What is causing the shortage of Thameslink drivers?

[AndyY]

Thank you everyone for the very insightful information to the operation and rostering of a railway.
It seems that the root cause is cost cutting and everybody is doing their best to make the best of a bad situation.
Sadly there seems to be no political will to do anything.
Finally I would like to say that while it is interesting to learn how the railway works, I am only reluctantly getting myself interested because of the effects these delays are having on my life. There are many other things I would rather interest myself in!

 

[Bellbell]

You mean you have been paid 338 hours overtime pay. It may be that you asked for 2 hours overtime to do a ten minute shunt one day & were given it because the train was blocking the platform. It may be you agreed a late change of work for an extra 5 hours overtime. It may be you were given 4 hours overtime to read a change of rules that took you an hour to read while you were being paid at the depot to be spare. This may be wrong but it is incredibly unlikely that you did 338 hours extra in the cab.

An adequately resourced depot would have spares and training days to cover those eventualities. Now, do you think it's cheaper for the company to pay over the odds for a bit of overtime/rdw or to actually employ enough drivers?

Also, agreeing a late movement off spare - I don't want to start another argument over railway pay/conditions but it's a disruptive way of life, why shouldn't someone get rewarded for agreeing to help out?

 

[W230]

So to sum up:

1. Bad bid - fault GTR
2. Inefficient rosters - goes back to BR days and the TL drivers like the system. GTR have no excuse for not realising this though.
3 & 4. Poor Management - actually goes back to last time Go Ahead ran TL, but GTR could still fix now.

Or to simplify even further; even though there are other parties to the problem, GTR should have known about the issues and should have had plans to fix them. Other bidders did, but GTR offered the best price and somehow DfT also thought their bid had the best quality. I wonder if they're regretting that decision now?

I'm a bit confused by number 2 here? We have fewer drivers available on a Saturday not more. Yes we run fewer services but the jobs are far more intensive and longer than other weekdays. I have never sat spare on a Saturday. I have on other days.

Again, as to inefficient rosters - I only have Thameslink ones to compare them to but qualified drivers who join Thameslink complain vehemently about the quality and length of work. They either move on again very soon or they stay for the overtime!

Certainly our keys problems are:
1. Not enough drivers.

2. Not enough driver trainers to train new drivers. Many (not all) of the driver trainers are not really very interested in driver training for whatever reason but they can't get more drivers to do it.

3. Not enough managers to assess trainee drivers. Many (not all) of the managers are not really interested in assessing trainees but they can't get more people to do it.

4. Not all drivers sign 700s. Courses have been repeatedly disrupted by delays and cancellations (of training trains), infrastructure failures etc etc. If the driver hasn't completed the course they won't be authorised to sign off the traction. It has led to training trying to squeeze in the missed day here and there which has disrupted other courses.

5. Trainee drivers aren't being trained on the new 700s until they pass out. That means even when they do go productive they can't sign the new stock.

As someone who does sign the stock I have been begged to work consistently on days off. I have a young family and it doesn't suit spending all my time at work (plus I don't actually want to). I think this problem will continue until we have only 700s in operation. Then people will be trained quicker as there really is nothing else to be doing. Ever the optimist...

 

[HH]

I'm a bit confused by number 2 here? We have fewer drivers available on a Saturday not more. Yes we run fewer services but the jobs are far more intensive and longer than other weekdays. I have never sat spare on a Saturday. I have on other days.

Again, as to inefficient rosters - I only have Thameslink ones to compare them to but qualified drivers who join Thameslink complain vehemently about the quality and length of work. They either move on again very soon or they stay for the overtime!

Certainly our keys problems are:
1. Not enough drivers.

2. Not enough driver trainers to train new drivers. Many (not all) of the driver trainers are not really very interested in driver training for whatever reason but they can't get more drivers to do it.

3. Not enough managers to assess trainee drivers. Many (not all) of the managers are not really interested in assessing trainees but they can't get more people to do it.

4. Not all drivers sign 700s. Courses have been repeatedly disrupted by delays and cancellations (of training trains), infrastructure failures etc etc. If the driver hasn't completed the course they won't be authorised to sign off the traction. It has led to training trying to squeeze in the missed day here and there which has disrupted other courses.

5. Trainee drivers aren't being trained on the new 700s until they pass out. That means even when they do go productive they can't sign the new stock.

As someone who does sign the stock I have been begged to work consistently on days off. I have a young family and it doesn't suit spending all my time at work (plus I don't actually want to). I think this problem will continue until we have only 700s in operation. Then people will be trained quicker as there really is nothing else to be doing. Ever the optimist...

Clearly the same problems that caused issues around the 377s are still there with the 700s.

I'm rather confused by your confusion though. Quality and length of work may be an issue, but that's not what I'm talking about. Circadian rostering means that there are the same number of drivers available for work each day, but there are less working diagrams on a Saturday. That's particularly the case at Bedford.

Of course you can attempt to balance this out through training; maybe this is the reason no-one wants to be a trainer?

 

[W230]

Circadian rostering means that there are the same number of drivers available for work each day, but there are less working diagrams on a Saturday. That's particularly the case at Bedford.

Not the case at my depot (there is one less night turn, otherwise the number of jobs is the same as midweek).

 

[SpacePhoenix]

Do many TL drivers rely on overtime for extra money?