whichever company runs the booking site you used to buy the ticket you were stopped with.

Whilst they could ask other companies as well, it would be hard for them to justify doing so.

 

[30907]

Thank you for mention that, I am trying to calculate how much money I need to prepare in advance.
Regarding to audit my ticket purchasing history, do they have access to all the railway company or just chiltern railway? Since I noticed that I have one trip to somewhere but with two companies.

Yes, they can ask about travel on any train company, but they won't ask every possible ticket retailer.

 

[122elaine]

Yes, they can ask about travel on any train company, but they won't ask every possible ticket retailer.

Thank you so much everyone, I didn't expect those useful information in one day. I will prepare money for this trip anyway. Many thanks again.

 

[122elaine]

Hello,

I recently received an email offering a £214.80 out-of-court settlement for an incident that occurred last July, over six months ago. I would like to know if it’s possible to negotiate a reduction in this amount. Alternatively, is it an option to ignore this email without further consequences?

Thank you for your assistance

 

[notmyrealname]

Hi.

Could you show us what the email says please?

 

[island]

Hello,

I recently received an email offering a £214.80 out-of-court settlement for an incident that occurred last July, over six months ago. I would like to know if it’s possible to negotiate a reduction in this amount. Alternatively, is it an option to ignore this email without further consequences?

Thank you for your assistance

If you have not received a summons or single justice procedure notice indicating that the matter has been taken to court, then it is too late for Chiltern to prosecute you for this offence. There is therefore no reason why you should pay any out of court settlement. Chiltern have messed up: they've taken too long.

 

[122elaine]

Here is the email:

STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL​

Good Afternoon

Thank you for your e-mail.

It is always the travellers' responsibility to make sure they have a valid ticket for travel, before boarding any train where pre-purchase facilities are available for the traveller to do so. Where pre-purchase facilities are not available and any person boards a train without a valid ticket, it is always the responsibility of that passenger to declare the journey to on train staff and pay the fare due immediately on boarding any train.


Following your contact with this office, this matter has been passed to me for a final assessment before proceeding to prosecution. We assessed this report and found sufficient evidence to continue to prosecution and the company sees no reason to alter that opinion. We have reviewed this matter in light of your representations and because there is no previously reported incident of a similar nature on file in your name, I am authorised to allow a final opportunity to resolve this matter by way of an administrative disposal. I recognise that a conviction might have a detrimental and perhaps disproportionate effect on your future.


Having reassessed this file, I am satisfied that if the sum of £214.80 is paid and cleared within 14 days of the date of this e-mail, this case can be discontinued. This sum includes the unpaid fare(s) and the full costs involved with the administration of this case incurred in its recovery. This amount is non-negotiable as it is entirely in your favour.


The sum quoted is a properly costed assessment of the average amount of time and cost needed to properly process a typical case of this kind and is not intended to represent a punitive sum. This is not a fine, a fine is something that a court will impose, nor is this a demand for payment, it is an offer to allow you to adopt an alternative arrangement, that allows you to avoid court proceedings. We are not obliged to make this offer and you are not obliged to make any payment and you may instead choose to have the evidence tested by the court, if you prefer.


Should you wish to take this opportunity, you can pay on-line by typing www.ircas.co.uk/findprosecution/index/4 into a browser and follow the instructions on screen.


Once payment has been made, the file will be marked to show that a final written warning has been given to the effect that a valid ticket must be held for all future journeys where pre-purchase facilities are available.


Should you fail to make this payment then the matter will proceed as previously advised.

Kind Regards,

Economic Crime & Fraud Unit

Download our free real time information and ticket purchase app here.
http://twitter.com/ChilternRailway

Please consider the environment before printing this email


CONFIDENTIAL
The information contained in this email and any attachment is confidential. It is intended only for the named addressee(s). If you are not the named addressee please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose, copy or distribute the contents to any other person other than the intended addressee(s) without the prior written consent of Chiltern Railways.
Chiltern Railways is the trading name of The Chiltern Railway Company Limited. Registered office: 1 Admiral Way, Doxford International Business Park, Sunderland, England. SR3 3XP. Company No: 3007939.

 

[tonycockram]

Lucky you! Looks like they are out of time to take you to court and it looks like you have got away with it. I dare say children will chase you a few more times but they cannot take you to court for this in a criminal respect. It looks like they haven’t researched other journeys under your name so it might be uk to you if it makes sense to pay this to clear your name and hopefully stop them doing further investigations into previous doughnutted trips ….

 

[WesternLancer]

Does the prospect of debt collection via the civil court remain? In case the op needs to weigh that up.

 

[island]

Does the prospect of debt collection via the civil court remain? In case the op needs to weigh that up.

Theoretically yes, but we rarely if ever observe TOCs going down this route.

 

[122elaine]

Hello All,

I tried to click the link to pay it.

It shows they cannot accept payment.

 

[Spaceship323]

Hello,

I recently received an email offering a £214.80 out-of-court settlement for an incident that occurred last July, over six months ago. I would like to know if it’s possible to negotiate a reduction in this amount. Alternatively, is it an option to ignore this email without further consequences?

Thank you for your assistance

When you say recently what is the exact date you received the email? (we know the offence happened 14th July)

 

[tonycockram]

Maybe they’ve already sent it to the court? Might need to call that number on Monday to find out the status of the case.

 

[122elaine]

When you say recently what is the exact date you received the email? (we know the offence happened 14th July)

today

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 9 Feb 2025 ==

Maybe they’ve already sent it to the court? Might need to call that number on Monday to find out the status of the case.

But I just recieved the out court settlement email, they should wait 14 days, is that right?

 

[tonycockram]

Just call them on Monday and hopefully they can explain. I expect it’s a ‘computer error’

 

[Spaceship323]

Or don't call them and don't pay them any money....they are out of time to prosecute you, their six months is up

 

[Haywain]

today

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 9 Feb 2025 ==


But I just recieved the out court settlement email, they should wait 14 days, is that right?

No, there is no obligation for them to wait.

 

[WesternLancer]

Maybe they’ve already sent it to the court? Might need to call that number on Monday to find out the status of the case.

And it might work on Monday.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 9 Feb 2025 ==

Theoretically yes, but we rarely if ever observe TOCs going down this route.

Agree tho I’m mindful of a recent South Western Railway case on here and suggestion by informed staff that this is starting to happen by other rail operators. Agree we’ve not seen many people come here seeking help about it.

 

[island]

today

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 9 Feb 2025 ==


But I just recieved the out court settlement email, they should wait 14 days, is that right?

You do not need to pay them anything, they are too late to prosecute you.

 

[voyagerdude220]

I dare say children will chase you

That's an unfortunate auto correct.

 

[tonycockram]

That's an unfortunate auto correct.

Wow, yes. Chiltern! Hahaha

 

[122elaine]

That's an unfortunate auto correct.

What does this auto correct means?

 

[AlterEgo]

What does this auto correct means?

It is the function on your phone which automatically corrects the spelling of words.