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USA questions

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181

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I'm contemplating a visit to the USA, and wondering if anyone can help with the following:

1) If you travel in a roomette, how easy is it to see the view out of the other side of the train? In a European style sleeping compartment, or presumably an Amtrak bedroom, you can go and stand in the corridor if the view is better on that side, but that doesn't work when the corridor is in the centre of the carriage, so you presumably have to go elsewhere; how far do you have to go? Although it would be good to experience a sleeping car for at least some journeys, I wouldn't want to pay what seems to be a lot more money and find that my ability to see the scenery was significantly impaired. I gather that many trains have an observation car; how likely is this to be full?

2) Does anyone have any experience of or recommendations for the Colorado narrow gauge lines? I'm considering visiting the Durango and SIlverton (if I can fit it into the schedule), as although it's not as long as the Cumbres and Toltec, you can travel in both directions in one day and on one ticket, and there appears to be a daily bus service to Durango from Grand Junction (which has an Amtrak station), whereas I don't know if the C&T is acessible by public transport.

3) The worry is of course that Mr. Trump and the Republican congress will close down or severely cut Amtrak (or at least its long-distance routes) before I get there, although it has survived such threats before; there's a thread on an Amtrak-related discussion forum from which I get the impression that on previous occasions there have always been enough Congress members who want to retain train services in their states to prevent funding from being withdrawn. I don't suppose anyone knows yet what will happen, but does anyone here have enough knowledge of Amtrak funding or American politics to know how soon any cuts could happen? I.e. how late in the year can I plan to travel if I want to be sure of the present level of services? (I much enjoyed my Canadian train travels back in 1990, and it is still of course possible to cross that country by train, but I've never quite forgotten that I was there just months after services had been approximately halved).

4) Assuming that things continue as normal for the time being, how often do Amtrak timetables change? Seat61 says that you can book up to 11 months in advance, but does this guarantee that the timetable will be the same in 11 months time, or might you find that your train has been retimed/diverted/withdrawn? Or is the 11-month window reduced when there is a timetable change?

5) Does anyone have any tips (beyond the summary on seat61) for using the Amtrak online booking system?

6) How strict are they about the exact dimensions of luggage (https://www.amtrak.com/baggage-policy)? (The exact size of my rucksack depends on how much I put in it).

Thankyou for any answers you can provide.
 
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Tim R-T-C

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Hello, I'll answer what I can:

1) If you travel in a roomette, how easy is it to see the view out of the other side of the train?

You can't. The rooms have closed and opaque doors, so standing in the corridor you cannot see a thing and in your room, you can only see your side.

I gather that many trains have an observation car; how likely is this to be full?

The trains I was on, it varied, the Coastal Starlight, it was full during the beautiful Pacific Coast sections for example. Some people seemed to be there the whole time, it depends who you get on board.

You could always go and sit in the coach section I guess, big windows either side and unlikely to be completely full on most routes, although might be best to ask a conductor first as they do carefully arrange seating by destination.

3) The worry is of course that Mr. Trump and the Republican congress will close down or severely cut Amtrak (or at least its long-distance routes) before I get there

Impossible to say at this time, he seems to have a lot else on his mind. You are just as likely to run into random changes of immigration laws en-route!

6) How strict are they about the exact dimensions of luggage (https://www.amtrak.com/baggage-policy)? (The exact size of my rucksack depends on how much I put in it).

No-one seemed to be checking when I went on. Certainly if you get a roomette to yourself, it won't really matter at all.

---

Which routes and destinations are you considering? I have travelled Flagstaff to LA, LA to Oakland and Dallas to Springfield, so happy to give any more details on these routes if required.
 

Shinkansenfan

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252
I'm contemplating a visit to the USA, and wondering if anyone can help with the following:

1) If you travel in a roomette, how easy is it to see the view out of the other side of the train?

2) Does anyone have any experience of or recommendations for the Colorado narrow gauge lines?

3) The worry is of course that Mr. Trump and the Republican congress will close down or severely cut Amtrak...

4) Assuming that things continue as normal for the time being, how often do Amtrak timetables change?

5) Does anyone have any tips (beyond the summary on seat61) for using the Amtrak online booking system?

6) How strict are they about the exact dimensions of luggage...


As someone who has ridden all Amtrak routes currently operating, as well as many routes that are no longer operating, I have some knowledge and answers to your questions. Answering your questions in reverse order:

6. They're not very strict. Especially if you're in a roomette. And if the sleeping car porters give you grief (which they likely won't) it is amazing what a bit of bahksheesh presented early in the trip can do to "waive the rules" and to put taciturn staff into a more agreeable mood.

5. What specifically do you want to know in terms of tips? Fares are sold in buckets; lowest price to highest. Once the lower price buckets sell out, they are not replenished, even when cancellations occur.

4. They typically change one or twice a year for longer distance trains, if at all. Sometimes they change on a moments notice for engineering works.

3. Not to introduce politics into a fine board, but it should be noted that under President Carter, Amtrak shed more route miles at once than under any US president. Naturally the five or so routes he cut were not the ones that I rode. :-x

I wouldn't worry too much about Amtrak's long distance routes facing the axe as they tend to have bi-partisan political support.

2. My preference is for the Cumbres and Toltec. It is more akin to a railroad that has been frozen in time as opposed to the D&S which is more a twee experience. C&T is dirty and unpolished (but not overly so). It looks like and plays the part--an authentic railroad. Both experiences are nice, though.

1. Roomette doors on Superliners have glass doors with curtains for privacy. If the Roomette opposite yours has the door or curtains open, you can look across the aisle and either through the open door or through the open curtain.

Many long distance trains have some sort of a lounge car; first come first seated! I wouldn't worry too much about all the seats being occupied; these seats tend to turnover, especially during meal times. IMO, this is one of the best parts of a long distance Amtrak trip--meeting people from all walks of life.

If you don't mind riding on the lower level, book the accessible bedroom which has views on both sides of the train. If not booked, it is made available for all travelers.

Hope this helps!
 
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duncanp

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I travelled in a roomette on the Texas Eagle from St Louis to Dallas a couple of years ago.

The window was only on one side, but there is nothing to stop you looking out of the window from a door on the opposite side, or going to the lounge car or observation car.

Whether the observation car is full depends on the time of day and whether the train is passing by some particularly notable scenery.

The California Zephyr is particularly well known as passing through spectacular scenery in the Rockies. If you take this train, try breaking the journey at somewhere like Glenwood Springs, Colorado for a couple of days.

Or you could follow Mr Portillo on his current journey, and take the City Of New Orleans from Chicago through Memphis to New Orleans. It even has its own dedicated song.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvMS_ykiLiQ

Whichever route you take, do stop off somewhere along the route. I started in Chicago and stopped in St Louis for a few days. It is off the tourist trail for most UK visitors (before Michael Portillo featured it in his recent series), but I can recommend it.

As to the threat of closures, a lot of the trains are run with financial support from the transportation departments of the states that the train passes through. So it is up to them whether the train continues to run, not the President, who probably has more pressing things to attend to.

You can book quite far in advance, but you could be subject to subsequent changes due to engineering works. This is opposite to the UK, where advance tickets are only released once timetables have been confirmed.

The on line booking system is easy to use, and you can print your tickets out before you leave. You have to book in advance - there is no equivalent of an anytime single from Chicago to Los Angeles which is available on any train and via any reasonable route. The booking system does allow multi city options, allowing you to break the journey en route, or there is the USA Rail Pass (see website for details)

They are not too strict on luggage, provided it doesn't cause an obstruction.
 

ac6000cw

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I can't comment on the sleeping car situation (as I've never travelled in one), but I have done Chicago - Oakland (CalZ), Oakland - LA, LA - Chicago (SW Chief), Chicago - Washington DC (Capitol Limited), Boston - Chicago all in coach class.

The seats on Superliner 'coach class' cars, by UK standards, are huge with fold out leg rests so it's not too difficult to sleep if you don't feel like paying for sleeping accommodation - just take eye-shades and earplugs with you. To be honest, having a wander around the platform during a long 'smoking stop' in the early hours of the morning can be quite a nice leg-stretch if the weather is reasonable.

And yes, the Sightseer Lounge car is definitely the place to be during the scenic daytime bits, both for the scenery and the conversations with other passengers.

Amtrak has survived all sorts political of attempts to wind it down or dismantle it for over 40 years (it was originally created as a way to let passenger trains fade away slowly after letting the private railroads off the hook for them), so I very much doubt it's going away anytime soon - the Trump administration has got much bigger issues to deal with than Amtrak's problems.

P.S. On the long-distance trains, they normally put the sleepers at the rear of the train, diner & lounge cars in the middle and seating cars towards the front. That way the sleeping car passengers are as far away as possible from the noise of the loco horns (which are LOUD in the US). There are a few pictures of the CalZ on Donner Pass here - the westward climb from Denver up into the Rockies and the ride over Donner Pass are probably my favourite scenic parts of the California Zephyr journey. If you fancy a break from the CalZ in the mountains to get some freight action, I can recommend Truckee - nice place to stay (not especially cheap), but you will be woken up by the trains if you are staying downtown (as I was :))
 
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theageofthetra

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I'm contemplating a visit to the USA, and wondering if anyone can help with the following:

1) If you travel in a roomette, how easy is it to see the view out of the other side of the train? In a European style sleeping compartment, or presumably an Amtrak bedroom, you can go and stand in the corridor if the view is better on that side, but that doesn't work when the corridor is in the centre of the carriage, so you presumably have to go elsewhere; how far do you have to go? Although it would be good to experience a sleeping car for at least some journeys, I wouldn't want to pay what seems to be a lot more money and find that my ability to see the scenery was significantly impaired. I gather that many trains have an observation car; how likely is this to be full?

2) Does anyone have any experience of or recommendations for the Colorado narrow gauge lines? I'm considering visiting the Durango and SIlverton (if I can fit it into the schedule), as although it's not as long as the Cumbres and Toltec, you can travel in both directions in one day and on one ticket, and there appears to be a daily bus service to Durango from Grand Junction (which has an Amtrak station), whereas I don't know if the C&T is acessible by public transport.

3) The worry is of course that Mr. Trump and the Republican congress will close down or severely cut Amtrak (or at least its long-distance routes) before I get there, although it has survived such threats before; there's a thread on an Amtrak-related discussion forum from which I get the impression that on previous occasions there have always been enough Congress members who want to retain train services in their states to prevent funding from being withdrawn. I don't suppose anyone knows yet what will happen, but does anyone here have enough knowledge of Amtrak funding or American politics to know how soon any cuts could happen? I.e. how late in the year can I plan to travel if I want to be sure of the present level of services? (I much enjoyed my Canadian train travels back in 1990, and it is still of course possible to cross that country by train, but I've never quite forgotten that I was there just months after services had been approximately halved).

4) Assuming that things continue as normal for the time being, how often do Amtrak timetables change? Seat61 says that you can book up to 11 months in advance, but does this guarantee that the timetable will be the same in 11 months time, or might you find that your train has been retimed/diverted/withdrawn? Or is the 11-month window reduced when there is a timetable change?

5) Does anyone have any tips (beyond the summary on seat61) for using the Amtrak online booking system?

6) How strict are they about the exact dimensions of luggage (https://www.amtrak.com/baggage-policy)? (The exact size of my rucksack depends on how much I put in it).

Thankyou for any answers you can provide.

Do not miss the Cumbres & Toltec it is just amazing. You only travel one way by train the return is by coach due to the journey length. The other must do is La Vela route- very few have heard of it and is equally spectacular but standard gauge. The Royal Gorge is also well worth a trip.

Be careful which month you go in- you can still get heavy snow well into May at the very high altitudes these lines go to. Late Sept is best as its still nice and all the schools have gone back.
 

ac6000cw

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Be careful which month you go in- you can still get heavy snow well into May at the very high altitudes these lines go to. Late Sept is best as its still nice and all the schools have gone back.

Agree completely - I visited the Grand Canyon some years ago in late May, wandering around in warm bright sunshine, whereas the day before it had been snowing at the rim...(the rim is at about 7000 ft altitude, the river at the bottom is 2200 ft).
 

142094

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Although I didn't use the Durango and Silverton railway, I did stay overnight in Durango itself. Nice little town and the scenery is fantastic. Drove in from the north, and a bit of the road follows the railway itself.

A friend has travelled on it and recommended it, but unfortunately I only had limited time when driving back towards the east coast.
 

LNW-GW Joint

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Do not miss the Cumbres & Toltec it is just amazing. You only travel one way by train the return is by coach due to the journey length. The other must do is La Vela route- very few have heard of it and is equally spectacular but standard gauge. The Royal Gorge is also well worth a trip.
Be careful which month you go in- you can still get heavy snow well into May at the very high altitudes these lines go to. Late Sept is best as its still nice and all the schools have gone back.

I covered both these lines on one trip, end Sept/early Oct.
The C&T was in perfect summer weather, fantastic ride (double headed to Cumbres Pass) and stayed in Chama the night before - a very quirky railway settlement.
It's a very open, hilly route and had magnificent aspen fall colour.

Less than a week later we did the D&S; winter had set in and we nearly froze. The train is in a deep canyon much of the time, and the sun doesn't get down there much.
But Silverton is atmospheric with 1/2/3 trains arriving and standing in the streets (depends on season).

I enjoyed both, but the C&T was, for me, more enjoyable from the heritage railway perspective.
I enjoyed listening to the conductor explaining to some thick Americans what "narrow gauge" meant!
You can go half-way to the passing loop for the two trains and enjoy a picnic, returning on the "other" train (the locos go back to where they started).
 
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tony6499

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If you travel on fairly short journeys such as Philadelphia to Washington DC can you just turn up and buy a ticket and travel on what train you want or does every ticket need a specific train reservation ?

Watching Portillo has given me a few ideas I'd like to do.

Thanks
 

me123

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On the North East Corridor (such as Philly to DC), the trains are reserved but your seating isn't. So if there's 400 seats on the train Amtrak will only sell 400 tickets. Every passenger has to have a seat - you won't have to stand. I think this means that you do need to have a reservation, because apparently the guard will not let you travel unless there's a seat.

A bit like here in the UK, you get cheaper fares for non-flexible tickets which is worth having a look at.
 

N228PF

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Amtrak just ordered new trains for the northeast. Doubt that will be cut anytime soon.
 

181

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Thankyou everyone for your contributions. My idea involves train travel between brief visits to relatives and friends in Montreal, New York/Philadelphia, Davis (central California, near Sacramento) and Vancouver, possibly stopping in one or two other places (e.g. Colorado) if I can arrange enough time off work to make it worthwhile. (My only previous experience of Amtrak is Montreal-New York-Philadelphia and back, in 2005).

Can the Cumbres and Toltec be reached by public transport? (Although technically I have a driving licence, I'm too out of practice to feel safe driving in the UK, let alone anywhere else. I know North America isn't the most obvious place to go for non-drivers, but I think there will be enough accessible places to occupy me for one visit).
 

philabos

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Just one comment. The states do support certain trains, but all long distance service is funded solely by the federal government. For example, the Pennsylvanian between New York and Pittsburgh is funded by the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. The Chicago to Los Angeles train is funded by the Feds.

If any changes, that will come with the federal budget proposal later this year.
 

Shinkansenfan

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Thankyou everyone for your contributions. My idea involves train travel between brief visits to relatives and friends in Montreal, New York/Philadelphia, Davis (central California, near Sacramento) and Vancouver, possibly stopping in one or two other places (e.g. Colorado) if I can arrange enough time off work to make it worthwhile. (My only previous experience of Amtrak is Montreal-New York-Philadelphia and back, in 2005).

Can the Cumbres and Toltec be reached by public transport? (Although technically I have a driving licence, I'm too out of practice to feel safe driving in the UK, let alone anywhere else. I know North America isn't the most obvious place to go for non-drivers, but I think there will be enough accessible places to occupy me for one visit).


If you haven't visited the former Southern Pacific depot in Davis, be sure to. It is a lovely SP Mission style depot located on "wye" trackage.

If you get homesick, consider riding one of the ex London doubledeck buses operated by UniTrans (university transit system) in Davis.

I checked and didn't see any public transit options to Chama (for the C&T train). Perhaps a friend or relative may wish to join you as the driver. Or now is a good time to practice driving on the right side of the road. Almost all US rental cars (except for specialty vehicles) have automatic transmission, so you don't have to worry about shifting gears.
 

theageofthetra

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If you haven't visited the former Southern Pacific depot in Davis, be sure to. It is a lovely SP Mission style depot located on "wye" trackage.

If you get homesick, consider riding one of the ex London doubledeck buses operated by UniTrans (university transit system) in Davis.

I checked and didn't see any public transit options to Chama (for the C&T train). Perhaps a friend or relative may wish to join you as the driver. Or now is a good time to practice driving on the right side of the road. Almost all US rental cars (except for specialty vehicles) have automatic transmission, so you don't have to worry about shifting gears.

I a pretty sure that the C & T do a pick up service with one of their coaches. As others have said this is not really the state or country to do via public transport unless sticking to major cities. Try and visit Boulder whilst there- its lovely.
 

Tim R-T-C

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Driving is pretty easy in the US. Roads are big, cars are automatic and many towns can be quite hard to get around on foot. Vast car parks and lack of footpaths in many places I found.
 

alex17595

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Driving is pretty easy in the US. Roads are big, cars are automatic and many towns can be quite hard to get around on foot. Vast car parks and lack of footpaths in many places I found.

It's very easy in the US. I went in January and it was the first time I have driven on the opposite side of the road (and car) and found it perfectly fine. The lanes and car park spaces are huge and the road signs are much more informative than over here.
 

Taunton

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Regarding the sleepers, I would always go for the upper level rather than lower. The noise of the wheels is much greater on the lower level, as you might imagine, and if you are on jointed track (still quite a bit) it can be difficult to sleep.

Meals are generally in multiple sittings. Americans like to eat early (and to queue up for it extraordinarily early), the last sitting is generally the quiet and more relaxed one. You may be joined at your table by some of the crew.

Seats in the sightseeing lounge can be all taken at times, but there's nothing to stop you going forward and sitting in the day coach. Just mention this to the conductor as they pass if you see them. A significant number of the conductors, especially, seem to be rail fans.

America is the land of tipping. US$10 per night is good form for the sleeping car attendant. This has been the fairly universal tradition on US railways for over 100 years (though the price has inflated). Because you are British, the generally expect you to be a lousy tipper and service goes accordingly, so an initial $10 when they show you to your roomette changes this markedly. Likewise the meals in the diner are tipped, even when the meal price is included in your sleeper ticket.

On the main multi-day transcontinental trains there's often a stop of about an hour once a day at major points, where you can go out, eat non-train food, and even get a shower etc in an adjacent hotel, who are used to this - ask the conductor, they will tell you what's around the station. If the train is grossly late (unfortunately too common) these long stops are normally still kept as the train is serviced etc during this time, they will announce any new departure time.

In Colorado the Silverton is a tourist attraction (but a good one), the C&T is real old railroading. Take sufficient clothing with you - the route gets very high, over 10,000 feet elevation, and the old cars are NOT heated. They run a range of shuttle buses to take you back, which unfortunately show the road journey is way quicker - it's only 45 miles end to end, the trains take from 1000 to 1600, the bus then takes about an hour coming back! Actually the rail distance is probably much more than 45 miles, it does a tremendous amount of looping around to gain altitude. We went from staying in Santa Fe NM, left at 6.30am, drove up about 2.5 hours to Chama, went to the halfway point where you have lunch and the trains cross, and then returned by train. We were double-headed out of Chama, it was quite a show. This is wild mountain country, though, and it has suffered from sudden lengthy closures due to rock slides, forest fires, and similar.

If you are going around these lines well away from Amtrak you are really best to have a car, like everyone else has.

I wouldn't worry about the change in government. Outside the NE Corridor, and the California lines (looked after by the State DoT) Amtrak is mainly once a day across the Middle America heartland, and used by the less youthful of the population - which is, of course, the heartland of the new administration as well ...
 
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181

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I'm reviving this thread to ask a couple more questions. It's looking likely that I might get to the Durango and Silverton (although unfortunately not the C&T), and I was wondering:

a) Does anyone have any recommendations as to the relative merits of travelling in the vintage standard class coaches and the open-air gondolas? Are you allowed to stand on the end balconies of the former?

b) Does anyone have any recommendations for places to stay in Durango?

Thankyou.
 

silverfoxcc

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An Answer and a question

For Accommodation try the AirBnB website, i am using it for a west-East trip ( but horrors using the airlines to do it!) stopping off at a zillion museums in between.


And is there a site where you can download railroad line maps, esp the West Maryland as it looks like i will be en route from Roanoke to Altoona and may 'bump' into 1309 on a steam trip. It look like there is a mini 'horseshoe curve' on its route

Ron
 

Taunton

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For general but detailed maps, these were pretty hard to come by in the USA until a publisher called DeLorme started up some years ago, and produced some very detailed large format map books. They are just one book per state, so they become a bit unwieldy for a lengthy trip, but show every back road as well. Stanfords in Covent Garden generally has the complete set.

For rail maps, the (surprisingly British) Steam Powered Video ones cannot be beaten, they show all the former lines now closed as well. One volume per region. Ian Allan at Waterloo generally has them all.
 

J-2739

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If you get homesick, consider riding one of the ex London doubledeck buses operated by UniTrans (university transit system) in Davis.

Off-Topic, but what model bus are used for this transit? And any photos?
 

Taunton

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Off-Topic, but what model bus are used for this transit? And any photos?
They have, dating from the 1960s, about half a dozen RTs, imported from London, re-engined locally. Time was long ago when they provided the bulk of the service, now most are typical US vehicles. Drivers (and conductors on the RTs, of course!) are typically university students, who get some form of academic credit for being one. I haven't been to Davis since the 1980s, then they were much more prevalent around the campus than apparently now.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unitrans
 

ac6000cw

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And is there a site where you can download railroad line maps, esp the West Maryland as it looks like i will be en route from Roanoke to Altoona and may 'bump' into 1309 on a steam trip. It look like there is a mini 'horseshoe curve' on its route

Ron

For general (detailed) navigation in the US (& UK), I use OsmAnd - http://osmand.net/ - on my phone. It's a free or cheap app, I've always found the open-source mapping to be pretty accurate, and normally it has quite a lot of railway detail (down to individual tracks quite often). The best part is that you can download the maps to the phone so no need for a live data link when abroad... It can do turn-by-turn navigation, but a dedicated SatNav is probably better/easier, so I use both - SatNav to get to the right area and then Osmand for the final bit.

As Taunton said, the SPV railroad maps are excellent (especially as they show trackage rights 'tenant' railroads as well as the owning railroads) - http://www.spv.co.uk/atlases.shtml
 
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Old Yard Dog

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The standard class sleeping cabins on Amtrak are exceedingly tight with the bunks parallel to the tracks and very little room to manouevre between the bunks and the side of the cabin. The top bunks in particular are very short and very claustrophobic with precious little space between your head and the ceiling. Try upgrade if you can.
 

181

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The standard class sleeping cabins on Amtrak are exceedingly tight with the bunks parallel to the tracks and very little room to manouevre between the bunks and the side of the cabin. The top bunks in particular are very short and very claustrophobic with precious little space between your head and the ceiling. Try upgrade if you can.

I'm planning to travel mostly in coach class, as even the cheaper grade of sleeping accommodation is rather expensive if you're travelling alone, and when not asleep you miss the scenery on one side of the train unless you leave your expensive compartment; also, I gather that Superliner coach seats are not bad for sleeping in, and I'm not planning to spend more than one night at a time on trains. (I have booked one night in a sleeper -- it was significantly cheaper than on the other trains I'd looked at, I'll be asleep for much of the journey and when I'm not it will be a fairly flat part of the country; with only me in it I won't need to worry about the claustrophobic upper berth).

This brings me to another question: does coach class on the long-distance trains ever (or often) get full (in the absence of major disruptions to air travel)? When I e-mailed the organization who run the bus between Grand Juction and Denver to ask about buying tickets in advance, they said that they didn't like to sell tickets too far in advance in case they had to cancel the bus. I don't know how often this happens, but it would be good if a day's delay didn't mean getting stranded in Grand Junction for days on end!

I've come across two further pieces of information which might be of use to anyone else planning a trip:

1) You can fly between Denver and Durango a few times per day, but it's very expensive (over £200 each way).

2) According to the Amtrak Cascades website, those trains don't count as land border crossings for immigration purposes, so you may need an ESTA. I haven't yet investigated this any further.
 
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