What do train drivers do?

[Zoe]

Occasionally, of course, the first indication of a wrong route is at the junction signal itself - by which time, for a high-speed junction, it's sometimes too late!

Cogload Junction is an example of this with a speed of 100 mph to stay on the Great Western Main Line or 90 mph to diverge onto the Castle Cary and Langport Line.

 

[Rugd1022]

Hopefully the first clue would be green signals rather than restrictive aspects at braking distance in rear of the junction signal (approach controlled for the route onto the branch). How would a driver, having taken a wrong route at an approach controlled junction, stand with the seemingly widely taught principle that "there's no such thing as an approach controlled signal" though?

In the case of Knighton Junction, approaching from the south whether I've had a green or single yellow aspect I'll still be slowing down for the junction signal anyway, as nine times out of ten I'm taking the Coalville branch so I know which route I'm booked to take! You can have greens all the way from Narborough if you're coming from that direction but you still have to slow for the mandatory 40mph round the curve at Wigston, and even at that speed with a set of wagons in tow there is plenty of room to react to being wrong routed at Knighton. From one signal to the next is almost 1.5 miles according to the Q-Tron on our 66s

Granted though, in other situations a differently signalled approach will usually be more apparent. T'other side of the coin occurs at Aston though (I've mentioned this elsewhere on the forum), approaching from the north you often get greens all the way to the junction signal at the B'ham end of the platform so have to be on the ball if you're booked to run round the corner towards Stechford, the speed for which is only 20mph. One to be careful of, Aston!

 

[TDK]

Yes. Is that not obvious from previous posts? Correct on the DOO.

Well, I will ask another question. Are you a trainee driver? The reason I am asking is that your posts seem to angle that way! Sorry if you feel offended by the question if you are not. It help with the answers to your posts if we know where you stand on the railway.
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I've been wrong routed on at least three occasions, managed to avoid them all.

Blimey Cherry - I think over 20 for me in 14 years I have actually lost count. For anyone else reading this and are interested in wrong routes. This in my opinion includes a wrong platform that cannot accommodate your train.
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So, to answer your question, the above, that's how. But it's very extremely rare for it to happen and there are never any safety implications, just inconvenience.

Inconvenience especially for the driver who will go on the specially monitored and have an incident on file, not good for the CV!
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Hopefully the first clue would be green signals rather than restrictive aspects at braking distance in rear of the junction signal (approach controlled for the route onto the branch). How would a driver, having taken a wrong route at an approach controlled junction, stand with the seemingly widely taught principle that "there's no such thing as an approach controlled signal" though?

Not necessarily, you can be wrong routed into a platform, from a shunt signal, from a station platform or even come to a stand and then be wrong routed. It isn't all track approach.
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I do. A train driver is expected to show competency to a manager but nothing is legally required.

If is if there is a major accident - A driver has a C of C and this is a legal document when it comes to investigating drivers that have been accused of injury or death!

 

[Tomnick]

In the case of Knighton Junction, approaching from the south whether I've had a green or single yellow aspect I'll still be slowing down for the junction signal anyway, as nine times out of ten I'm taking the Coalville branch so I know which route I'm booked to take! You can have greens all the way from Narborough if you're coming from that direction but you still have to slow for the mandatory 40mph round the curve at Wigston, and even at that speed with a set of wagons in tow there is plenty of room to react to being wrong routed at Knighton. From one signal to the next is almost 1.5 miles according to the Q-Tron on our 66s

I'm not doubting what you say - I don't know the exact arrangements at Knighton - but a free green reading over a 20mph diverging route from a 100mph line sounds dubious to me! A 170 coming from Nuneaton in poor visibility could be up to a fair speed before the junction signal comes into view; too fast to do enough about it if he'd been wrong-routed!
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Not necessarily, you can be wrong routed into a platform, from a shunt signal, from a station platform or even come to a stand and then be wrong routed. It isn't all track approach.

I know - my point was that getting greens at the signal(s) in rear of an approach controlled junction where you're booked over the diverging route is a good indication that you've got a wrong route set. How can you expect a new driver to work that out though, if (as many are) they've been taught that there's no such thing as an approach controlled signal?

I'll agree that wrong routes include a platform which can't accommodate the train - or, for that matter, a platform that's got no access to your onward route. All sorts of reasons for these happening of course - not always signalman error.

 

[Latecomer]

Well, I will ask another question. Are you a trainee driver? The reason I am asking is that your posts seem to angle that way! Sorry if you feel offended by the question if you are not. It help with the answers to your posts if we know where you stand on the railway.

For avoidance of doubt, I'm a fully qualified driver. Hopefully matters now clarified via PM!

 

[W230]

This discussion is making me curious. As a passenger, when I've looked at signals on the railway, they look as if they simply show green, yellow, double yellow, or red. By itself that wouldn't be enough to tell a driver which way the points are set, but the discussion here seems to imply drivers can tell. Is there some other visual indicator that gives that information?

This pic shows a main aspect signal with a junction indicators for a diverging route. When the junction is cleared for the diverging route (route 4 in this case) the appropriate indication is given by the five white lights along with a main aspect.

This pic shows a main aspect signal with route indicator (the right hand green and "S" on the gantry). Route indicators can show a myriad of letters (or sometimes just a couple) and will sometimes show platform numbers onto approach at stations. I believe the "S" shown here is for the Down South London route when leaving London Bridge (i'm sure someone will correct me when i'm wrong!)

For avoidance of doubt, I'm a fully qualified driver. Hopefully matters now clarified via PM!

As a DM, TDK likes trainee drivers like me in our place!