What announcements is a driver expected to make?

[387star]

And in modern doo trains are announcements made hands free ?

 

[dk1]

And in modern doo trains are announcements made hands free ?

I've yet to see it. Handset usually which looks like you are on the phone as you run into a platform :roll:

 

[Stats]

Ok what about thameslink drivers it is asked at their interview I passed the interview so don't think it is a major question but still obviously of importance

The GTR franchise agreement requires the quality of driver announcements to be measured by the following

The benchmark for measuring the quality of such driver announcements shall be:
(a) a welcome message to passengers at the originating Station advising them of the service calling pattern and the arrival time at the final destination Station;
(b) at the Stations through the Core Thameslink Route, an announcement detailing which side the train doors will open and an instruction to passengers to ‘stand clear’ at least three seconds before closing the doors;
(c) if the service is running late, an explanation as to why the service is delayed, offering an apology for the inconvenience that it may have caused, thanking passengers for travelling on the Passenger Services and wishing them a safe and pleasant onward journey;
(d) an apology to passengers if held at a red signal for more than one minute;
(e) updates at five minute intervals when delays are likely to be significant; and
(f) if the service is on time, a confirmation that the service has arrived on time, thanking passengers for travelling on the Passenger Services and wishing them a safe and pleasant onward journey.

 

[A-driver]

The GTR franchise agreement requires the quality of driver announcements to be measured by the following

A franchise agreement maybe but something which certainly hasn't been passed onto the staff! I don't make half of the announcements listed there and that's the first I've heard that we are meant to.

Of course it's all good saying it should happen like that but we as drivers still don't get any info at all during delays so have absolutely no info to ever pass on.

 

[IanKR]

The flyover and the junction is very busy with many conflicting moves; especially when there is disruption or late running. There is also a few freight movements that passenger services will often get delayed for. There is a built in bit of leeway and you are usually timed for an extra minute or two dwell time at lewisham. It was worse but the double track did resolve a few issues. Moan at the planners tbh I'm stunned why some services are booked across each other. Hopefully once all the work has been done it will alleviate more minor issues.

Sorry, I didn't mean it sound like I was moaning at the driver for making announcements like this; I welcome them. I know how busy the Lewisham area is at peak times. Once the LBG / TL work (if that is the work you're referring to) is complete, will it improve conflicts here?

 

[reb0118]

No volume control.

Yes there is, it's called SHOUTING!

 

[ComUtoR]

Sorry, I didn't mean it sound like I was moaning at the driver for making announcements like this;

Sorry Ian. I absolutely welcomed your comment, hence the more detailed reply

Once the LBG / TL work (if that is the work you're referring to) is complete, will it improve conflicts here?

I think that it will always be an area of conflict. The Dartford > Vic service comes up via Bexleyheath so will always cut across the junction. What I would like to see is pathways that work together. Have Trains coming up from Blackheath take the road towards St Johns whilst a Service going up the flyover at the same time. Same with anything coming across the Junction.

With the doubling down you can run Charing Cross services in both directions but I find that I'm always waiting for a service to come across me. Even with the additional dwell times it still causes a delay.

Some of what Bald Rick has posted about changes to how the services will be routed certainly leads me to believe that small conflicts will removed as the mentality is to get folks into London Bridge for interchange to Cannon Street and Charing Cross.

IF everything from Courthill side goes up the flyover and everything Blackheath side goes Via St Johns then that will ease some conflicts there. It will be interesting to see what the new changes will bring tbh.

Until then you may have to suffer my dulcet tones over the PA.

 

[tsr]

A franchise agreement maybe but something which certainly hasn't been passed onto the staff! I don't make half of the announcements listed there and that's the first I've heard that we are meant to.

Of course it's all good saying it should happen like that but we as drivers still don't get any info at all during delays so have absolutely no info to ever pass on.

The message has certainly been passed to some Southern drivers, so I should think there will be a briefing for all other GTR traincrew shortly. In fact, I'd be rather surprised if not, being as it is a franchise commitment.

If they can send out a memo about exactly which staff wear ties, I'd hope they can brief folks about announcements, which are a lot more important!

As for drivers not having info, as far as I can tell signallers at the various panels at Three Bridges have been getting better at providing information to drivers and hopefully this will improve across the board. I was impressed with the speed of the info they were giving my drivers during the trespass incident on Friday and this is not the first time. But it works both ways (or not), and sometimes there is a breakdown in communication because either the driver or signaller assumes the other is not interested, or too busy (they may be, but sometimes you have to try asking - and trust me, I've been there!) and messages don't get through. For clarity, I'm not having a moan and I'm sure this sort of thing will improve. The same applies for TOC Control, for conductors (wherever they exist), for station staff - especially controllers and management - etc., and indeed I would type the same for all of those roles if people would read it.

 

[IanKR]

Sorry Ian. I absolutely welcomed your comment, hence the more detailed reply

I think that it will always be an area of conflict. The Dartford > Vic service comes up via Bexleyheath so will always cut across the junction. What I would like to see is pathways that work together. Have Trains coming up from Blackheath take the road towards St Johns whilst a Service going up the flyover at the same time. Same with anything coming across the Junction.

With the doubling down you can run Charing Cross services in both directions but I find that I'm always waiting for a service to come across me. Even with the additional dwell times it still causes a delay.

Some of what Bald Rick has posted about changes to how the services will be routed certainly leads me to believe that small conflicts will removed as the mentality is to get folks into London Bridge for interchange to Cannon Street and Charing Cross.

IF everything from Courthill side goes up the flyover and everything Blackheath side goes Via St Johns then that will ease some conflicts there. It will be interesting to see what the new changes will bring tbh.

Until then you may have to suffer my dulcet tones over the PA.

Dulcet (or otherwise) tones are better than none

I guess that they must plan the services to sync nicely at Lewisham, but there are so many variables involved, especially at peak times, that it only takes some small thing to go awry way up/down the line, for everything to come into conflict.

I've noticed that all Dartford-Bexleyheath-Charing Cross services have been using the TH flydown since Jan this year, and it will stay that way from now on, from what Bald Rick has said, if I understand it. Before Jan, in my experience, most Up services in the morning peak used it, but very few Down services in the evening peak.

As I understand it now, this is the crux of all the civil engineering / track realignment work that's happening between New Cross and LBG, ie to channel CHX services to the south side (via Bermondsey Diveunder), with TL in the middle and CST on the north side, well before they approach their through platforms at LBG?

 

[Sadsmileyface]

ScotRail drivers (on 314s only) should make predeparture announcements listing the calling pattern before the doors close and interchange announcements at specified stations, as well as an apology announcement when running more than (I think) five minutes behind timetable.

 

[Abpj17]

The GTR franchise agreement requires the quality of driver announcements to be measured by the following

if the circumstances dictate it, we get some of the GTR announcements. Never heard the 'which side the doors open' one tho...

Most TL drivers apply commonsense and make announcements that make everyone's life a little easier:
- announcing luton airport parkway and reminding customers to take their luggage
- an excuse for the doors taking forever at St P
- power switchover/dwell time announcements at Farringdon and City Thameslink
- and the usual, we're delayed, no one has told the driver why yet, if/when they do find out - they announce

 

[455driver]

I've yet to see it. Handset usually which looks like you are on the phone as you run into a platform :roll:

Yeah a few drivers have been reported (by intending passengers) for using their mobiles while driving, I think its quite funny that they can see the phone but not the silver or black wire connecting the 'mobile' phone to the train cab.
As for the GSM-R ringing?

 

[redbutton]

sometimes there is a breakdown in communication because either the driver or signaller assumes the other is not interested, or too busy (they may be, but sometimes you have to try asking - and trust me, I've been there!) and messages don't get through.

True, but this is exactly why GSM-R has a general broadcast feature.

The ELL signallers seem to be good about using it, as I often hear broadcast reports of disruption there as I pass New Cross Gate on the Sussex lines. I have yet to hear it used for that purpose on any other line.

 

[RichJF]

I've found TL drivers to be very good at announcements compared with other lines I use.

Usually the driver makes it clear there's no stops between Elephant & Castle - Croydon. Sometimes also announces the connections at Redhill as well.
Yesterday the train insisted it was a Southern service to Portsmouth despite being a TL service! :roll:
Driver repeatedly said "ignore the train & the computers, listen to me!" Think he might've even cracked a joke about the Thameslink South Coast fantasy line.

The tone of the driver doesn't have to be particularly friendly for me, but the small things that help passengers go down well.

 

[SPADTrap]

As for the GSM-R ringing?

I've wondered about that before. A few weeks ago shuffling from signal to signal during a points failure on approach into Liverpool Street I was mid PA when a broadcast call came through, I had to cringe at the thought of already angry passengers probably thinking I had a phone on, I've also had them ring mid PA when getting ready to leave liverpool street during disruption when the broadcast calls are frequent due to the amount of trains entering the section being so high all the time, never had anyone ask or say anything but it does make me cringe!

 

[ComUtoR]

Never heard the 'which side the doors open' one tho...

It is for when you run in the reversible direction. Under normal running it isn't required.

Most TL drivers apply commonsense and make announcements that make everyone's life a little easier:

- announcing luton airport parkway and reminding customers to take their luggage

I also announce the shuttle bus connection

- an excuse for the doors taking forever at St P

It's not an excuse. It is a REASON. But cheers for the negative perception.

[/quote
- and the usual, we're delayed, no one has told the driver why yet, if/when they do find out - they announce[/QUOTE]

Nobody tells the Driver SG - Wait

 

[FordFocus]

The industry is going to try and use GSM-R more with new software updates to give drivers more details on delays through general broadcasts, delay text messages and possibility of cautioning trains on the move with the ST acknowledgement button used.

As for train announcements, I go out of my way to get the auto announcement system working as I want to concentrate on driving. I'll happily do announcements when needed but you will get the basic information (provided we're not running on cautionary signals) of next stop, mind the large gap and possible key connections. No "thank you for travelling" or any other long winded guard type announcements about peak time fares and other things.

When at red signals, drivers are mostly in the dark unless the signal will ring them to say why. If anything passengers know the reason before the driver as a few have signed up to the journey check text messaging service.

 

[A-driver]

When at red signals, drivers are mostly in the dark unless the signal will ring them to say why. If anything passengers know the reason before the driver as a few have signed up to the journey check text messaging service.

Or Twitter. A few times now I have apologia idea for a delay saying I have absolutely no idea what's causing it to be told by passengers at the next station what's going on with info they have found on Twitter. And passengers are genuinely surprised that we don't have the info.

 

[Wolf]

Drivers at northern generally don't do pa announcements, the only time I've done one is on a Saturday night when there was no guard available and I needed to get 150 drunks off the train so I could take it to Neville hill. Also in an emergency we would probably make announcements if we needed to get info to the passengers quick, saving time buzzing the guard and asking them to do it. I don't mind doing them at all but it's generally seen as the guards job and we arnt given any official training to do them.

 

[313103]

The drivers role is not to make announcements, there role should be to drive the train and leave others to make announcements.

I use to hate drivers making announcements when I was a Guard, it was seen as yet another tool in which to make it easier for companies to reduce the workforce.

All that would be needed now to reduce costs even more is to redesign the trains so the driver collects fares as passengers board, as its about the only job drivers don't do that guards use to do.

 

[TUC]

Drivers on Anglia local trains are expected to announce intermediate & non-connectional stations. Some do, many refuse. Not much management can do as you just play the distraction card.

so much for customer care. If it's safe for one driver to do it's safe for every driver to do.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

meant to only announce at a stand and if its delay related.

All other announcemets are optional.. at southern anyway

How does them being optional square with disability equality duties?

 

[SPADTrap]

If it's safe for one driver to do it's safe for every driver to do.

No it most certainly isn't.

 

[TUC]

If it's safe for one driver to do it's safe for every driver to do.

No is most certainly isn't.

Why not? I'm not talking about specific incidents on individual journeys when a driver's attention may rightly be elsewhere. I'm talking about the normal course of events. If a driver of normal competence is able to make an announcement, then all drivers of normal competence on that route should be capable of making announcements.

 

[455driver]

The drivers role is not to make announcements, there role should be to drive the train and leave others to make announcements.

I use to hate drivers making announcements when I was a Guard, it was seen as yet another tool in which to make it easier for companies to reduce the workforce.

Which is why the only announcement I make is "can the guard please contact the driver"!

 

[A-driver]

Why not? I'm not talking about specific incidents on individual journeys when a driver's attention may rightly be elsewhere. I'm talking about the normal course of events. If a driver of normal competence is able to make an announcement, then all drivers of normal competence on that route should be capable of making announcements.

I'l thought out comment. If it's safe for one it certainly doesn't mean it's safe for all, very naive thing to think really. All depends on how confident the driver feels, what else is happening, how much a driver feels he or she needs to concentrate etc, train drivers are humans and not robots. Some car drivers feel safe bombing down the motorway at 90 without incident but it dosnt mean it's safe for all motorists-others won't do more than 50 on the same stretch of road.

 

[blotred]

I was on a Southern train approaching Victoria once, and as well as the usual "We are now approaching London Victoria, please remember to take your luggage and personal belongings with you when you leave the train", the driver also did an announcement in French!

 

[redbutton]

Why not? I'm not talking about specific incidents on individual journeys when a driver's attention may rightly be elsewhere. I'm talking about the normal course of events. If a driver of normal competence is able to make an announcement, then all drivers of normal competence on that route should be capable of making announcements.

Competence is a spectrum. Different drivers have different skill levels. All are assessed as being at least minimally competent, but some are definitely better than others.

Even for the same driver at different times, whether it's safe to make an announcement can vary based on factors like cautionary signals, fatigue, the complexity of the diagram, events that may have happened earlier in the day, and so on.

I find that some days I'm really keen and other days I do the minimum. It's the nature of the job.

 

[MCR247]

The same driver may not even always announce. On a clear day with good visibility he might, but on a foggy morning I'm pretty sure announcements wouldn't be the drivers main focus

 

[dk1]

so much for customer care. If it's safe for one driver to do it's safe for every driver to do.

Not always.

 

[455driver]

Why not? I'm not talking about specific incidents on individual journeys when a driver's attention may rightly be elsewhere. I'm talking about the normal course of events. If a driver of normal competence is able to make an announcement, then all drivers of normal competence on that route should be capable of making announcements.

Such a simplistic view! :roll:
It just shows that you know very little about being a train driver.