VTEC to drop branding

[Bletchleyite]

I've rarely used their train service, so can't really comment on that. I was referring to the music shops (closed), cola (abandoned?), airline (actually not that bad, but several routes recently abandoned and in some financial difficulties I believe), cable TV service, "space" flights, etc.

Fair point on some of them, but not the music shops. Other than specialist vinyl retailers, which are mainly small independents, the concept of a "music shop" is dead; media is now consumed almost exclusively online or purchased in physical form via Amazon and the likes. They got out at the right time.

 

[Agent_c]

Fair point on some of them, but not the music shops. Other than specialist vinyl retailers, which are mainly small independents, the concept of a "music shop" is dead; media is now consumed almost exclusively online or purchased in physical form via Amazon and the likes. They got out at the right time.

Actually, they got out a bit too late. They were sold to Management for £1 when they became Zavvi.

 

[johnnychips]

Sir Richard Branson bring out the Marmite in people. I really seem to dislike him, though I've no rational reason why. But my best friend thinks he's wonderful, but when pressed, he can't say why either. Bit like Lady Di.

 

[jon0844]

I worked for him briefly (a company bought by Virgin) and I've always had loads of respect for him.

I just find it strange that so many people think he's so fantastic when he got to where he got today by being as ruthless as anyone else. It's business at the end of the day.

Yes, he does generally treat staff well and is (was) accessible by any employee, but let's not pretend he's some sort of God.

He's exceptionally good at PR and always has been. It's one reason why you have to wonder how Virgin will do when he's gone, just like many people can see a definite change in the way Apple does things post Steve Jobs.

 

[thenorthern]

I don't see that they can - although they will both be using Virgin Trains as their brand, they are still separate TOCs.

When it was VXC and VWC they both used VT as a code although they remained separate companies owned by Virgin Rail Group unlike the current arrangement.

 

[Tetchytyke]

When it was VXC and VWC they both used VT as a code although they remained separate companies owned by Virgin Rail Group unlike the current arrangement.

VTWC and VTEC are much more different than VTXC and VTWC were. For one thing, Virgin only own 10% of VTEC, the rest is Stagecoach (hence the VTEC livery being a lot more swirly, and hence why it also looks like Ray Stenning knocked it out in his lunch break).

 

[JaJaWa]

VTWC and VTEC are much more different than VTXC and VTWC were. For one thing, Virgin only own 10% of VTEC, the rest is Stagecoach (hence the VTEC livery being a lot more swirly, and hence why it also looks like Ray Stenning knocked it out in his lunch break).

Pretty sure it's to (try and) mask the age of the trains!

 

[CharlieSpotted]

I've rarely used their train service, so can't really comment on that. I was referring to the music shops (closed), cola (abandoned?), airline (actually not that bad, but several routes recently abandoned and in some financial difficulties I believe), cable TV service, "space" flights, etc.

I always wondered what happened to Virgin Cola. It was absolutely my favourite cola.

In 2007, Silver Spring acquired the UK licence from Princes limited. However, in 2012 the company fell into administration and ceased production. No company acquired the UK Virgin Cola licence in its place.

Today, despite the collapse of Virgin Cola in the United Kingdom, Virgin Cola is still sold in Afghanistan, Bangladesh, France, Italy, Japan, Kosovo, Malta, Nigeria, China, Switzerland, Tunisia, and Philippines. Virgin Drinks has since fallen, but bottling companies in these countries have acquired the license.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virgin_Cola

I'm going to start a petition to bring back Virgin Cola. Alongside Seabrook Hot & Spicy crisps.

 

[JaJaWa]

I always wondered what happened to Virgin Cola. It was absolutely my favourite cola.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virgin_Cola

I'm going to start a petition to bring back Virgin Cola. Alongside Seabrook Hot & Spicy crisps.

If you believe him, here's what Richard had to say about Virgin Cola's failure: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fs81YyfbAc0

 

[billio]

....
Yes, he does generally treat staff well and is (was) accessible by any employee, but let's not pretend he's some sort of God.
....

Did anyone here have the pleasure of attending one of those massive, free staff parties he held at his Kidlington home (and adjoining fields).

 

[jon0844]

Did anyone here have the pleasure of attending one of those massive, free staff parties he held at his Kidlington home (and adjoining fields).

No, but I went to a few events he organised for the press. Crazy, and nearly always involving showgirls without many clothes.

These days he'd be slated on social media as being totally sexist.

 

[GatwickDepress]

No, but I went to a few events he organised for the press. Crazy, and nearly always involving showgirls without many clothes.

These days he'd be slated on social media as being totally sexist.

Relative of mine went to one of those. He described it as being like an "overworked gynecologist"; i.e. surrounded by...

 

[CharlieSpotted]

If you believe him, here's what Richard had to say about Virgin Cola's failure: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fs81YyfbAc0

I believe him to a point when he suggests they were muscled out, but there's an interesting contradiction there. At the start he describes Virgin Cola as "tasting better" (I agree...) and later all colas as "much of a muchness". Hmm.

(Thanks for the link)

 

[Stats]

Inter City Railways have not dropped the VTEC brand, rather the use of Virgin Trains is part of a joint marketing campaign under the Virgin Trains "masterbrand".

https://www.virgintrainseastcoast.c...cross-both-east-and-west-coast-routes-1219940

VIRGIN TRAINS ANNOUNCES JOINT INTEGRATED MARKETING CAMPAIGN ACROSS BOTH EAST AND WEST COAST ROUTES

Press Release • Sep 18, 2015 10:01 BST

Virgin Trains today announces that it is launching a combined integrated marketing campaign – the first time the two rail franchises have worked together in this way.

With a vision to become one of the UK’s best loved brands the campaign intends to be bigger, bolder and braver than ever before, whilst retaining the wit and humour of the Virgin brand. Using the creative strapline, “Be Bound for Glory”, the campaign builds on the insight that long-distance travel is usually for something important — whether that’s a big business meeting or meeting the in-laws for the first time – so Virgin Trains will help customers arrive prepared to tackle whatever life may throw their way. The campaign also builds on and reinforces Virgin Trains as leaders in customer experience.

Katie Knowles, Marketing Director of Virgin Trains on the West Coast, said: “This campaign is fundamentally about how our amazing Virgin Trains experience enables our customers to be ready to take on the world. We know people travel long distances for important things, so we want to show people really ‘nailing it’ when they arrive. “Be Bound for Glory”, which is a big, bold statement that only Virgin Trains could make, does just this.”

Danny Gonzalez, Marketing and Sales Director of Virgin Trains on the East Coast, said: “Whilst we’re technically two separate businesses, we are all part of the Virgin family. By combining under one masterbrand for this campaign we want to show that, whichever line you travel on, you will still receive the same customer service, comfort and speed for which Virgin is renowned, and wherever your destination, we’ll get you there ready to take on the world.”

[my bold]

Virgin Trains East Coast is the brand name of InterCity Railways Ltd (ICR),

 

[JaJaWa]

Inter City Railways have not dropped the VTEC brand, rather the use of Virgin Trains is part of a joint marketing campaign under the Virgin Trains "masterbrand".

https://www.virgintrainseastcoast.c...cross-both-east-and-west-coast-routes-1219940

The bit at the bottom isn't attached to the press release and hasn't been updated. That release says Virgin Trains on the West Coast and Virgin Trains on the East Coast rather than the former names Virgin Trains and Virgin Trains East Coast. Signs and announcements have been updated.

 

[Stats]

The bit at the bottom isn't attached to the press release and hasn't been updated.

yes it is. Its at the bottom under notes for editors.

That release says Virgin Trains on the West Coast and Virgin Trains on the East Coast rather than the former names Virgin Trains and Virgin Trains East Coast.

Its part of the marketing campaign to refer to them like that. Particularly given lazy journalists tendency these days to copy and paste press releases verbatim.

Signs and announcements have been updated.

You can tell that from Hong Kong?

 

[Marton]

What will this mean for ticket pricing where there is competition. .

Huddersfield to London return £352 via Manchester. £230 any permitted which allows travel either way including via Manchester.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

What will this mean for ticket pricing where there is competition. .
Huddersfield to London return £352 via Manchester. £230 any permitted which allows travel either way including via Manchester.

Nothing. It's just a route-neutral marketing campaign on which VT and VTEC are sharing costs.
It also reinforces the wider brand.
Advert time during Downton Abbey must be pretty expensive.
It was so memorable I don't remember seeing it!

 

[northernchris]

Signs and announcements have been updated.

They are still being announced as Virgin Trains East Coast at Leeds today

 

[thenorthern]

Images of Virgin Trains East Coast have appeared on Virgin Trains website now.

To be honest having Virgin Trains and Virgin Trains East Coast was rather confusing and had it of been Virgin West Coast and Virgin East Coast it would have been easier.

 

[Masbroughlad]

So why don't other multiple franchise holders use one brand? DB Trains, Govia Trains, Stagecoach Trains etc.....?

 

[Bletchleyite]

So why don't other multiple franchise holders use one brand? DB Trains, Govia Trains, Stagecoach Trains etc.....?

That isn't so much the issue. The issue is that the strong brand, Virgin Trains, is first in one case, and is the *only* brand in the other. It's also that the two compete/complement one another in the London-Scotland market.

If it was West Coast, operated by Virgin, or East Coast, operated by Virgin, there would be a clear differential.

Even renaming West Coast to "Virgin Trains West Coast" would emphasize a difference.

 

[Pinza-C55]

Our national rail system takes another step towards being a circus.

 

[thenorthern]

So why don't other multiple franchise holders use one brand? DB Trains, Govia Trains, Stagecoach Trains etc.....?

Because Virgin Trains operate only inter-city services that start in London and run to Scotland with some spurs off along the way where as other companies operate a diverse range of services that include local and long distance sometimes at other ends of the country.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

So why don't other multiple franchise holders use one brand? DB Trains, Govia Trains, Stagecoach Trains etc.....?

Arriva are (at last) putting the DB logo on XC and CH services as well as ATW.
First used to put its brand in the TOC title, but is going the other way with GWR.
NX did not put its brand on its trains when it started out, but in the second franchise round began to do so (NXEC, NXEA).
Having lost those franchises it never got round to rebranding c2c and has given up on the idea.
I can't remember if c2c trains have a small NX logo or not.
Govia is an odd one. One of its TOCs is officially Govia Thameslink Railway, but you don't see this name on the trains.
Southeastern and London Midland are not Govia branded at all.
The Abellio brand is a bit more visible, but not on Merseyrail.

 

[BurtonM]

c2c is branded - the trains are white with dark blue doors and carry c2c and NX logos with equal prominence.

 

[LUKAnorthwest]

the new virgintrains (WEST coast) website can be very tricky to use at present. a lot of grunting has been coming from my mouth over the past month booking tickets.

it took 3-4 mins for me to find the log in button the other night.

i have noticed that they have removed their link to the virgin trains (EAST coast) website.

still can't complain when your manchester to london ticket cost 13.20 each way!

 

[SaveECRewards]

I had the following reply from VTEC's Marketing Director when asking about the branding (I was also told something similar during Wednesday's VTEC wine tasting session):

The move is toward both businesses using the same logo and being labelled as VT unless something specifically needs calling out as one or the other which will be done in typography. The feedback we received was that the general public viewed us as both the same anyway and that the VTEC logo mechanic made the East Coast business feel like a sub brand and VT as the master. It is also something many of our staff had been asking for.

My response was along that lines that VTEC still feels like a sub-brand if VT is VT all the time and VTEC adds 'East Coast' when the need to distinguish arises.

I've been subsequently told they're still working out some of the finer details with VT(WC) in order to reduce the confusion for passengers while still being able to take advantage of the Virgin brand to jointly promote the franchises.

I was asked the URL of this discussion so VTEC marketing will be reading this so let them know how you feel, good or bad!

 

[Bodiddly]

Confusion for passengers happens anyway. Take the current scenario where two trains leave Glasgow QS for Inverness within roughly half an hour of each other. The 14.41 via Aberdeen takes nearly 5 hours and the 15.07 via Perth takes a little over 3 hours. With a £46 difference in ticket prices it can be an expensive mistake to make. I know because I've arrived at QS, saw this train on the board and jumped on it. I got off at Perth because I didn't want an onward 4 hour journey home!
My point is, these are both run by Scotrail, not other operators and both services show as Inverness on the main board. it's only under more scrutiny that you see the stations they call at.
The VT confusion can only really happen in certain places because the routes are mostly different. A particular emphasis to clarity has to be made in Edinburgh or Glasgow as both East Coast and West Coast use the stations.

 

[Blindtraveler]

Im all for this, along with a standardisation of onboard service too. Waverley still announced the 12:30 To KGX and the 12:51 to EUS as Virgin Trains East Coast and Virgin Trains respectively yesturday. On a side note however if just Virgin Trains is to be used on things like announcements at stations like Waverley, the Eustons really maybe should be announced as Virgin Trains Service to London Euston Via Birmingham to avoid more muddled pax.