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VTEC bad weather policy

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Nick66

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I have received this email from VTEC

Due to the heavy snow and extreme weather conditions in some parts of the country, we have lifted travel restrictions across all of our services on Wednesday 28th February, Thursday 1st March and Friday 2nd March. This means that if you are booked to travel on a Virgin Trains East Coast service today, you may travel on an earlier or later service than booked, or you may defer your travel until Thursday or Friday if this is preferable. If you do choose to defer your travel until Thursday or Friday, please travel on a train which is close to the time of your original booked service. As a result, our services may be busier than usual

I have an advance ticket for the 20:00 on Friday. Does this mean I can get an earlier train on Friday? It’s not entirely clear from the email but that is how I would read it. It would certainly be useful because it would mean I could get a bus home rather than asking my better half to pick me up from the station in this weather.
 
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robbeech

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Absolutely, you can get any train on Friday, of course, the closer to your intended one the better to help them out as they try and help you out but essentially all tickets valid over the next 3 days are valid on any service.
 

bb21

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Suitable connections to your chosen service for the main leg would be permitted.

No guard is going to quibble in this weather.
 

yorkie

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@bb21 If you make a different journey to the one originally booked (e.g. depart early afternoon instead of in the evening), are you definitely entitled to claim Delay Repay based on the actual departure time?

Or are you deemed ineligible if you made a journey many hours earlier than originally booked but only arrived a few minutes earlier than originally booked?

I can see VTEC's customer service staff arguing on this one; some of them are not exactly pro-customer....
 

Ianno87

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yorkie

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It's just a request, and one that has caused some confusion and angst. Restrictions are lifted.
 

robbeech

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One could argue that if the time (and date) restrictions are lifted from your ticket and it becomes open to use on any train then you essentially have a SOS, SVS, etc. If you take an earlier train and are delayed then you could still be eligible as they work it out based on the delay to your journey (oh no! that dreaded J word again).

Of course i can also see the arguments the other way.
 

attics26

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yorkie, can only imagine ONE guard/train manager that would ever have a problem with accepting earlier travel, no gateline I know would have a problem, re delay repay if you arrived somewhere near your originally expected time why would you think you were entitled to anything, pro-customer is one thing, taking the piss is another
 

bb21

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@bb21 If you make a different journey to the one originally booked (e.g. depart early afternoon instead of in the evening), are you definitely entitled to claim Delay Repay based on the actual departure time?

Or are you deemed ineligible if you made a journey many hours earlier than originally booked but only arrived a few minutes earlier than originally booked?

I can see VTEC's customer service staff arguing on this one; some of them are not exactly pro-customer....
I am not aware of any clear guidance, so no idea what the official position is, or should be, I'm afraid.

The only contractual obligation I know of is paying compensation according to delays against the contracted arrival time. This may seem unfair to those holding Advance tickets, as people with walk-on fares can essentially claim their revised departure time as their original intention and given any benefit of the doubt, but on the flip side, it can be argued people with walk-on fares were not tied down to any particular itinerary so they did not need the "favour" of restrictions being relaxed. (Yes, I know people with Off-Peak fares may still benefit in theory by using what is essentially a Peak/barred service on their ticket, but the point about flexibility still applies.) The relaxation of travel restrictions does not make an Advance ticket a walk-on ticket.

I have never handled any such claim as suggested (not that I remember anyway), so I am unable to speak from experience either. If someone travelled several hours early and only arrived marginally before the original itinerary, they would in all likelihood have been delayed several hours, in which case it falls firmly within the realm of goodwill gestures, as extended delays can cause hardship but this is more or less assessed on a case-by-case basis. I normally use 2 hours as benchmark for this but can be reduced if mitigating factors apply. Three hours would be widely recognised as payable to some extent.

Anyone delayed sufficiently so as to arrive 30 minutes (15 minutes on some schemes) or more later than the original itinerary would still be contractually entitled to compensation, even if departed origin earlier.

That leaves those who travelled slightly earlier but delayed up to 2 hours although still arrived within the 15-/30-minute margin of the original itinerary, I am not aware of any compensation arrangement that specifically covered that unfortunately. I would likely consider these on a case-by-case basis if faced with one.
 

yorkie

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yorkie, can only imagine ONE guard/train manager that would ever have a problem...
I am sure many people reading this know exactly who you mean, but even he can't do anything if restrictions are lifted!

(I know he's tried to say via Peterborough tickets aren't valid via Peterborough though, so I guess he might try it...?)
 

bb21

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One could argue that if the time (and date) restrictions are lifted from your ticket and it becomes open to use on any train then you essentially have a SOS, SVS, etc. If you take an earlier train and are delayed then you could still be eligible as they work it out based on the delay to your journey (oh no! that dreaded J word again).

Of course i can also see the arguments the other way.
An Advance fare does not become a walk-on fare due to restrictions being lifted. Conditions relevant to the fare type (eg. on refunds) still apply as normal unless, again, these were explicitly waived.

I see where you are coming from, but I don't think the argument works.
 

Nick66

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Interesting discussion, in my case I am basically looking to get a train an hour or two earlier than booked, to make onward travel easier and above all safer, in the conditions. It would never enter my mind to claim Delay Repay if my chosen train was late nor under the seat guarantee if I have to stand, the flexibility has to come from both sides, I just think the wording from VTEC could be a little clearer.
 

robbeech

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An Advance fare does not become a walk-on fare due to restrictions being lifted. Conditions relevant to the fare type (eg. on refunds) still apply as normal unless, again, these were explicitly waived.

I see where you are coming from, but I don't think the argument works.

No i appreciate this it was said at least partially in jest.
As Nick says above (and others) that there has to be some give and take. They're doing what they can and some decisions might not be perfect but they will continue to try to help so its ideal if passengers do their bit.
 

Wallsendmag

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Interesting discussion, in my case I am basically looking to get a train an hour or two earlier than booked, to make onward travel easier and above all safer, in the conditions. It would never enter my mind to claim Delay Repay if my chosen train was late nor under the seat guarantee if I have to stand, the flexibility has to come from both sides, I just think the wording from VTEC could be a little clearer.
It's very clear now "Don't travel"
 

CaptainHaddock

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On a slightly similar note , what's VTEC's bad weather policy if, rather than travelling on a different day, you decide not to travel at all? I'm booked to travel from Sheffield to Hitchin on Saturday on advance tickets that would normally be non-refundable.
 

robbeech

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You are entitled to a full refund without admin charges on a day with severe disruption.
Not sure what Saturday will be like so difficult to tell. You might be able to get a refund with no charges as a gesture of goodwill if you did it today.
 

yorkie

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On a slightly similar note , what's VTEC's bad weather policy if, rather than travelling on a different day, you decide not to travel at all? I'm booked to travel from Sheffield to Hitchin on Saturday on advance tickets that would normally be non-refundable.
If a train you are booked to catch is cancelled or delayed, or if the advice is not to travel, a full refund can be obtained from the retailer.

That applies to any ticket type and there is no admin fee.

Some retailers handle such situations better than others.
 

_toommm_

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If a train you are booked to catch is cancelled or delayed, or if the advice is not to travel, a full refund can be obtained from the retailer.

That applies to any ticket type and there is no admin fee.

Some retailers handle such situations better than others.

Sheffield being on the lesser end of the scale with being able to find obscure tickets or do anything out of the ordinary (I.e. refunding advances)
 

route:oxford

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Looks like I'll be following VTEC's request and cancelling my journey tomorrow.

However, like many people, I've bought 2 single tickets to make a return journey. Is it going to be plain sailing to get the "return" journey refunded or will there be rejections and a small claims court application?
 

yorkie

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Did you buy them from the same retailer? Where did you buy them?
 

westv

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I have an AP ticket for tomorrow for the 17:19 to Hull (which was cancelled today) and I will certainly be getting any service a lot earlier if I think it wise
.
 

Nick66

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It's very clear now "Don't travel"

Yes, I saw that, a transport company advising people not to travel? Unfortunately that's not really an option for me, although if it became the only option I would be entitled to a full fee-free refund, but what about my journey back down on Sunday? That ticket would become superfluous but it wasn't booked as part of a return journey as the weekend advances only become available 3 months after the weekday ones.
 

Haywain

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Out and back tickets will be regarded as a return for refund purposes regardless of being bought together. As for advising not to travel, this is eminently sensible advice in current circumstances. They will appreciate that some people feel they have to travel, but it does a lot to ease the pressure at a difficult time.
 

Wallsendmag

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Yes, I saw that, a transport company advising people not to travel? Unfortunately that's not really an option for me, although if it became the only option I would be entitled to a full fee-free refund, but what about my journey back down on Sunday? That ticket would become superfluous but it wasn't booked as part of a return journey as the weekend advances only become available 3 months after the weekday ones.
Freezing conditions drifting snow , five to six feet snow drifts across the main line in Northumberland. A1 closed between Alnwick and Berwick. As a Geordie that sounds like a normal summer but it's not the weather tobe travelling in.
 

Nick66

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At KGX now thanks to an understanding boss, quiet for a Friday but VTEC are doing a great job. They get a lot of criticism but I have been travelling every week for a year now and can’t fault the service nor the staff. Some (a small minority) of the passengers are obnoxious but you can’t have everything.
 
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