Unit / Loco Numbers

[fairysdad]

Was musing over the new liveries for GWR and SWR, and was thinking.

Are unit and loco numbers only given the prominence they are because of rail enthusiasts and trainspotters? Of course, these numbers are used internally and, no doubt, for staff to use - but would there be any other reason for them to be so 'loud' upon a unit except for, well, our purposes?

 

[pdeaves]

They make it easy for drivers to find the right train and for fitters to carry out repairs. If you can identify your train from the other side of the sidings (for example) it makes things a lot simpler than wandering around having to look at them all close up.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

They make it easy for drivers to find the right train and for fitters to carry out repairs. If you can identify your train from the other side of the sidings (for example) it makes things a lot simpler than wandering around having to look at them all close up.

Tell that to TPE! (or GC, or XC)

 

[50039]

Interesting question that I've wondered myself.
Obviously they are for the benefit of railway people, but I do wonder what is easiest for folk on the ground - you have giant numbers as per GBRF and the old EWS, then there is sensible size DRS, and then the new red DBC livery with white numbers in a font which is almost impossible to read.
Does it matter to anyone? Are large numbers too hard to read up close? And do staff find the white on red DBC hard to read?

 

[61653 HTAFC]

^There was of course 57601 which had enormous numbers in its' initial livery... not particularly easy to read (or even look at) though!

(Not my photo)

 

[Bevan Price]

I would have thought that the location & small size of some numbers makes it difficult for "on the ground" staff (e.g. working on stations, etc.) makes it harder for them to identify - and report any faults they observe on passing trains. No problem if there is only 1 or 2 trains per hour - but if there are several Pendolinos a few minutes apart - which is the one observed with (for example) a smoking axlebox ??

Is this, maybe, because the opinions of artistic design consultants are considered more important than practicality ?

 

[E_Reeves]

I've seen where on a GC 180 it just has carriage numbers on the front and no set number. Quite confusing. Also white writing on yellow?!?

 

[Julius]

For Legal reasons, all of there registrations have to be printed and visable, due to any incident taking place the RAIB and the TOC can say that this number was running this headcode when it broke down or something.

 

[43096]

For Legal reasons, all of there registrations have to be printed and visable, due to any incident taking place the RAIB and the TOC can say that this number was running this headcode when it broke down or something.

Are you sure about that?

The interior (cab) has to show the registered number, but the outside doesn't actually have to. Obviously for a TOC fleet they will do (normally), but there are exceptions.

Otherwise how do kettles run around with their old numbers (they would carry 98xxx otherwise), how do heritage diesels run (e.g. 41001 is registered as 43000 but carries 41001 externally with the 43000 number in the cab) and 91107 ran as 91007 for a period when it was named Skyfall.

 

[TheEdge]

I've always assumed the relative size and prominence of numbers was to assist staff. Many a night at Crown Point the yard controller would stare out of his window looking for the cabside numbers on the 90s to make sure the right one had turned up.

Although as mentioned that doesn't really apply to the small awkwardly placed numbers on the Voyagers.

At least we don't get the relatively complex hash digit numbers seen all over Europe.

 

[Julius]

I've always assumed the relative size and prominence of numbers was to assist staff. Many a night at Crown Point the yard controller would stare out of his window looking for the cabside numbers on the 90s to make sure the right one had turned up.

Although as mentioned that doesn't really apply to the small awkwardly placed numbers on the Voyagers.

At least we don't get the relatively complex hash digit numbers seen all over Europe.

Yes, funny you should say that as the numbering on the BR Class 111 DMU sets are not clearly visible. Although not in service, but in BR times I should imagine it would have been very hard to locate the registration if you were a depot driver or Guard!

 

[Roast Veg]

At least we don't get the relatively complex hash digit numbers seen all over Europe.

The check digit is good for the avoidance of doubt in checking numbers at speed or in low visibility - plus it can be totally ignored in day to day operation.

 

[PeterC]

For Legal reasons, all of there registrations have to be printed and visable, due to any incident taking place the RAIB and the TOC can say that this number was running this headcode when it broke down or something.

The last time that I paid a lot of attention to the minutiae of unit numbers was with the old class 306 but back then I remember units that had been reformed with different unit numbers of different vehicles in the set.

 

[driver9000]

I've seen where on a GC 180 it just has carriage numbers on the front and no set number. Quite confusing. Also white writing on yellow?!?

The set number on a 180 is carried on the coupler lid which is often left open or is missing. The last 2 digits of the vehicle number identify the set.

 

[Bertie the bus]

I would have thought that the location & small size of some numbers makes it difficult for "on the ground" staff (e.g. working on stations, etc.) makes it harder for them to identify - and report any faults they observe on passing trains. No problem if there is only 1 or 2 trains per hour - but if there are several Pendolinos a few minutes apart - which is the one observed with (for example) a smoking axlebox ??

Wouldn't the first call be to the signalbox and they would want headcode, not unit number.

 

[Marklund]

See
GM/RT2453

 

[Bevan Price]

Wouldn't the first call be to the signalbox and they would want headcode, not unit number.

Yes - but if you are working trackside or on a station, how do you know the correct headcode ? With several trains per hour, you don't necessarily know if it is on time, or running out of booked sequence.