Wag 2 67s

[Michael.Y]

In your opinion. However, handling is surely only one part of the equation. Presumably these drivers have driven LHS before, if they are WAG1 drivers certainly they have, as well as Rugex and specials etc. They need to be familiar with differing controls, differing driving position (centre rather than offset), different acceleration and deceleration curves and the like.

The schedule may not appear to be moving at an accelerated pace to us mere observers, but it may be that behind the scenes (overnight perhaps?) there are other movements afoot that we are unaware of.

Let's wait and see what happens in March.

 

[TDK]

In your opinion. However, handling is surely only one part of the equation. Presumably these drivers have driven LHS before, if they are WAG1 drivers certainly they have, as well as Rugex and specials etc. They need to be familiar with differing controls, differing driving position (centre rather than offset), different acceleration and deceleration curves and the like.

The schedule may not appear to be moving at an accelerated pace to us mere observers, but it may be that behind the scenes (overnight perhaps?) there are other movements afoot that we are unaware of.

Let's wait and see what happens in March.

Michael I am sorry to dissapoint you but you do not sit central in a 67 - you cannot compare the acceleration with a light engine compared with a rake. The only thing a driver can gain is traction knowledge and the layout of the cab there is no point in training a driver on handling with a light loco. Mk2's are totally different from Mk3's under braking due to the disk brakes on the Mk3's for a driver to pass out on the 67/Mk3/DVT they have to do traction training including faults and failures on the set this includes the coaches and DVT, handling and an assessment at the end, only then can they be passed out to driver the set - unless WAG2 is going to be just a 67 it aint gonna start until they can get the coaches and the DVT's hitched up for training - the guards also have to be trained.

 

[IanXC]

unless WAG2 is going to be just a 67 it aint gonna start until they can get the coaches and the DVT's hitched up for training - the guards also have to be trained.

Maybe the couple of first class passengers the service seems to be designed for could be accommodated in the rear cab? :P

 

[The Planner]

Because it it is very expensive to hire most likely

£30K a day was the figure we were quoted back in the days of the WSMR test runs.

 

[TDK]

£30K a day was the figure we were quoted back in the days of the WSMR test runs.

I can well believe that planner - WSMR cost a lot of money to launch with the training, recruitment, refurb or stock and no input from government fund grants (except for the Wrexham station refurb) neither. I really can see why ATW do not want to hire the Company Train for just 2 runs a day each way.

 

[jones_bangor]

Maybe the couple of first class passengers the service seems to be designed for could be accommodated in the rear cab? :P

A very sceptical view. I can assure you the vast majority of passengers on WAG 1 are standard class.

There is no first class on WAG 2.

 

[Michael.Y]

A very sceptical view. I can assure you the vast majority of passengers on WAG 1 are standard class.

There is no standard class on WAG 2.

There's no standard class on WAG2? You sure about that?

 

[jones_bangor]

There's no standard class on WAG2? You sure about that?

lol:::: See edit!!

 

[Michael.Y]

lol:::: See edit!!

I do have a little joke with my passengers sometimes when they ask where the first class section is and where the buffet car is on the 175s. I say "It's all 1st Class".

 

[IanXC]

A very sceptical view. I can assure you the vast majority of passengers on WAG 1 are standard class.

There is no first class on WAG 2.

Yer I know, cheap joke I just couldn't resist!

 

[Rhydgaled]

Another DVT has apparently appeared in ATW livery. However, instead of being 82307 as had pretty much been confirmed it is 82308. That suggests there will be three ATW DVTs after all.

 

[Michael.Y]

Another DVT has apparently appeared in ATW livery. However, instead of being 82307 as had pretty much been confirmed it is 82308. That suggests there will be three ATW DVTs after all.

3 67s, 3 DVTs, makes sense.

 

[andypops]

Perhaps of interest to some people, I've seen a 67 heading a single Mk2 carriage (unsure what) and with a 57 DIT behind, quite regularly along the marches line over last week or so. Perhaps they're trying to add some weight for drivers to get a better feel now? There were 3 orange jackets in the cab that I saw at Maindee junct on Weds.

And one thing I would like to point out, is that WAG2 is quite well used between CDF and Sallop. The passenger counts fluctuate drastically (from around 30, I'd guess, to full + standing), but it is a useful service, and really does plug a gap in the timetables. I've found that a lot of fellow passengers from Cardiff think it is the ideal time for a service, even if they aren't going all the way to HHD it still has a purpose. Just hope the funding isn't pulled!

 

[jones_bangor]

Perhaps of interest to some people, I've seen a 67 heading a single Mk2 carriage (unsure what) and with a 57 DIT behind, quite regularly along the marches line over last week or so. Perhaps they're trying to add some weight for drivers to get a better feel now? There were 3 orange jackets in the cab that I saw at Maindee junct on Weds.

And one thing I would like to point out, is that WAG2 is quite well used between CDF and Sallop. The passenger counts fluctuate drastically (from around 30, I'd guess, to full + standing), but it is a useful service, and really does plug a gap in the timetables. I've found that a lot of fellow passengers from Cardiff think it is the ideal time for a service, even if they aren't going all the way to HHD it still has a purpose. Just hope the funding isn't pulled!

The funding is assured in the prioritised Wales Transport Plan.

 

[TDK]

3 67s, 3 DVTs, makes sense.

4 67's and 3 DVT's would make more sense

 

[Michael.Y]

Well AFAWK 67001, 67002, 67003 are in ATW colours. No word on any other unit except the EWS Management Train.

 

[Rhydgaled]

4 67's and 3 DVT's would make more sense

Why?

The funding is assured in the prioritised Wales Transport Plan.

For one service or two?

 

[jones_bangor]

For one service or two?

Both, and further improvements.

"Y Gerallt Gymro Holyhead to Cardiff fast train service, and programme of continued improvements".

As I've speculated elsewhere, I believe the Mk3 coaches will cascaded from Chiltern as Evergreen plug-doors come on line.

 

[Rhydgaled]

As I've speculated elsewhere, I believe the Mk3 coaches will cascaded from Chiltern as Evergreen plug-doors come on line.

Could well be, it does sound plausable although as I've said before I think if that happens they will remain siliver and just be a temporary measure.

"Y Gerallt Gymro Holyhead to Cardiff fast train service, and programme of continued improvements".

WAG 2 has never been called Y Gerallt Gymro has it? Sounds like only one train, though three DVTs does suggest two trains. Continued improvments I'd guess refers to linespeed improvments and/or Wrexham - Chester redoubling, although it could just mean re-routeing the train via Wrexham.

 

[headshot119]

Could well be, it does sound plausable although as I've said before I think if that happens they will remain siliver and just be a temporary measure.

WAG 2 has never been called Y Gerallt Gymro has it? Sounds like only one train, though three DVTs does suggest two trains. Continued improvments I'd guess refers to linespeed improvments and/or Wrexham - Chester redoubling, although it could just mean re-routeing the train via Wrexham.

As the Wrexham - Chester redoubling is going to take place it's a forgone conclusion that the WAGs will both run via Wrexham. And it is a definate AND with the speed improvements when they do the redoubling.

 

[jones_bangor]

As the Wrexham - Chester redoubling is going to take place it's a forgone conclusion that the WAGs will both run via Wrexham. And it is a definate AND with the speed improvements when they do the redoubling.

Both WAGs will run via Wrexham, but there's no certainty that Saltney - Wrexham will be redoubled. I suspect WAG 1 will continue via Crewe, but with 67, post May, switching to Wrexham after December. WAG 2 can move to 67 + DVT as soon as they're ready..........

 

[The Planner]

Both WAGs will run via Wrexham, but there's no certainty that Saltney - Wrexham will be redoubled.

More certain than it ever has been, into GRIP 5-8 last I heard.

 

[TDK]

Why?

For one service or two?

It is always a good plan to have a spare loco in the pool as locos do fail and do need exams - by only having 3 & 3 DVT's all out in service is a recipe for disaster. WSMR had 5 in their pool with the option of 029 being borrowed (agreed with DBS), Chiltern have 5 for a set of 4 needed - for you to ask why sir shows that you do not quite understand the running of these types of service. However there isn't a problem of ATW putting a 150 in place I suppose instead of the spare loco.

 

[headshot119]

Both WAGs will run via Wrexham, but there's no certainty that Saltney - Wrexham will be redoubled. I suspect WAG 1 will continue via Crewe, but with 67, post May, switching to Wrexham after December. WAG 2 can move to 67 + DVT as soon as they're ready..........

I think there is a certainty that the redoubling is going to happen.

 

[Rhydgaled]

It is always a good plan to have a spare loco in the pool as locos do fail and do need exams - by only having 3 & 3 DVT's all out in service is a recipe for disaster. WSMR had 5 in their pool with the option of 029 being borrowed (agreed with DBS), Chiltern have 5 for a set of 4 needed - for you to ask why sir shows that you do not quite understand the running of these types of service. However there isn't a problem of ATW putting a 150 in place I suppose instead of the spare loco.

I know you couldn't have 3 sets in service with 3 locos, you need a spare. However I assume you need a spare DVT too.

3 DVTs & 3 Locos = 2 rakes in service and one spare rake*

4 locos and 3 DVTs would suggest to me that you need 2 spare locos but only 1 spare DVT.

*maybe the spare rake would only need to consist of a loco and DVT with one buffet car and one ordinary coach, would you be likely to lose more than one coach at a time?

 

[TDK]

I know you couldn't have 3 sets in service with 3 locos, you need a spare. However I assume you need a spare DVT too.

3 DVTs & 3 Locos = 2 rakes in service and one spare rake*

4 locos and 3 DVTs would suggest to me that you need 2 spare locos but only 1 spare DVT.

*maybe the spare rake would only need to consist of a loco and DVT with one buffet car and one ordinary coach, would you be likely to lose more than one coach at a time?

As previously quoted the most important thing is a spare loco as the DVT's hardly fail as there isn't much on them to fail

 

[Big Chris]

DVT's still need maintenance and can fail so stock needs some kind of slack in availability for exams and unplanned repair work. Three sets screams two out of three in service daily, unfortunately as with any micro fleet, stock utilisation will not be great.

 

[anthony263]

Friday 23rd March is expected to be the final day of 57 haulage on WAG1 with a class 67 taking over from the following Monday.

 

[barrykas]

As I've speculated elsewhere, I believe the Mk3 coaches will cascaded from Chiltern as Evergreen plug-doors come on line.

Except Chiltern need all of the Mk 3s to cover the existing diagrams, and to cover for the set that's at Wabtec, so the only "spare" DB Mk 3s are the ones in store, which are pretty much still in ex-VT condition I believe.

And even after the powr door conversion programme is complete, I wouldn't be surprised to find the "spare" rake being used to give an extra LHCS diagram.

Cheers,

Barry

 

[Rhydgaled]

Except Chiltern need all of the Mk 3s to cover the existing diagrams, and to cover for the set that's at Wabtec, so the only "spare" DB Mk 3s are the ones in store, which are pretty much still in ex-VT condition I believe.

I think there are two sets at Wabtec, and I've read no indication that Chiltern are struggling without them. I think it is quite plausable that, once the first set gets back, they could lend a silver slam-door ex-WSMR set to ATW as a temporary measure (instead of sending the rake to Wabtec, so only one rake would be in instead of the current two) until coaches refubished especially for ATW are ready. When that happens, the silver coaches could go into Wabtec for their power doors and then go to strenthen Chiltern's fleet.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Friday 23rd March is expected to be the final day of 57 haulage on WAG1 with a class 67 taking over from the following Monday.

:cry: 67s not as nice to look at as 57s. I hope the DVTs and coaches are ready soon then having 67s rather than 57s will have some benifits (allowing that 175 from WAG2 to get back on franchise work).