WCML No compete

[plikma]

I read somewhere that Wrexham, Shropshire and Marylebone Railway were having difficulty with Wolverhampton because Virgin have a no compete agreement on the WCML. But doesn't that go against "EU Directive 91/440"? At the very least, it's challenging the whole ethos behind Open Access Operators. I'm starting to think it's a little bit of an unviable concept.

 

[Tom]

There is indeed a no competition agreement for the track access contract on Virgin West Coast. This agreement will expire, I believe, at the end of the current franchise term and then the line will be opened up to open access operators.

Not read the EU directive but I guess it probably came into force after the track access contract was agreed.

 

[Snapper]

There is indeed a no competition agreement for the track access contract on Virgin West Coast. This agreement will expire, I believe, at the end of the current franchise term and then the line will be opened up to open access operators.

I don't think so, because Grand Central have applied to ORR for paths on the WCML from 2009. Virgins WCML franchise doesn't expire until 2012. There would be no point in GC applying to ORR if there was a no competition agreement.

http://www.grandcentralrail.co.uk/news.html?id=news033

http://www.rail-reg.gov.uk/upload/pdf/tar-GrndCntrl_resp-150906.pdf

 

[87015]

Grand Central are not proposing to call anywhere as to not compete with Virgin. (Stockport would be pick up/set down to keep in). Remember Virgin have done all they can to get rid of the competition, barring the FNW services any sensible calling patterns or paths, and more recently being instrumental in the destruction of the Silverlink Birmingham-Euston service. Most of those passengers have shifted to Chiltern though rather than VT.

 

[Tom]

Ah, fair enough.

I knew the agreement expired at some point in the next few years and I had a memory block when the VWC franchise expires...

 

[Snapper]

Grand Central are not proposing to call anywhere as to not compete with Virgin. (Stockport would be pick up/set down to keep in). Remember Virgin have done all they can to get rid of the competition, barring the FNW services any sensible calling patterns or paths, and more recently being instrumental in the destruction of the Silverlink Birmingham-Euston service. Most of those passengers have shifted to Chiltern though rather than VT.

Hang on a minute. How can a London-Huddersfield (first stop Stockport) not compete with Virgin, especially as if it's a fast time it gives them an ORCATS advantage to/from Stockport?

 

[Tom]

Surely it depends what stock is used as to how fast the service is especially with the EPS on the Pendos with the tilt. I daresay that GC would probably choose to use high-speed DMUs (without tilt) or HSTs?

It depends on the time differential between the stops on two different services. Of course, if it's pick up only it wouldn't affect ORCATS as it wouldn't be advertised to call there.

 

[Snapper]

Surely it depends what stock is used as to how fast the service is especially with the EPS on the Pendos with the tilt. I daresay that GC would probably choose to use high-speed DMUs (without tilt) or HSTs?

It depends on the time differential between the stops on two different services. Of course, if it's pick up only it wouldn't affect ORCATS as it wouldn't be advertised to call there.

GC are proposing to use 140mph trains on the WCML service. Their letter of intent to ORR mentions nothing about pick-up/set down only.

So, allowing for this, they could well have the fastest journey time twixt Euston and Stockport, thus giving them an ORCAT's edge. Which I suspect is their whole intention in the first place...

 

[Tom]

Well, yes. It would make sense as it would be the only feasible way of keeping afloat, especially with the ORCATS raid they are attempting at York.