Voyagers v Meridians

[mrcheek]

Voyagers are one of the least popular trains on the network. But I gather Meridians are slightly different, and are much more popular.

But what exactly are the differences? Perhaps you could all enlighten me.

 

[ainsworth74]

I've not travelled all that much on Meridians but in my experience the internal environment is better, they are less cramped (I think because the body shell doesn't have a tilt profile). I also prefer the seats on Meridians (but seating is always subjective). I'm not sure but I also think the noise and vibration from the engines might also have been better damped, but that could be me imagining things

 

[devon_metro]

Same body shell! I think changes in the interior is the main plus factor.

 

[Crossforth]

I was gunna say, I though it was the same body shell, may just be the interior décor that makes it look brighter.

I personally don't know having never travelled on a 222

 

[Fincra5]

For me it has to be Meridians, although they have the same profile as voyagers they feel far less cramped, they also look a lot better.

 

[ainsworth74]

Same body shell!

Fair enough, wasn't sure either way!

 

[starrymarkb]

Most of the differences are internal. Though I will say the solid pairs of airline seats do look a bit forboding...

The internal layout is different because the lack of tilt gear means more equipment can go under the floor

 

[Ivo]

An overviews of the Meridian (considering I've only travelled on a 222 the once, and then it was First Class at night):

They look better on the inside, they look better on the outside.
They look less cramped on the inside, they look less cramped on the outside.
They feel faster, and are quieter.
And the staff are decent! (And, as I found out, sometimes quite, um, nice? )

 

[generalvegitable]

Meridians are waaaaaaaaaay better, they are much more comfortable, (I have to say that they have to be the most comfortable DMUs on the mainline that I have used), they feel faster, they look more stylish, and the toilets do not stink the place out whenever they are flushed.

 

[richw]

And the staff are decent! (And, as I found out, sometimes quite, um, nice? )

i suppose staff quality comes to down to moral from quality of their work environment, if your in a horrible work environment you work less with less happiness than in a good environment!

 

[Greenback]

The way you are treated by your employers also has an impact on morale!

 

[RPM]

Much as I like the interior of the Meridians I was quite surprised how shabby they are looking the last time I travelled by EMT. Is there a refurbishment in the pipeline?

 

[Crossforth]

Much as I like the interior of the Meridians I was quite surprised how shabby they are looking the last time I travelled by EMT. Is there a refurbishment in the pipeline?

Yes, am I correct in saying they are starting the 222s refurb when the 15Xs are finished?

 

[Voyager 2093]

Same body shell! I think changes in the interior is the main plus factor.

Nice one I was thinking that too. Same electrical equipment too, obviously except the 221s which have tilt.

Much as I like the interior of the Meridians I was quite surprised how shabby they are looking the last time I travelled by EMT. Is there a refurbishment in the pipeline?

So they are going to start refurbishment after only 8 years of service. What a waste of money. Just goes to show the maintenance in the British Train industry.

 

[Bungle]

I use the 222s regularly, in both first and standard class, between London and t'north. I used to be a regular Voyager passenger when I was at university.

I've never understood how some people seemingly rave about the Meridians being good then trash the Voyagers in the same sentence.

The Meridians have a brighter feel to the interior, mainly due to the differences in the lighting, and also the less imposing and less 'chunky' overhead luggage racks.

The Meridian interiors are getting incredibly scruffy. The seat backs are full of marks and scrapes, the seat covers and carpets are getting worn in places and more and more bits of trim are noticeably starting to rattle (although nowhere near as much as the Voyagers.)

In terms of engine vibration, there is no difference between the classes. I would say if anything people exaggerate how bad it is on the Voyager, but then that normally comes from people who are (still) in a sulk about the loss of their beloved 47+Mk2s. I wouldn't deny the noise is noticeable, but I've had some very comfortable 4-5 hour journeys on Voyagers. Meridians are no better or worse in this respect.

To the guy who mentioned the staff, both companies have their good and bad ones. Generally, with a few exceptions, I find EMT to be a surly, straight-faced, miserable bunch. I haven't travelled on XC a lot (did a lot more when they were Virgin) but in my experience the Virgin staff then were a lot more friendly and seemingly happy than those I encounter on EMT these days.

The Meridian toilets aren't quite as bad as the Voyager ones, but I would still say that on at least 50% of my journeys the vestibule areas and carriage ends closest to the toilets stink of wee.

To the guy who said they 'feel faster'... if you say so. The Meridians don't go above 110mph in normal service while the Voyagers regularly hit 125mph on some sections. Not sure where you get this perception.

A lot of it is down to perception. People hated the Voyagers when they replaced their beloved (old, unreliable) stock on Cross Country in the early 2000s - sometimes with good reason, admittedly, but at the end of the day they are just a way of getting from A to B. Lessons were obviously learned when you look at the differences in the Meridians, but they are not too different from each other in a lot of respects and I will never understand why one class is hated (OK, two, for the pedants among us) and one class is happily accepted/liked.

 

[sprinterguy]

So they are going to start refurbishment after only 8 years of service. What a waste of money. Just goes to show the maintenance in the British Train industry.

Says more about the quality of train construction by Bombardier; the excessive wear is more down to cheap materials being used and possibly the standards of the manufacturing process.

The Meridians are definitely looking exceedingly work-stained inside, with marks and stains on the seat backs and panelling. The Voyagers are faring better than Meridians in terms of the cleanliness of the saloon interiors.

Bungle has provided an excellent post above that really hits the nail on the head.

I’d like to add, that I reckon that a big reason why people prefer the Meridians to the Voyagers is that they operate much shorter journeys than do Crosscountry’s and Virgin’s Voyagers:
For a maximum journey length of less than 3 hours on the MML, the Meridians are a far more suitable train than for an 8 hour Crosscountry journey on a Voyager, where passengers are going to expect better levels of comfort and service than the Voyagers (or Meridians) can provide! Both Meridians and Voyagers are suited to shorter distance Intercity routes, and on the MML the Meridians are much closer to fulfilling this criteria than the Voyagers are on XC, where it is partly their unsuitability for such long distance services that makes them so unpopular.

There are a few more reasons why I prefer Meridians over Voyagers:

The quality of the lighting, which offers a greater degree of illumination on Meridians than on the Voyagers

The seats are more substantial and more comfortable (and have better quality armrests) on the Meridians. I don’t find the joined up seat backs at all oppressive, if I’m in an aisle seat, then I still have open space to the aisle side of me, and if I’m in a window seat I tend to be watching the view out of the window, so I don’t really notice.

I was also thinking last time I was on a 222 on Wednesday, that perhaps one of the reason that the Meridians seem less cramped is that the plastic panel moulding around the windows isn’t quite as thick as on the Voyagers, as the 222s don’t have to accommodate a groove in the panelling for the window blinds?

And I have more respect for the Meridians because at least some of them were delivered with a PROPER number of carriages, and the reduced length 7 carriage units still fulfil this criterion: Plus, at least the minimum train length (excepting the former Hull Trains units) is 5 carriages, not 4!

 

[Aictos]

Nice one I was thinking that too. Same electrical equipment too, obviously except the 221s which have tilt.
.

Uh, you are very wrong in stating the Voyagers and the Meridians share the same electrics layout.
Because the electrics are different, the 222s cannot work in passenger service with 220s/221s so it not just because the 221s have tilt gear.

The Meridians were designed to make more use of the shell to present a more pleasing enviroment for passengers moving away from the cramp design of the Voyagers which has worked really well.

If anything, the 222s I guess are what the 220s and 221s ought to have been but introduced as 9 car trains.

Now I've been on a Voyager and a Meridian and I much prefer the Meridian easily, it might be the decor or the friendly staff on one leg but they really are a pleasure to travel on, it would be nice if a all electric version of the 222 was made,

 

[Voyager 2093]

Uh, you are very wrong in stating the Voyagers and the Meridians share the same electrics layout.
Because the electrics are different, the 222s cannot work in passenger service with 220s/221s so it not just because the 221s have tilt gear.

The Meridians were designed to make more use of the shell to present a more pleasing enviroment for passengers moving away from the cramp design of the Voyagers which has worked really well.

If anything, the 222s I guess are what the 220s and 221s ought to have been but introduced as 9 car trains.

Now I've been on a Voyager and a Meridian and I much prefer the Meridian easily, it might be the decor or the friendly staff on one leg but they really are a pleasure to travel on, it would be nice if a all electric version of the 222 was made,

Oh right I see. Thanks for correcting me

 

[starrymarkb]

Voyagers use the Alstom TMS for commonality with the 390s. 222s use Bombardier's in house TMS system.

 

[MCR247]

Thats why it takes for ever to reconfigure a voyager (ie if they wanted 5 car and 3 car trains) but not long for meridians and easier

 

[Geezertronic]

Thats why it takes for ever to reconfigure a voyager (ie if they wanted 5 car and 3 car trains) but not long for meridians and easier

3 car Voyagers?

 

[MCR247]

I meant if XC decided they wanted to mess around with their voyagers like EMT to with their meridians

 

[tbtc]

If anything, the 222s I guess are what the 220s and 221s ought to have been but introduced as 9 car trains

Spot on.

222s are better all round, they got to learn from the "mistakes" of the Voyagers.

Also, bear in mind that most 222s are replacing two/three coach 170s that used to run those services (the "semi fast" services - obviously the "fast" Sheffield trips used to be HSTs), so are a definite step up.

 

[Pumbaa]

Voyagers use the Alstom TMS for commonality with the 390s. 222s use Bombardier's in house TMS system.

What he said.

@ whoever it was wanted to know, electrical and train management are the principal differences between the two classes excluding the interior. 222s use MITRAC directly from Bombardier, and it handles everything so much better than 220/221. Name of the Alstom system escapes me, ATMS possibly?

 

[anonymous0101]

222s are used on the East Coast Main line and accelerate to 125mph faster than Class 91+Mk4 sets!

 

[Crossforth]

222s are used on the MML and although they have a top speed of 125mph they only ever get to 110mph

 

[HSTfan!!!]

A number of you mentioned that meridians feel faster than voyagers? Do they not use the same engines then ???

 

[djw1981]

222s are used on the East Coast Main line and accelerate to 125mph faster than Class 91+Mk4 sets!

They used to be. Not any more.

 

[mallard]

Having travelled on both a 222 and a 220 yesterday (after first noticing this thread), it seems to me that a large part of the difference in "feel" to the interior is due to the different designs of the overhead luggage racks.

220/221's have big, opaque, plastic luggage racks that contribute to the feeling of crampedness, particularly when sitting in a window seat it gives the false impression of a low ceiling and being enclosed.

222's have lighter-looking, transparent, glass luggage racks that let light through and make the space feel much more open and less enclosed.

Although in my opinion, both luggage racks are too small for practical use! Both are smaller than those found on sprinters and HSTs...

 

[tbtc]

They used to be. Not any more.

222s still run on the ECML, don't they?