Virgin Trains Driver Apprenticeship: Think they'll ever do another?

[AndrewE]

I was told that Virgin (WC) are facing a potentially catastrophic retirement "hump" in a few years' time. I wondered whether this might have something to do with the initiative, but the cynic in me says Stevieoz is probably closer to the truth... A good way of getting extra tax relief (or actual government cash support) for training they need to do anyway.

 

[Up_Tilt_390]

I was told that Virgin (WC) are facing a potentially catastrophic retirement "hump" in a few years' time. I wondered whether this might have something to do with the initiative, but the cynic in me says Stevieoz is probably closer to the truth... A good way of getting extra tax relief (or actual government cash support) for training they need to do anyway.

Well, from what I've observed, many Virgin Trains drivers are very senior and experienced railway men and women. The lowest level of driver experience I've heard of is 17 years after having spoken to several drivers in my lifetime. Two others I've spoken to were very experienced, one having 29 years, another having 37! The rest I've not spoken to, but of all the ones I've seen they have grey hair or wrinkled skin, or even both. Even if they're not that experienced, I've never seen a driver that looked under 40 (yes, call me judgmental). Just assuming that the majority of all 547 drivers are in that age range, I would expect a retirement hump within the next fifteen years. I think I better keep my out for more of these apprentices in that case.

 

[Holt0121]

Well, from what I've observed, many Virgin Trains drivers are very senior and experienced railway men and women. The lowest level of driver experience I've heard of is 17 years after having spoken to several drivers in my lifetime. Two others I've spoken to were very experienced, one having 29 years, another having 37! The rest I've not spoken to, but of all the ones I've seen they have grey hair or wrinkled skin, or even both. Even if they're not that experienced, I've never seen a driver that looked under 40 (yes, call me judgmental). Just assuming that the majority of all 547 drivers are in that age range, I would expect a retirement hump within the next fifteen years. I think I better keep my out for more of these apprentices in that case.

I’m a driver and I’m under 40

 

[Up_Tilt_390]

I’m a driver and I’m under 40

That's a first for me

 

[tiptoptaff]

There are many many drivers at my TOC under 30, let alone 40.....

 

[Up_Tilt_390]

Just to be clear to people, I was more specifically referring to Virgin Trains than any other particular TOC. I imagine that some of the so-called "lesser" TOCs or "less senior" ones (not sure why there's a railway hierarchy with TOCs like) could have younger drivers.

 

[tiptoptaff]

Just to be clear to people, I was more specifically referring to Virgin Trains than any other particular TOC. I imagine that some of the so-called "lesser" TOCs or "less senior" ones (not sure why there's a railway hierarchy with TOCs like) could have younger drivers.

Wouldn't call my TOC lesser - very large IC TOC.

There is no hierarchy, simply put.

 

[Up_Tilt_390]

Wouldn't call my TOC lesser - very large IC TOC.

Hence why I don't really understand the hierarchy. I have my own preferences for intercity TOCs like Virgin Trains, so they'd be first choice if I could pick and choose, but I don't see TOCs like Northern as lesser because they served a different function and are good in their own way, and some like regional operators or semi-fast suburban ones rather than long-distant express ones. The term 'lesser' is really subjective to the individual if you ask me.

EDIT: Also, mind if I ask which TOC you work for?

 

[tiptoptaff]

Hence why I don't really understand the hierarchy. I have my own preferences for intercity TOCs like Virgin Trains, so they'd be first choice if I could pick and choose, but I don't see TOCs like Northern as lesser because they served a different function and are good in their own way, and some like regional operators or semi-fast suburban ones rather than long-distant express ones. The term 'lesser' is really subjective to the individual if you ask me.

EDIT: Also, mind if I ask which TOC you work for?

G.W.R

 

[a_c_skinner]

Is it not true that long distance ('Express') workings used to go to more senior drivers or has my Ian Allen book collection let me down? Would that explain the seniority of Virgin WC drivers?

Andrew

 

[tiptoptaff]

Is it not true that long distance ('Express') workings used to go to more senior drivers or has my Ian Allen book collection let me down? Would that explain the seniority of Virgin WC drivers?

Andrew

The long distance work did go to higher links as it attracted mileage pay.

 

[Up_Tilt_390]

Is it not true that long distance ('Express') workings used to go to more senior drivers or has my Ian Allen book collection let me down? Would that explain the seniority of Virgin WC drivers?

I am told that back in the BR days, intercity express trains were considered the cream of the crop, and as such drivers had to work their way up through the driving grade to get there. I imagine that since a lot of drivers from those days still work with Virgin Trains, it could explain the seniority. I'm also told that such hierarchy between Regional Railways and InterCity is less common nowadays, though companies like East Midlands Trains will still have you work as a depot driver before you go on the main line, and Virgin and CrossCountry also poach from other TOCs since it's cheaper than training new drivers, hence you would kind of work your way up still.

They have no problem doing this if there's decent supply of drivers available, though mass retirement that could happen in the next few years may present a problem. In fact, with the new Azuma trains, and maybe back when the Pendolinos came about, Virgin did a recruitment of trainees because of the need for quite a few new drivers. I imagine when they ran CrossCountry the same would've happened when the introduction of the Voyagers came about with increased service.

 

[SPADTrap]

Is it not true that long distance ('Express') workings used to go to more senior drivers or has my Ian Allen book collection let me down? Would that explain the seniority of Virgin WC drivers?

Andrew

I'm driving 'intercity' at 25 so it isn't a hard and fast rule.