Wet tunnels

[Gloster]

my vote is Higham Tunnel. During the prolonged wet period in 2012ish, the water table rose to such an extent that it was above rail level.

Wasn’t it originally a canal tunnel?

 

[Dave S 56F]

Gomersal's a very wet one, and from what I can gather always has been.

If you mean Gomersal tunnel Cleckheaton the L.N.W.R. former disused Leeds new line me and my dad walked under it in the mid 1990,s before paleside fencing was put up at both ends of the portals and the northeast facing portal where Gomersal station was its always flooded there and the Western portal where the railway cutting leading to it was partly infilled leaving the Western portal in a hollow prone to flooding when raining heavy

 

[Bald Rick]

Wasn’t it originally a canal tunnel?

yes

 

[Halish Railway]

The stalactites that formed in Summit Tunnel were enough to derail a 185 a couple of years ago. Not exactly a lightweight Multiple Unit.

 

[Basil Jet]

The stalactites that formed in Summit Tunnel were enough to derail a 185 a couple of years ago. Not exactly a lightweight Multiple Unit.

You mean icicles. Stalactites are made of stone and don't form overnight.

 

[Spartacus]

The stalactites that formed in Summit Tunnel were enough to derail a 185 a couple of years ago. Not exactly a lightweight Multiple Unit.

I’m sure it was ice that had formed up one of the ventilation shafts that had crashed down when it started to thaw.

 

[Flying Phil]

I'm sure I've heard that the Channel Tunnel has water pumped in, to keep the pumps that were installed to pump water out, working.
It's apparently a dry tunnel built through chalk marl.

I thought that the main reason for pumping water into/along the Channel Tunnel was to prevent heat build up from operating the 25kV trains through it?

 

[Skie]

Mentioned already but the Mersey Railway tunnel gets a lot of water ingress. The Capital Building (formerly Old Hall Place, where the Echo had their printing press) is actually cooled and heated using the water from the railway tunnel, making it probably the most energy efficient building in the 70's when it was constructed.

The loop line also gets plenty of water ingress, and there are 6 large well pumps around the loop. Liverpool's water table was lower than it is now due to water abstracting industry moving out of the city over the years, so the pumps around the loop were added in the 90's to mitigate that.

 

[Watershed]

Mentioned already but the Mersey Railway tunnel gets a lot of water ingress. The Capital Building (formerly Old Hall Place, where the Echo had their printing press) is actually cooled and heated using the water from the railway tunnel, making it probably the most energy efficient building in the 70's when it was constructed.

The loop line also gets plenty of water ingress, and there are 6 large well pumps around the loop. Liverpool's water table was lower than it is now due to water abstracting industry moving out of the city over the years, so the pumps around the loop were added in the 90's to mitigate that.

Yes, there's a point around half-way through the Mersey Tunnel when it suddenly gets very wet, having been pretty much bone dry in the Wirral. The drainage channels in the four-foot are there for good reason!

 

[Paperptsticket]

Severn Tunnel must be one, for starters. Think that because of the 'Great Spring', something like 50 million litres has to be pumped out of there, every day.

Certainly a wet place when I've worked there. Was told that if the pumps failed you had 1/2 hour before it flooded don't know how true that was but sounds plausible

 

[Glasgowbusguy]

Glasgow central low level tunnel is usually pretty wet same for the Glasgow underground at stations like Kelvin bridge

 

[Annetts key]

Sodbury Tunnel, 2.5 miles long, to the east of Bristol Parkway where the London line cuts through an outlier of the Cotswolds, has been a constant issue since it was built around 1900, and still gets closed due to flooding, with diversions round by Bath, despite innumerable attempts at alleviation. There was an issue with the Severn river authority, who refused the outflow to be discharged into adjacent rivers, and at one stage said it would have to be piped to the Severn Estuary, over 10 miles away. The water bursts through different points at different times from the strata, in a way that seems to still not be understood.

Some years ago, the railway commissioned a full study and investigation into why Chipping Sodbury tunnel and nearby cuttings flood so often. It’s all down to the rock formations that were cut into to build the line. Basically the top layer of rock is porous, so rain water can percolate through it. But the next layer is not porous. Hence the combination acts like a giant sponge, once the water gets to the non-porous layer, it travels sideways until it gets to the railway tunnel/cutting… Typically it takes two to three days of continuous or near continuous rainfall for the tunnel to start to flood.

The tunnel has a drain under the six foot (track) big enough for a human to crawl through.

The outflow from this drain flows into a tributary to the river Frome. The flow rate is however limited by the environment agency, as otherwise it would cause flooding of the tributary. Hence the railway has built a pond at the former site of Chipping Sodbury station. Electric pumps have also been installed to attempt to remove the water faster from the tunnel than gravity alone.

Even in summer, parts of Chipping Sodbury are so wet that mineral deposits from the flowing water build up on equipment on the tunnel walls and glue ballast together like rock. In one place you could easily have a shower if you wanted!

It’s especially impressive near a vertical air vent when a train approaches: the water falling down from the sides of the vent pause mid-air, then go upwards with the air as the pressure increases. Only to stop and rapidly fall as soon as the train passes!

The amount of water pumped out of there is phenomenal. I think there's some fact that says if the pumps fail it will be totally flooded in a day or something.
Needs replacing.

Sudbrook is more than able to cope and has backup facilities.

Fighting 14 million gallons of water a day | Railnews | Today's news for Tomorrow's railway

www.railnews.co.uk

Even with electric lights and lifts, this damp underground world of tunnels, pumps and shafts looks and feels Dickensian. It takes some adjustment to go from there to the control room above, where operator Malcolm Brown sits at a 21st-century computer monitor. With just a click of his mouse he can stop or start any of the 14 massive pumps or four electric fans spread throughout the tunnels.

A big panel on the wall above him shows which ones are currently in action – at that moment, seven pumps and three fans are hard at work. There are also a number of additional pumps that can be used to allow maintenance or in case of breakdown, and emergency generators that start automatically 30 seconds after a power cut.

Wickwar tunnel can flood during heavy rain. But is nowhere near as wet as Chipping Sodbury tunnel. This is on the Gloucester line. Patchway New Tunnel (Up Tunnel line) can also flood, but is normally relatively dry.

Box Tunnel on the line between Bath and Swindon is interesting in that although the railway tunnel is fairly dry, inside the railway tunnel, the tracks cross over a river inside the tunnel… I’ve not heard of any flooding though.

 

[ungreat]

The clerkenwell Tunnels always seem sodden when I drive through them to Horsham and back

 

[bramling]

If you mean Gomersal tunnel Cleckheaton the L.N.W.R. former disused Leeds new line me and my dad walked under it in the mid 1990,s before palisade fencing was put up at both ends of the portals and the northeast facing portal where Gomersal station was its always flooded there and the Western portal where the railway cutting leading to it was partly infilled leaving the Western portal in a hollow prone to flooding when raining heavy

Still like that to this day. The west portal area can flood to a depth of a good few feet.

One which hasn’t been mentioned yet which was notorious during its relatively short operational life - Bolsover.

We paid a visit to Haddon Tunnel last year during a thunder storm - as well as being pretty creepy, it was almost as wet inside as out.

 

[Spartacus]

If you mean Gomersal tunnel Cleckheaton the L.N.W.R. former disused Leeds new line me and my dad walked under it in the mid 1990,s before paleside fencing was put up at both ends of the portals and the northeast facing portal where Gomersal station was its always flooded there and the Western portal where the railway cutting leading to it was partly infilled leaving the Western portal in a hollow prone to flooding when raining heavy

It's what comes through the roof though, partially down to being shallow, but the equally, or even more shallow Earlsheaton tunnel has never been wet. Back in steam days it was the same, and known to have particular trouble with icicles during the winter.

 

[Taunton]

known to have particular trouble with icicles during the winter.

Not Britain, but in the USA back in classic passenger train days these were a particular problem to the streamlined "Dome Cars", with the high sightseeing lounge that projected up above the general car roofline, with glazed windows at the front, which could be (and were) broken at speed by icicles hanging from tunnels. So old photographs of F-unit diesels on affected routes can show the locos with a light steel framework hoop sticking up above the cab to the loading gauge limit, sometimes mistaken for a radio antenna, called "icicle cutters", designed to break any icicles off. They weren't a standard loco manufacturers' item, but just something fabricated locally by the railroad's workshops.

 

[Spartacus]

Not Britain, but in the USA back in classic passenger train days these were a particular problem to the streamlined "Dome Cars", with the high sightseeing lounge that projected up above the general car roofline, with glazed windows at the front, which could be (and were) broken at speed by icicles hanging from tunnels. So old photographs of F-unit diesels on affected routes can show the locos with a light steel framework hoop sticking up above the cab to the loading gauge limit, sometimes mistaken for a radio antenna, called "icicle cutters", designed to break any icicles off. They weren't a standard loco manufacturers' item, but just something fabricated locally by the railroad's workshops.

Interesting, are these them? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EMD_F-unit#/media/File:Amtrak_San_Francisco_Zephyr.jpg

 

[Lewlew]

The Bakerloo line between Embankment and Waterloo is currently very wet at the moment. It's been getting up to rail level and causing track circuit failures.

 

[Taunton]

Interesting, are these them? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EMD_F-unit#/media/File:Amtrak_San_Francisco_Zephyr.jpg

Yes, that's them.

 

[Pinza-C55]

Burdale Tunnel (disused) on the Malton & Driffield Railway was and is very wet and has sadly suffered at least two collapses since abandonment due to the amount of water ingress. A contemporary write said that "everything was covered in slime" and in winter icicles hung from the roof.

 

[Ploughman]

Not Britain, but in the USA back in classic passenger train days these were a particular problem to the streamlined "Dome Cars", with the high sightseeing lounge that projected up above the general car roofline, with glazed windows at the front, which could be (and were) broken at speed by icicles hanging from tunnels. So old photographs of F-unit diesels on affected routes can show the locos with a light steel framework hoop sticking up above the cab to the loading gauge limit, sometimes mistaken for a radio antenna, called "icicle cutters", designed to break any icicles off. They weren't a standard loco manufacturers' item, but just something fabricated locally by the railroad's workshops.

In a Video a few years back Battle for Donner Pass.
It showed one technique in how to deal with Icicles.
Use of a Shotgun, it seemed to work well.

 

[Western Sunset]

Bradway has a reputation for wetness too.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

The Bakerloo line between Embankment and Waterloo is currently very wet at the moment. It's been getting up to rail level and causing track circuit failures.

Is this water table seepage or is there a leak in the crown somewhere? I seem to recall reading that the Bakerloo is unbelievably shallow where it passes under the Thames to the extent that they had to put additional crown protection ( a concrete cover to the crown, if I remember right? ) in over it when they were working on the bridges above.

 

[Lewlew]

Is this water table seepage or is there a leak in the crown somewhere? I seem to recall reading that the Bakerloo is unbelievably shallow where it passes under the Thames to the extent that they had to put additional crown protection ( a concrete cover to the crown, if I remember right? ) in over it when they were working on the bridges above.

It's coming in from the side. About a 1/4 the way up from the bottom (so not too high up). The leak is half way between Embankment and Waterloo but water is pooling in the 4 foot and pit all the way back to Embankment

 

[Peter Mugridge]

It's coming in from the side. About a 1/4 the way up from the bottom (so not too high up). The leak is half way between Embankment and Waterloo but water is pooling in the 4 foot and pit all the way back to Embankment

Interesting... not where you would normally expect a leak to materialise but it does sound like it's related to the rising water table; has it developed recently and is it the northbound or the southbound tunnel affected?

 

[Lewlew]

Interesting... not where you would normally expect a leak to materialise but it does sound like it's related to the rising water table; has it developed recently and is it the northbound or the southbound tunnel affected?

About 2 weeks ago. Southbound tunnel

 

[DJ_K666]

The whole of the London Underground

Well, the underground bit anyway. I saw a decumentary somewhere that said if the pumps were ever turned off it would flood within 6 hours or so due to how much of it is under the water table.

 

[bramling]

The whole of the London Underground

Well, the underground bit anyway. I saw a decumentary somewhere that said if the pumps were ever turned off it would flood within 6 hours or so due to how much of it is under the water table.

Wouldn’t necessarily agree with this. Compared to something like the Merseyrail tunnels, LU is not only pretty dry, but also not particularly humid. There certainly are sumps and pumps in places, but it’s fair to say the lion’s share of the deep Tube tunnels are bone dry. The proof of this is that metal doesn’t tend to rust down there.

 

[furnessvale]

The whole of the London Underground

Well, the underground bit anyway. I saw a decumentary somewhere that said if the pumps were ever turned off it would flood within 6 hours or so due to how much of it is under the water table.

When I worked on BR in the 1970s, the section of the Victoria Line from Finsbury Park to Highbury and Islington was certainly dry. Yes, it had several sumps but no pumps were fitted in them, the idea being that in an emergency a portable pump could be deployed. This was never needed until one fateful day when I had a large section of the line exposed to the elements and a totally unexpected cloudburst appeared. The line was closed for several hours.

 

[melon68]

Clarborough tunnel between Retford and Gainsborough was pretty wet when I travelled through it in a DMU in the 80s. Probably limestone or sandstone bedrock, as the earlier posts have mentioned if you tunnel through pervious bedrock the inrush volumes can be considerable.....