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Using wrong railcard

Mcr Warrior

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@Dilpreet Kaur. When you first came to the forum for advice back in April 2025, did you subsequently then get in touch with GTR? If so, was just by e-mail? When was the last time you heard back from GTR? Maybe they wrote to you, by letter post, sent to one of the various addresses mentioned in post #1, but one that you don't actually live at, and they didn't get any further response?
 
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WesternLancer

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Yes i get it but it was issue when i was not even aware. As per me i was not got given chance to do settlement. That is why i was thinking to get the statutory declaration. So that i’ll be given a chance atleast. I am not sure if its right at this stage ?

It doesn't really matter in terms of the process from now on whether you did or did not get any letters, or whose fault that was (maybe Royal Mail lost them, maybe your relative at the house lost them, maybe the court didn't send them properly....) the end result is the same - you have been convicted without being aware of it.

I think now you have the following options in reality (and I don't think any of them involve ringing GTR or the court at this stage).


A) Pay the sum detailed on the court letter you uploaded before the deadline stated (30 June?).
This closes the matter and the costs will not go up (if you do not pay the court, bailiffs will come to seek the money as is explained and the costs of them doing that will be added to the sum listed in the letter.)
But -
- That sum is almost certainly higher than an out of court settlement would have been had you been able to secure one
- You will still have a criminal record that you will have to declare when asked for a certain period of time (a year or two maybe - you would have to check), albeit for a relatively minor crime

or

B) Carry out the process of making a Statutory Declaration (SD) within 21 days of you becoming aware of your conviction - and try to do this yourself. This 're-sets the clock' and if done correctly using advice from here as posted on other equivalent threads may allow you time to then negotiate an out of court settlement with GTR before the case gets relisted for trial at court again (the ultimate point of an SD from the courts point of view is to re-do what they have done, but with you aware of it so you could plead at the court etc, make your mitigation and such like - but of course you don't want it to go to court at all - because if it did you would just be found guilty again and the end result would be the same ie a fine and a criminal record)

Here are some threads about using the Statutory Declaration Process to try and get cases re-set - if you read these and follow the process that is explained in them carefully - you may feel confident in doing this yourself.



https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/help-with-hmcts-baliffs.284728/


or

C) Use a solicitor specialising in railway fares issues like this to help you with both the SD process and obtaining an out of court settlement

This might cost from £600 to £1000 in legal fees plus the cost of the settlement (so more than the court fine in option A) BUT it would mean you would not have the criminal record in the end - so you would have to decide if it was worth it to you to pay that sort of money to get this help.
It might be an option if you don't feel confident in doing the process yourself.
Such solicitors get mentioned on this forum so if you want to ask them for quotes we can give the details of several solicitors firms


I hope all this helps - have a read of those linked threads - I think that is the first thing you need to do.
 

gray1404

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I would suggest that the statutory declaration is done and witnessed by a solicitor so it can then be posted to the court. They only charge a nominal fee for doing this. Note this is different to employing their full legal services so make sure you are clear it is just the statutory declaration you need witnessing. The beauty with doing it this way and not doing it in a court building is they cannot reschedule another trial straight away.

I do not know what your occupation is but if you are a student, on benefits or are on a low income then if you were to be convicted again the fine and victim surcharge would be lower. The fine they have given you is assuming average earnings. However if you are on a high income then you could potentially receive a higher fine if the court became aware of this.

However once you have sent off the statutory declaration you can then contact the train company explaining the situation and asking them to agree to an out of court settlement. If they agree to this then you would be able to have the case withdrawn and you would avoid getting a criminal record. An out of court settlement would also most likely be less in financial terms then what you're being asked to pay now.
 
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WesternLancer

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I would suggest that the statutory declaration is done and witnessed by a solicitor so it can then be posted to the court. They only charge a nominal fee for doing this. Note this is different to employing their full legal services so make sure you are clear it is just the statutory declaration you need witnessing. The beauty with doing it this way and not doing it in a court building is they cannot reschedule another trial straight away.

I do not know what your occupation is but if you are a student's, on benefits or are on the low income then if you were to be convicted again the fine and victim surcharge would be lower. The finally have given you is assuming average earnings. However if you are on a high income then you could potentially receive a higher fine if the court became aware of this.

However once you have sent off the statutory declaration you can then contact the train company explaining the situation and asking them to agree to an out of court settlement. If they agree to this then you would be able to have the case with joined from the course and you would avoid getting a criminal record. And how to court supplement would also most likely be less in financial terms then what you're being asked to pay now.
Very good and helpful info if the OP wishes to go down the Stat Dec route and handle it themselves.

I think last para has some auto correct errors that might need correction for clarity.

All of the cases I linked to are example of people doing this and being guided through the process by experts on SDs here.

If @Dilpreet Kaur reads through them they can see the process including where to download SD forms from, how to fill them in and as you say how to get them witnessed and submitted in a way that then maximises the time taken to seek an out of court settlement.
 
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Dilpreet Kaur

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@Dilpreet Kaur. When you first came to the forum for advice back in April 2025, did you subsequently then get in touch with GTR? If so, was just by e-mail? When was the last time you heard back from GTR? Maybe they wrote to you, by letter post, sent to one of the various addresses mentioned in post #1, but one that you don't actually live at, and they didn't get any further response?
Yes same day i gilled the failed to carry yl form later day contacted i forgot to attach my tickets which i replied by attaching on the same they acknowledge that they recived. Which means they have received my right email, recent address with correct dob. No email by any means i have received on new address where i started staying ot my other address where my cousin lives. Only this letter out of blue moon i have received.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

It doesn't really matter in terms of the process from now on whether you did or did not get any letters, or whose fault that was (maybe Royal Mail lost them, maybe your relative at the house lost them, maybe the court didn't send them properly....) the end result is the same - you have been convicted without being aware of it.

I think now you have the following options in reality (and I don't think any of them involve ringing GTR or the court at this stage).


A) Pay the sum detailed on the court letter you uploaded before the deadline stated (30 June?).
This closes the matter and the costs will not go up (if you do not pay the court, bailiffs will come to seek the money as is explained and the costs of them doing that will be added to the sum listed in the letter.)
But -
- That sum is almost certainly higher than an out of court settlement would have been had you been able to secure one
- You will still have a criminal record that you will have to declare when asked for a certain period of time (a year or two maybe - you would have to check), albeit for a relatively minor crime

or

B) Carry out the process of making a Statutory Declaration (SD) within 21 days of you becoming aware of your conviction - and try to do this yourself. This 're-sets the clock' and if done correctly using advice from here as posted on other equivalent threads may allow you time to then negotiate an out of court settlement with GTR before the case gets relisted for trial at court again (the ultimate point of an SD from the courts point of view is to re-do what they have done, but with you aware of it so you could plead at the court etc, make your mitigation and such like - but of course you don't want it to go to court at all - because if it did you would just be found guilty again and the end result would be the same ie a fine and a criminal record)

Here are some threads about using the Statutory Declaration Process to try and get cases re-set - if you read these and follow the process that is explained in them carefully - you may feel confident in doing this yourself.



https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/help-with-hmcts-baliffs.284728/


or

C) Use a solicitor specialising in railway fares issues like this to help you with both the SD process and obtaining an out of court settlement

This might cost from £600 to £1000 in legal fees plus the cost of the settlement (so more than the court fine in option A) BUT it would mean you would not have the criminal record in the end - so you would have to decide if it was worth it to you to pay that sort of money to get this help.
It might be an option if you don't feel confident in doing the process yourself.
Such solicitors get mentioned on this forum so if you want to ask them for quotes we can give the details of several solicitors firms


I hope all this helps - have a read of those linked threads - I think that is the first thing you need to do.
Thank you so much for detailed explanations i will definitely read this and try to do it myself in case i get stuck will contact here again.
 

WesternLancer

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Thank you so much for detailed explanations i will definitely read this and try to do it myself in case i get stuck will contact here again.
You need to focus on the SD now as you realise -
but
- you also need to engage with the court (specifically I expect their fines officer) to advise them ASAP that it is your intention to submit an SD as you had no knowledge of the conviction until very recently as their paperwork went to an old address - and give them your correct address now
- and then in due course advise the fines officer at the court that you have done an SD so I suspect)

Because when it gets to the deadline on that document you uploaded (30 June?) and you have not paid the sum being asked for, the court will escalate that to bailiffs to collect the debt
and that will potentially result in people calling on you seeking the money
or
going to your employer to get a deduction from your pay (if you are an employee)

So I would assume that is very important action for you to take too

You will need to do that in writing as well - not just ringing the court to tell them - and you need to use things like tracked postage so you can prove you sent it to the court and that they received the communication

@tixy who has given advice on that aspect of things on the forum before may be able to provide useful information on that if they see this thread.
 

Dilpreet Kaur

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One last bit before filling the SD forum shall i call the court and guve them my current address and contact making them aware that i juts got to know my intentions are SD and definitely would like to resolve this ?
 

WesternLancer

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One last bit before filling the SD forum shall i call the court and guve them my current address and contact making them aware that i juts got to know my intentions are SD and definitely would like to resolve this ?
No - do not call them - you do need to tell the court those things but you need to do it in writing so you can prove you have done it

If you call them you may not get to speak to the best person, you can not guarantee the person you speak to will actually do anything you ask. They might just take your call, get distracted by some other task after the end of the phone call, and forget to do it.

I don't want to sound rude but things have gone wrong for you by sloppy admin at previous stages. Phoning people up about things is not a robust process. Everything you do on this from now on, if you want the outcome you are seeking, needs to be done in a robust way.

Write down what you want to tell them (e-mail the court or posted letter) - send it with tracked postage (tracked 48 postage from a post office) keep the proof of the tracking.

I suggest you post a draft of the letter or e-mail you want to send to the court about your intentions here for checking before you send it - so we can help you get it correct.

And frankly this is probably a task to tell the court AFTER you have done the SD form, not before, in my view.

The court are not there to help you resolve this - the court are only there to decide if you are guilty or not guilty of the offence. Then to enforce the collection of the fine, costs etc (which is the court's punishment for the offence and is owed to the court).
 
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Dilpreet Kaur

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No - do not call them - you do need to tell the court those things but you need to do it in writing so you can prove you have done it

If you call them you may not get to speak to the best person, you can not guarantee the person you speak to will actually do anything you ask. They might just take your call, get distracted by some other task after the end of the phone call, and forget to do it.

I don't want to sound rude but things have gone wrong for you by sloppy admin at previous stages. Phoning people up about things is not a robust process. Everything you do on this from now on, if you want the outcome you are seeking, needs to be done in a robust way.

Write down what you want to tell them (e-mail the court or posted letter) - send it with tracked postage (tracked 48 postage from a post office) keep the proof of the tracking.

I suggest you post a draft of the letter or e-mail you want to send to the court about your intentions here for checking before you send it - so we can help you get it correct.

And frankly this is probably a task to tell the court AFTER you have done the SD form, not before, in my view.

The court are not there to help you resolve this - the court are only there to decide if you are guilty or not guilty of the offence.
Thank you so much i will get this done today and share my draft
 

MotCO

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Very good and helpful info if the OP wishes to go down the Stat Dec route and handle it themselves.

I think last para has some auto correct errors that might need correction for clarity.

All of the cases I linked to are example of people doing this and being guided through the process by experts on SDs here.

If @Dilpreet Kaur reads through them they can see the process including where to download SD forms from, how to fill them in and as you say how to get them witnessed and submitted in a way that then maximises the time taken to seek an out of court settlement.
Agreed. I suspect that the OP's first language is not English, so it may be a good idea to use a solicitor's help in submitting the SD to make sure that it is all correct.
 

Dilpreet Kaur

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No - do not call them - you do need to tell the court those things but you need to do it in writing so you can prove you have done it

If you call them you may not get to speak to the best person, you can not guarantee the person you speak to will actually do anything you ask. They might just take your call, get distracted by some other task after the end of the phone call, and forget to do it.

I don't want to sound rude but things have gone wrong for you by sloppy admin at previous stages. Phoning people up about things is not a robust process. Everything you do on this from now on, if you want the outcome you are seeking, needs to be done in a robust way.

Write down what you want to tell them (e-mail the court or posted letter) - send it with tracked postage (tracked 48 postage from a post office) keep the proof of the tracking.

I suggest you post a draft of the letter or e-mail you want to send to the court about your intentions here for checking before you send it - so we can help you get it correct.

And frankly this is probably a task to tell the court AFTER you have done the SD form, not before, in my view.

The court are not there to help you resolve this - the court are only there to decide if you are guilty or not guilty of the offence. Then to enforce the collection of the fine, costs etc (which is the court's punishment for the offence and is owed to the court).
Hi Good afternoon,

Thank you for the support.

1. I have now attached SD form which i will now. Please let me know if this is the correct one ? I downloaded online.
2. Please find the covering letter i prepared. Please let me know if i need to add/remove anything ?
3. If SD from attached is not the right one i did drafted the SD letter as well. Attached below.

Looking forward to hearing from you soon.

Regards,
 

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WesternLancer

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Hi Good afternoon,

Thank you for the support.

1. I have now attached SD form which i will now. Please let me know if this is the correct one ? I downloaded online.
2. Please find the covering letter i prepared. Please let me know if i need to add/remove anything ?
3. If SD from attached is not the right one i did drafted the SD letter as well. Attached below.

Looking forward to hearing from you soon.

Regards,
Thanks - that is probably a good start

!) can you tell us the date when you became aware of this conviction (ie when you first saw that letter from the court) - then we can work out how long you have to get the SD form completed correctly, and make sure you know exactly what to do with it - and how to do it - this is VERY important as you may have ben able to see from the other threads.

2) ref your completed forms - I am sorry but I do not have the expertise to know if these are correct- but I do expect that it is vital that they are correct or they might get rejected. See post above by @gray1404 in particular (post #33)

Perhaps an expert on court process here can look over them and check that for you. I wonder if @island or @Puffing Devil is available to have a look at these to give a view as I recall in the other threads they had given very knowledgeable advice.

3) Your covering letter - I don't think this is quite the thing you need - I think it should be a separate letter sent to the court separately, only about your up to date address and intention to do the SD (not something that is sent with the SD at the same time) - I can suggest some amendments to your draft later to show you what I mean. That would be a letter in response to their demand for the payment of the court sum that you were sent, informing them why you have not paid it and what you are doing about it now you have finally got it.
 
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WesternLancer

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The draft letter says 10 June
so if it is 21 days from 10 June it is at least 29 June to submit the SD correctly - which means the OP has a decent amount of time to get the SD papers 100% correct, checked and dealt with as per the advice given by @grey1404
 

gray1404

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There are some serious issues with the way that paperwork has been completed. I suggest that you employ a solicitor to assist you with this.

Besides the form needs to be witnessed by a solicitor anyway. You cannot simply put it in the post directly to the court so don't even waste your time doing that. It will not be accepted.

Any High Street solicitor that does criminal work will be fine for this. If this is going to be too much of a burden for you just pay the fine before the deadline on the notice you've received.
 

Dilpreet Kaur

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There are some serious issues with the way that paperwork has been completed. I suggest that you employ a solicitor to assist you with this.

Besides the form needs to be witnessed by a solicitor anyway. You cannot simply put it in the post directly to the court so don't even waste your time doing that. It will not be accepted.

Any High Street solicitor that does criminal work will be fine for this. If this is going to be too much of a burden for you just pay the fine before the deadline on the notice you've received.
I understand but solicitor which i checked they are charging too much like £300 plus Vat for consultation only. Further there will be charges as per case etc….i will check tomorrow high street solicitors too tomorrow. However i am out of job since a month that thing also i need to consider.
 

WesternLancer

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I understand but solicitor which i checked they are charging too much like £300 plus Vat for consultation only. Further there will be charges as per case etc….i will check tomorrow high street solicitors too tomorrow. However i am out of job since a month that thing also i need to consider.
You are asking the solicitor for a price for The wrong thing.

You just need to ask any solicitor for the price to check an SD and witness it for you and submit it to the court correctly I believe.
I’ll try and find this on one of the other threads.

I suspect They have quoted you for a consultation to handle your fares problem. You don’t need them for that.
You just need them to help ensure the SD is done correctly.
 
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gray1404

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I understand but solicitor which i checked they are charging too much like £300 plus Vat for consultation only. Further there will be charges as per case etc….i will check tomorrow high street solicitors too tomorrow. However i am out of job since a month that thing also i need to consider.

The fee for a solicitor witnessing a statutory declaration I believe is £5.
 

WesternLancer

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The fee for a solicitor witnessing a statutory declaration I believe is £5.
Might need to pay a bit more though if you want them to check you have filled in the rest of the form properly.
But it’s not something that requires a consultation costing £300 I feel sure.
 

Puffing Devil

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I understand but solicitor which i checked they are charging too much like £300 plus Vat for consultation only. Further there will be charges as per case etc….i will check tomorrow high street solicitors too tomorrow. However i am out of job since a month that thing also i need to consider.

There are some serious errors in your approach at the moment, so please do not send or post any of your paperwork to the court or GTR as it is currently written.

Your 21-day deadline to submit the Statutory Declaration does not expire until 1st July, which means we have plenty of time to get this formatted correctly.

Please don't panic or rush into sending anything over the next 48 hours. I will review everything in detail and provide you with a comprehensive step-by-step breakdown and corrected templates over the weekend so you can get this sorted out properly. You do not need a solicitor to draft your initial SD.

The fee for a solicitor witnessing a statutory declaration I believe is £5.

Correct.
 

Dilpreet Kaur

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There are some serious errors in your approach at the moment, so please do not send or post any of your paperwork to the court or GTR as it is currently written.

Your 21-day deadline to submit the Statutory Declaration does not expire until 1st July, which means we have plenty of time to get this formatted correctly.

Please don't panic or rush into sending anything over the next 48 hours. I will review everything in detail and provide you with a comprehensive step-by-step breakdown and corrected templates over the weekend so you can get this sorted out properly. You do not need a solicitor to draft your initial SD.
Noted thank you so much.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Hello @Puffing Devil

Hope you are well.

I got the consultation done (booked by my brother) with solicitor today and he helped me filling the SD firm guided the follow up procedure and I could see mostly people have used his services on this forum as well. I haven’t submitted/mailed anything yet i will not do until the coming week. This will give me enough time to review.

This is below draft been shared by him. He said at this stage this is enough at this stage. Fingers crossed. Does it seems ok to you please let me know.

Dear Court,

I enclose a Statutory Declaration for your urgent attention.

The document has been duly sworn before a Solicitor. I respectfully request that the Statutory Declaration be processed and dealt with administratively on the papers.

Separately, I respectfully request that the matter be listed for a case management hearing. This will allow me time to obtain the Initial Details of the Prosecution Case (IDPC) and to contact the train operating company with a view to resolving the matter amicably and avoiding further proceedings where possible.

If, however, a plea is required at this stage and my request above is not accepted, I enter a plea of not guilty. I also note that the matter may be capable of being resolved without the need for a trial.

Thank you for your attention to this matter.

Regards,
 
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WesternLancer

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@Dilpreet Kaur - when I suggested writing to the court earlier, I did not mean a covering letter to be sent with an SDS form. Instead I had in mind a letter that seeks to:
- tell them your correct address
- indicate you have not ignored matters and are thus now engaging with them having found out about the court action / conviction
- indicate what you are now planning to do about this (ie submit an Statutory Declaration)
- try and request / hope that they will not escalate the process of getting the money from you as detailed in the letter you shared, as a result of informing them of this.

Here is a draft below that might achieve that below.

However, @Puffing Devil has made an extremely helpful post above, so I would not send what I have drafted below until Puffing Devil has the chance to respond as they have indicated - and I'm sure would advise if a letter like this is a good idea to send, and / of if it needs any amendments
More generally - it is vital that the SD is done correctly and submitted to the court in a way that then creates time for you to contact GTR and seek either an out of court settlement, or show to them that you had a valid ticket and that no offence was committed, and thus persuade them to withdraw any new court action that they might commence as a result of the SD process.
But this is something that we can help you do by writing to GTR when the time comes - but you will only get the chance to do that if the SD is correct, and submitted ina way that creates time for you to do this, as I understand it.


Draft below (but do not send it yet) - This has to be accurate and true (under no circumstances say anything to the court that you know to be not true) - this is extremely important

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Your Full Current Name Your Full Current Address [Postcode]

Date: 11 June 2026

Barkingside Magistrates’ Court Cranbrook Road Ilford IG6 1HW

Copy to: London Collection and Compliance Centre PO Box 75667 London WC1A 9QD

Reference: Account Number: XYZ Case Number: XYZ Defendant: XYZ

Subject: Statutory Declaration under Section 14 Magistrates’ Courts Act 1980 – Request to set aside conviction and rehear the case


Dear Sir/Madam,

Please note my correct postal address is [Insert current address: xxxxxx ]

I am writing in relation to the above-referenced matter concerning a Notice of Fine and Collection Order (Dated xxxxx) which I received on or around 10 June 2026. This was sent to my previous address at XYZ, requesting payment of £408.00 by 30 June 2026, and indicating further enforcement action will commence in respect of this.

I am writing now because I was previously unaware of this matter.

I moved from my previous address on xxxxx date, and made arrangements for post to be passed on. However, it seems that these arrangements failed.

I had no awareness that court action had been taken against me until I recently received this Notice of Fine and Collection Order.

I am now in the process of seeking advice about making a Statutory Declaration, which I am expecting to do in the immediate future.

I am writing now

- to inform you of my correct address
- to indicate my intention to make a Statutory Declaration on the basis that I was unaware of the court action related to this matter

I would be grateful if further enforcement action can be paused whilst I progress this.

Thank you for your assistance in this matter, and I would be grateful if you could conform receipt of this letter.

I can be contacted at the address above or by email at XYZ.

Yours faithfully,

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

There are some serious errors in your approach at the moment, so please do not send or post any of your paperwork to the court or GTR as it is currently written.

Your 21-day deadline to submit the Statutory Declaration does not expire until 1st July, which means we have plenty of time to get this formatted correctly.

Please don't panic or rush into sending anything over the next 48 hours. I will review everything in detail and provide you with a comprehensive step-by-step breakdown and corrected templates over the weekend so you can get this sorted out properly. You do not need a solicitor to draft your initial SD.



Correct.
Many thanks for offering assistance here. I am sure this will be extremely helpful for the OP
 
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Dilpreet Kaur

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Addition to my previous here is SD attachment which is needs to be signed. Above services been taken from manak solicitor. He said once the sd approve he will take care rest of the negotiations part etc…. For the time being in need to focus on this. My husband agree to pay for legal aid.
 

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WesternLancer

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Addition to my previous here is SD attachment which is needs to be signed. Above services been taken from manak solicitor. He said once the sd approve he will take care rest of the negotiations part etc…. For the time being in need to focus on this. My husband agree to pay for legal aid.
I am sure you will get some advice on this over the weekend as promised. You do not need to hurry as explained above. You have until 1 July to get this correct and submitted.
 

Puffing Devil

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Addition to my previous here is SD attachment which is needs to be signed. Above services been taken from manak solicitor. He said once the sd approve he will take care rest of the negotiations part etc…. For the time being in need to focus on this. My husband agree to pay for legal aid.

As you have engaged a solicitor, you should work with them from now on.
 

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