VT West coast or VTEC?

[mrredrunner100]

Hi

me and my mate will be ending up in thurso near the end of a all line rover, and we cant decide wether to use VT west coast or east coast back to london, the timings work out that we should be able to do it however which line is the nicest line to use?

thanks

mrredrunner100

 

[causton]

Depends...

West Coast has better views at the north end but you might not see much of them from a Pendolino.
East Coast has nice views of the sea at the north end though, more chance of getting a seat with a window you can see out of, and IMO a train that doesn't make you feel like you're trapped in...

 

[Searle]

I prefer East Coast, but I can understand if people disagree with me! Both of them are pretty nice, so it's just personal preference.

 

[Mojo]

The ECML south of York must be one of the most boring railway lines out there, but it has the better trains, power sockets at a higher proportion of seats, better windoweat alignment and less irritating sounds.

 

[30907]

Will it be daylight by the time you are south of York? If not, it doesn't matter that it's a bit flatter than the WCML.

Do you have time to go off-route on that stretch? If so, the MML, or a détour through Fenland, might add variety?

 

[Iskra]

WC- better, more interesting route. Especially North of Preston.

EC- better rolling stock. But the route is still interesting above Northallerton especially further North. Also, EC trains start from further North, so you'd have to spend less time on local/regional trains depending on times. Also you wouldn't have to change stations like you may have to at Glasgow by going West Coast.

 

[me123]

The ECML south of York must be one of the most boring railway lines out there, but it has the better trains, power sockets at a higher proportion of seats, better windoweat alignment and less irritating sounds.

Plus the scenery North of York is wonderful. I don't know how you plan on coming back down, but you can get VTEC from either Inverness or Aberdeen and have a really beautiful ride down. The Aberdeen trains have both the Forth and Tay bridges, and genuinely have really nice scenery out over the North Sea. The Highland Chieftain from Inverness starts off on the dramatic Highland Mainline and, for the next few weeks, is also diverted over the Forth Bridge. South of Edinburgh, there's still really dramatic views over the North Sea and, whilst the line South of York may not be all that interesting, the line North of York has some really beautiful points as well, and you do get some really nice views of Newcastle.

WCML does have its advantages, with really beautiful scenery through the Lake District. I think the tilting is really quite fun and you feel like you're going really fast. However, as has been said, there's a chance you'll get poor window alignment and be stuck staring at a plastic wall for four-and-a-half hours.

If I were you, I'd go for the Highland Chieftain, particularly if it's being diverted over the Forth Bridge. I think it's probably one of the best journeys you can do anywhere at the moment.

If you're doing an ALR, however, I'm guessing you'll be going up to Thurso by some way, so you don't have to miss out one of the mainlines! You can catch a Pendo up and come down the East Coast, or vice versa. If so, I think come up via Glasgow on the WCML, and make your way back home down the ECML on the Chieftain* for a showstopper finish to your rover.

*Or, if the timings don't work for the Chieftain specifically, you can make the same journey with a Scotrail connection

 

[Bletchleyite]

EC- better rolling stock

Debatable. Many people, me included, find the seats cause severe back pain after a very short time because the squab slopes the wrong way. I would only consider travelling East Coast in First Class as a result; if not possible I would drive.

Doesn't affect everyone, but bear it in mind if you've never been on EC before.

Also I find the EC scenery tedious. Take a Pendolino, find (reserve, if you think it'll be busy) a seat with a view, and enjoy the mountains.

 

[radamfi]

I also suffer pain when travelling on EC seats. I had no such problem with the original BR seats.

 

[Iskra]

Debatable. Many people, me included, find the seats cause severe back pain after a very short time because the squab slopes the wrong way. I would only consider travelling East Coast in First Class as a result; if not possible I would drive.

Doesn't affect everyone, but bear it in mind if you've never been on EC before.

Also I find the EC scenery tedious. Take a Pendolino, find (reserve, if you think it'll be busy) a seat with a view, and enjoy the mountains.

I've only been in standard once on EC- usually travel 1st due to cheap advances. I didn't notice anything wrong with the seats on a HST, but I had just come off a 156 for 2 hours so it probably seemed good at the time!

Personally, I do like Virgin Pendolino's but they are less peaceful than the East Coast stock. I'm not that anti Voyager either but if they're busy they can be awful.

I think the stretch between Lancaster and Penrith and then Lockerbie-Carstairs are unbeatable but the rest of the WCML is fairly average. But then you could say the same about the East Coast- South of Doncaster is plain boring.

I think it's much of a muchness this question. Personally, I'd go East- especially if starting from Inverness/Aberdeen, but tbh I'd be fairly happy with either.

Edit- what I do like about the WCML option is that the stops are less frequent on a fast train- e.g last stop Southbound being Warrington, rather than stopping fairly frequently like East Coast services seem to.

 

[Segedunum]

Edit- what I do like about the WCML option is that the stops are less frequent on a fast train- e.g last stop Southbound being Warrington, rather than stopping fairly frequently like East Coast services seem to.

The slower ones can be stopping fairly often but the normal fasts are last stop York for much of the day.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

... and then Lockerbie-Carstairs are unbeatable but the rest of the WCML is fairly average.

One of my favourite stretches of line in the UK is Carlisle to Carstairs, partly because, as you allude to, the scenery, but also because the Pendolinos really open up on it, you can feel the power of them working there like nowhere else I've found. It's just a shame that north of Motherwell in the Down, or south of Gretna in the Up you usually crawl along for the final few miles!

 

[Minilad]

Personally for me it would be EC all the way every time. Especially if on a HST
But I am biased as I would rather walk from Glasgow to London than do it on one of Branson's tilting monstrosities

 

[Techniquest]

West Coast for the scenery and tilting, but if you get an HST then a fast run down the East Coast can also be nice for the speed.

Wouldn't do East Coast if on a MK4 as the ride is horribly bouncy and generally un-nice. MK3s don't have the same problem though.

Enjoy the ALR!

 

[Kite159]

Agreed, Mk4s don't give the best ride.

If coming back via the East Coast, aim for a HST

For the West Coast, aim for the fast glasgow service (i.e. non-stop after Warrington) rather than the one which goes via Birmingham.

 

[FQ]

For me it would be VTEC every time, but the ride is much nicer on an HST than a 91. The HSTs work all the services from Aberdeen and the 1 a day from Inverness plus plenty more but the trains that run under the wires all of the was are mostly 91+MK4s. But the MK3s (on HSTs) and MK4s (on 91s) have large windows, don't feel claustrophobic and don't smell of the onboard toilet (I know not all 390s smell like that but a lot do).

 

[Tim R-T-C]

I'd go with the East Coast HST from one of the northern cities any day. I dislike the clinical lighting and, as mentioned above, latrine smell of the 390s.

Plus, opening vestibule windows for those great photos.

 

[DarloRich]

East Coast every time. Much more comfortable trains

 

[Bletchleyite]

East Coast every time. Much more comfortable trains

Those seats are a real matter of opinion. They look nice, but I can't sit in one for more than half an hour without severe back pain. A stupid piece of design.

 

[Tim R-T-C]

Those seats are a real matter of opinion. They look nice, but I can't sit in one for more than half an hour without severe back pain. A stupid piece of design.

Are 390s better?

Maybe I'm immune after a few long haul flights last year!

 

[DarloRich]

Those seats are a real matter of opinion. They look nice, but I can't sit in one for more than half an hour without severe back pain. A stupid piece of design.

well there is something wrong with you then. See a Dr. I can sit in them all day and I have a bad back. Virgin train seats cut the circulation of to my legs after about 60 minutes

 

[Bletchleyite]

Are 390s better?

Maybe I'm immune after a few long haul flights last year!

Every single rail vehicle in the UK is better, even a 142 bus bench. Only the Mk4s have the flawed single-piece seat design which causes the seat squab to slope forwards rather than backwards and thus provides no under-thigh support whatsoever.

 

[TheNewNo2]

I don't like the seats on East Coast either, they make my backside numb and I can generally never get comfy.

West Coast.

Oh, and to the person who said the ECML south of York was boring, have you never been on the Midland Main Line?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Oh, and to the person who said the ECML south of York was boring, have you never been on the Midland Main Line?

I like the south WCML. The bit through the Chilterns is really quite scenic, and further North it's very much English green, rolling hills.

 

[mrredrunner100]

Thanks for all the advice!

Looking at our plan we will be using VTEC from York upwards to edinborough and Inverness so we probably will do VTWC back, then we would've done both

 

[me123]

Looking at our plan we will be using VTEC from York upwards to edinborough and Inverness so we probably will do VTWC back, then we would've done both

Good plan. I'd want to get a sample of both if I was in your position.

If you're going to book seats on your Pendolino, have a look at this diagram, showing which seats have "limited view" (i.e. you'll be looking at a pillar of plastic for 4h30).

If you're going FC, you won't need to worry as much of course!