What is first class for?

[Blamethrower]

"Class" in the wider sense has nothing to do with status/wealth but almost everything to do with behaviour and attitude.

In your opinion.

It is actually related to all those things, only where it suits the person who is "judging" does it relate to just one of those things.

Active discrimination by the British, you can choose whichever one applies to you and discriminate until you find something where you feel above the other person or people.

 

[JohnB57]

"Class" in the wider sense has nothing to do with status/wealth but almost everything to do with behaviour and attitude.

Classy. I wish I'd said that.

In your opinion.

It is actually related to all those things, only where it suits the person who is "judging" does it relate to just one of those things.

Forget tradition and practice. In 2016, true "class" is exhibited by people who put their own interests and safety second to those who need their help, usually for very little reward or recognition.

It's sad that wealth is still, by some, considered to contribute to a person's status or importance in this world. Donald Trump anyone?

 

[Master29]

Classy. I wish I'd said that.


Forget tradition and practice. In 2016, true "class" is exhibited by people who put their own interests and safety second to those who need their help, usually for very little reward or recognition.

It's sad that wealth is still, by some, considered to contribute to a person's status or importance in this world. Donald Trump anyone?

I think Blamethrower was talking about the class system in general which very much does exist and not about the nature of the individual.

 

[AlterEgo]

That'll go down particularly well with the St Albans to Farrington / City Thameslink / Blackfriars bunch

Chiltern did it when they took over NSE in their area, with the Gerrards Cross/Amersham/Princes Risborough bunch....

 

[Butts]

First Class exists for ex BR staff holding All Stations and by Ships Passes!

Well, not really but it does come in handy some times. My local services have no First Class so it doesn't apply to me getting to London but for longer, private, journeys I use it.

Back in BR days there were some rather silly restrictions applied to who could use what kind of pass when in which class. I remember being allowed to travel on the 17:00 Liverpool St - Norwich in First with my pass, my wife and two children who were using First cards where you filled in the date couldn't because it was restricted. This resulted in me being in First with my dog and the wife and children being in Standard. That went down well!

I love it, at least you got your priorities right - Dog in 1st Class

I have just returned from a couple of 1st Class journeys on Virgin West Coast from Edinburgh to Sandwell & Dudley and back which I purchased in the recent Sale at £30 a pop. (I normally fly EDI or GLA to BHX).

For my £30 I got lounge access at EDB (Times, Biccies, Crisps, Brew). On board I had a Bacon Roll , Coffee, OJ and then after Preston Lunch. Sandwich,Crisps,Cake , Coffee , Scotch. This is the best sort of journey where you get " 2 offerings" ie B'fast and Lunch. Coming back it was just the full English, Toast, Croissants, OJ, Coffee etc and a Times.

Being a freeloader I am not the intended target for 1st Class and would no way pay a fare in the hundreds - thanks to those of you who do

Another amazing fact is the saps who sit in their "relatively crowded" 1st Class carriage seats to which they are allocated. I always head straight for J or whichever carriage contains the Kitchen as this is unreserved and often empty. You also get better service and "extras" as long as you don't mind the crew yapping.

 

[Deepgreen]

In your opinion.

It is actually related to all those things, only where it suits the person who is "judging" does it relate to just one of those things.

Active discrimination by the British, you can choose whichever one applies to you and discriminate until you find something where you feel above the other person or people.

I was referring to "class" not in the 'British Class System' sense, but, the wider sense of the word.

 

[fowler9]

These issues are more down to the bad layout of the stock than the presence of 1st class.

How much seating capacity is wasted on TP stock courtesy of it being suburban 1/3 2/3 layout in the first place? Then there is the small matter of the stock being inadequate 3 car units from the day they were introduced, replacing higher capacity 3 car 158s.

If you really want to play the space v use game then we should rip out all the disabled toilets and fill the empty spaces reserved for wheelchairs with seats, the occupation rate for these is far lower than even a 1st class seat.

Yeah sorry mate, you are correct, it is more down to poor layout and indeed, the 185's were not particularly suitable when they were introduced and are less so now. All that will of course be changing.

 

[Agent_c]

I should have thought the answer to the thread title was easy answered. First class is for those who want to buy a first class ticket. It is not standard class overflow.

 

[Mordac]

Yeah sorry mate, you are correct, it is more down to poor layout and indeed, the 185's were not particularly suitable when they were introduced and are less so now. All that will of course be changing.

Other than being too short, and that first class could probably be better placed at the end of a coach rather than the middle, what is wrong with their layout? The coaches without first class seem pretty well laid out to me.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I should have thought the answer to the thread title was easy answered. First class is for those who want to buy a first class ticket. It is not standard class overflow.

How very well put.

 

[Flamingo]

I should have thought the answer to the thread title was easy answered. First class is for those who want to buy a first class ticket. It is not standard class overflow.

Very well put.

First Class on the railway is very egalitarian. Anybody can travel in First Class, regardless of age, income, race, gender, occupation, sexual orientation, dress, religion, political belief, nationality, disability, education level or social class.

All they have to do is buy a First Class ticket.

 

[Mag_seven]

Many 1st class passengers are students and pensioners not just the stereotypical business man on expenses.

 

[fowler9]

Other than being too short, and that first class could probably be better placed at the end of a coach rather than the middle, what is wrong with their layout? The coaches without first class seem pretty well laid out to me.

Because they are too short the positioning of the first class and the size of the disabled access area takes up a hell of a lot of space. First class could possibly have been smaller and right at the other end of the train.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Many 1st class passengers are students and pensioners not just the stereotypical business man on expenses.

Every time that we have travelled in first class on the Class 185 units, especially on the Manchester Airport to Durham part of the Newcastle service, before they decided to play silly beggars with this service and shunted it off to Liverpool instead, the first class compartment was occupied by "stereotypical business types" (as I once was myself before retirement).

Incidentally, it may be worth reporting that my good lady wife used to travel on a bi-monthly basis to Durham in the same first class accommodation during her term of office as chairperson of a certain organisation for a period of some years. She found that particular train section ideal for a perusal of her minutes and to make last-minute notes.

 

[anti-pacer]

Every time that we have travelled in first class on the Class 185 units, especially on the Manchester Airport to Durham part of the Newcastle service, before they decided to play silly beggars with this service and shunted it off to Liverpool instead, the first class compartment was occupied by "stereotypical business types" (as I once was myself before retirement).

Incidentally, it may be worth reporting that my good lady wife used to travel on a bi-monthly basis to Durham in the same first class accommodation during her term of office as chairperson of a certain organisation for a period of some years. She found that particular train section ideal for a perusal of her minutes and to make last-minute notes.

Damn those Scousers gaining a direct service to the North East.

 

[fowler9]

Damn those Scousers gaining a direct service to the North East.

Paul can have his service back, the Geordie stag and hen parties get here too easily now (They probably say the same about us).

 

[Butts]

Damn those Scousers gaining a direct service to the North East.

Quicker escape after they have "been on the rob"

 

[fowler9]

Quicker escape after they have "been on the rob"

Watch it or I'll send Steven French round!

 

[LowLevel]

If the train is full and you want to sit down in first class you have the absolute discretion to pay the extra to upgrade and do so like the other occupants. Otherwise just forget any such carriages exist. London commuter area people who choose to use Intercity trains are buggers for whingeing about not being allowed in first class but won't pay the upgrade - they want it gratis.

The exception being in serious service disruption (IE catastrophic, wires down, flooding etc etc) where you need to pack as many people in as possible to get them moving. If I worked trains with first class that's the only time you'd find it declassified.

 

[anti-pacer]

Quicker escape after they have "been on the rob"

I'm thinking of the linguistical challenges that may arise on a train full of Geordies and Scousers intoxicated.

 

[fowler9]

I'm thinking of the linguistical challenges that may arise on a train full of Geordies and Scousers intoxicated.

Ha ha. And you can shut up to.

 

[JohnB57]

I think Blamethrower was talking about the class system in general which very much does exist...

So does religion, but its relevance is also questionable.

Social class is a concept used to allow one group to feel superior to another. It has no place in modern society.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

So does religion, but its relevance is also questionable.

Social class is a concept used to allow one group to feel superior to another. It has no place in modern society.

Do they have "Orange Class" and Green Class" in Ulster?

 

[daikilo]

So does religion, but its relevance is also questionable.

Social class is a concept used to allow one group to feel superior to another. It has no place in modern society.

That is at it may be (i.e. bollocks), but if First class is reduced to a package above what others choose to pay for, then why not? I have paid First class fares on several occasions just to get the additional space and peace it brings. On those days, it had value for me, and that was without any perks such as free food. Indeed, I remember buying it before boarding.

I can afford it , but, that said, most of my travels have not been in First. I don't in any way feel superior, but thanks to my salary based on deliverables I have decided I can choose. I am about to retire and will probably no longer have that pleasure.

 

[Bevan Price]

If they improved the service would more people pay £500? Probably not.
If the reduced the price to £400 would more people pay? Probably not. People who pay an extra £300 for a bigger seat for 4 hours are the same people who would pay an extra £400.

How many "normal" passengers pay over £300 for a ticket, as opposed to those who are business travellers, with tickets bought by their employer ? That will include those in the civil service whose pay grade includes an entitlement to first class travel (at our expense...).

 

[AlterEgo]

How many "normal" passengers pay over £300 for a ticket, as opposed to those who are business travellers, with tickets bought by their employer ? That will include those in the civil service whose pay grade includes an entitlement to first class travel (at our expense...).

Which civil service grades are those then?

 

[anti-pacer]

Ha ha. And you can shut up to.

Sorry....
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Do they have "Orange Class" and Green Class" in Ulster?

You'll be opening up a right can of worms with that, Paul. hock:

 

[HowardGWR]

Judging by the posts here, I think it is clear that many first class pax do think they are superior (as opposed to being able to afford it), perhaps they are.

I had first class privileges when I worked for BR, but I often preferred to travel second class, as there was better eye candy in there.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Judging by the posts here, I think it is clear that many first class pax do think they are superior (as opposed to being able to afford it), perhaps they are.

I had first class privileges when I worked for BR, but I often preferred to travel second class, as there was better eye candy in there.

On our enforced return from Blackpool last Saturday in "proletarian class" on the 1712 service to Manchester Airport, I was amazed at the number of over-ample female 20- and 30-somethings with a combination of large girth and a wide selection of shoulder tattoos of all sizes and hues...:roll:

 

[yorksrob]

On the occasions I do do first class, I'm happy I'm not being subsumed in our class system.

When I get chucked out of first for wearing my trainers and t-shirt (in spite of paying my fare) I'll know the class system is alive and kicking in all its sinister rubbishness and has taken over the railway. Until then, don't worry.

I remember going to night clubs in my youth when we were not let in for wearing the wrong footware/being too ugly/they wanted more women etc. Hooray that you can just buy a ticket for first class on the train and get in.