Virgin trains to Brighton

[JonathanH]

Wow, the service had declined a bit then. Still worse off now I'd say, I'm sure the direct service to Tonbridge would be useful to some people.

I don't have a relevant timetable to hand but I think that the superior power of the Turbos means that the service isn't slower today with the extra stops at Blackwater and Reigate. I don't get the impression that there is much off-peak travel across Redhill to Tonbridge/Kent although the current timetable doesn't help.

Going back to 2002, one of the most useful Voyager trains was a service that originated at Brighton at 2023, called Haywards Heath, Gatwick Airport, Redhill at 2115 and was in Reading at 2201. This was starting to get good loadings by the time the service was cut back for Operation Princess. I seem to recall that an afternoon peak service northbound from Guildford loaded well with cross-Reading travellers.

One of the problems with the Virgin trains over the North Downs Line was that they couldn't be timed in such a way that they would reliably present themselves at Reading from the north in time to go to Guildford in front of the, then, xx07 stopping service. They consequently had pathing allowance at Guildford or would have waiting time on the signal at Blackwater awaiting the section to clear.

Saturday mornings used to see a fast turbo path Reading-Guildford-Redhill-Gatwick each hour between 0700 and 0900. These went a few years ago but if you want to judge whether Gatwick is a big traffic generator, you only have to compare loadings on the trains that go there over with the stopping service that starts at Redhill. West of Guildford, the distinction is less once the flows into and out of Guildford and Reading are considered.

 

[tsr]

I don't have a relevant timetable to hand but I think that the superior power of the Turbos means that the service isn't slower today with the extra stops at Blackwater and Reigate. I don't get the impression that there is much off-peak travel across Redhill to Tonbridge/Kent although the current timetable doesn't help.

Going back to 2002, one of the most useful Voyager trains was a service that originated at Brighton at 2023, called Haywards Heath, Gatwick Airport, Redhill at 2115 and was in Reading at 2201. This was starting to get good loadings by the time the service was cut back for Operation Princess. I seem to recall that an afternoon peak service northbound from Guildford loaded well with cross-Reading travellers.

One of the problems with the Virgin trains over the North Downs Line was that they couldn't be timed in such a way that they would reliably present themselves at Reading from the north in time to go to Guildford in front of the, then, xx07 stopping service. They consequently had pathing allowance at Guildford or would have waiting time on the signal at Blackwater awaiting the section to clear.

Saturday mornings used to see a fast turbo path Reading-Guildford-Redhill-Gatwick each hour between 0700 and 0900. These went a few years ago but if you want to judge whether Gatwick is a big traffic generator, you only have to compare loadings on the trains that go there over with the stopping service that starts at Redhill. West of Guildford, the distinction is less once the flows into and out of Guildford and Reading are considered.

Yes, you're right in saying that timings are crucial and any late cross-country services could need to wait (or make other services wait). I think it might be a good idea to have one slow and one fast service every hour, instead of any semi-fast services, with every service starting/terminating at Gatwick Airport, but some of the fast services could be extended to destinations further than Reading - or maybe all of them. I think it would be worth considering where faster services could overtake slower ones (could Platform 3 at North Camp be reinstated in case one service was late and needed to be overtaken?). There's then the problem that in at least one direction, you might get both fast and slow services arriving fairly soon after each other, leaving a handful of stations with effectively an hourly service, but others with a half-hourly, because of the different stopping patterns resulting in an unevenly staggered service.

In terms of stock, I would suggest that slower services could be operated Gatwick Airport - Reading with the current Turbos (or similar, if electrified). Faster services could be Voyagers, unless electrified. Fast stopping pattern now would probably be Gatwick Airport/Redhill/Reigate*/Guildford/Reading - perhaps one service could stop somewhere strategic between Guildford and Reading.

*Maybe 1tp2h fast and 1tph slow.

 

[cle]

The diveunder at Reading will make extending these to Oxford etc... much easier. In the past they went to Banbury I think.