Virgin drivers pay proposal

[E&W Lucas]

It's difficult to pass comment without knowing the full facts but I will point out in the interests of balance that this figure, £67k is similar to what an MP or a very senior Firefighter gets.

The 67 K figure is spurious; see explanations above. Even so, I would suggest that the average train driver, makes a far greater contribution to society, than your typical MP!!!

 

[TOCDriver]

Inter city work used to be double manned by two drivers, certainly for 125 MPH running.

The way I look at it, what someone else gets paid, and what they have to do for it, is their business. If the package sounds attractive, put in for the job, find out the details first hand, and decide if it is for you.

They always had two senior drivers in the cab, quite often one of them being managerial in rank. And least we forget that drivers pay 40 percent tax on their income - that's quite a contribution to the economy for keeping the travelling public safe.

 

[VauxhallandI]

I work in the City and pay 40%, I have yet to be congratulated for my contribution to the economy!

 

[Carlisle]

From memory I think it was only GW mainline And East Coast HST and class 91 Sets that were double manned all other inter city routes did not require double manning

 

[E&W Lucas]

From memory I think it was only GW mainline And East Coast HST and class 91 Sets that were double manned all other inter city routes did not require double manning

It depended on the linespeed. Was certainly required for 125 MPH running. I've a feeling the stipulation was "speeds in excess of 100 mph".

 

[Carlisle]

It depended on the linespeed. Was certainly required for 125 MPH running. I've a feeling the stipulation was "speeds in excess of 100 mph".

I'm sure your right ,it was originally 100 MPH probably till early or mid 80s when it was raised to 110 MPH till privatisation times

 

[dk1]

I'm sure your right ,it was originally 100 MPH probably till early or mid 80s when it was raised to 110 MPH till privatisation times

ECML timetable was always slower weekends due to single manning but amazingly trains would arrive early after the final station on the drivers last bit

 

[mac]

Drivers wages havnt risen as fast as has been made out. The job in terms of conditions and pay structure has changed quite a bit. Unions suggest they have done a good job in increasing our salaries but to be honest not as much of it comes down to them as they may suggest.

Under BR there were numerous pay enhancements on the basic wage which no longer exist. Drivers were paid extra for things like mileage, DOO working, 'anti social shifts', Saturdays, Sundays (I know some companies still do pay extra for Sundays but not all) etc. Over time all of that has been put into the basic wage so that hasn't so much increased drivers salaries but just incorporated it into the total figure rather than drivers earning a basic wage plus lots of extras.

There is now competition between companies and the started a big increase in pay. Companies found out that it was far cheaper to poach other companies drivers than to pay training costs themselves. In order to attract drivers to their company they needed to increase their own pay. To compete other TOCs have had to increase their pay to and even now some of the less well paid TOCs loose a high number of drivers to better paid neighbours. There is a steady flow of GA drivers based at Cambridge moving over to FCCs cambridge depot simply because our money and conditions are superior.

This is an open forum that I am allowed to put my point of view even if you don't like it - you are a driver so therefore will not like anyone to say you are paid to much.

I agree I might not know as much as you about drivers wages but I do know that 20-25 years ago they got paid no more than anyone else doing similar work not 2 or 3 times the amount. As I put before I think there comes a time when the pay limit is reached I don't know when that is but one day it will happen.

You are correct I have never done the job but I have done a lot of cab rides mainly freight but also high speed Doncaster to London but not for a few years but I do talk to drivers and they say it is now easier.

You say you are now doing more trips per day is that because your time is better planned or are you working more hours per week?

 

[Clip]

I work in the City and pay 40%, I have yet to be congratulated for my contribution to the economy!

Let me be the first

'Congratulations'

 

[A-driver]

Mac-of course you can have an opinion but when it is not based on any fact then it isn't really valid. A lot of your points are wrong.

The working week is generally shorter but the diagrams are far more intense with a much higher driving time. BR diagrams didn't have anywhere close to the amount of work some have today.

The salary initially rose after privatisation as I say because of competition and the desire to poach drivers etc.

Having a cab ride is not relevant. It has nothing at all to do with being a driver-riding up front is just like being a passenger but with a different view.

As I say, modern traction may be easier to drive but all the ex BR guys I know much preferred the work in the old days.

Plus your original argument was that drivers/unions can't expect wages to keep rising with out giving anything back in return which is wrong and come rely un valid as I pointed out.

 

[A-driver]

At £67000 there will come a time when virgin will take them on and start cutting wages like other industries have done. No company can keep on paying more ever year unless they get something in return.

I have quoted it here just to remind you.

Wrong-they are getting lots in return as explained.

I have explained multiple times why we get paid what we do and comments like yours that I have quoted just highlight how little an idea you actually have of what you are trying to argue. You believe we just snap out fingers and demand more money by threatening to walk out. The reality is nothing like that. It is all negotiated and no company does actually pay more without getting anything in return. That is a fact. That post by you above is just offensive and ill thought out.

And then you bring up the normal rubbish spouted on here over and over by people who don't have a clue by telling us you have had a cab ride...
Driving over the same stretch of line day in, day out stopping at exactly the same stations and signals without ever making a mistake as a single mistake can cost you your job.

 

[IanXC]

I think its fair to say that we have learnt the fate of the "productivity pay deal" Virgin originally proposed, and the deal agreed. I think that brings the thread to a close - if anyone does have anything new to say about the Virgin driver's pay deal please PM me and we will consider reopening the thread.