Unexpected Court Fine and no idea what to do.

[edwardox]

Okay so basically a couple of months ago I tried to board a Class 387 train from Twyford to Didcot, I tried to pay at the Twyford station but the ticket machine wouldn't work, I boarded the train waiting for the inspectors to come, they came and I asked to buy a ticket, they replied that I had violated railway byelaws and I would be fined, they asked if I wanted to pay upfront and obviously I said no as I knew I could probably contest it pretty easily. I gave the my address and alas waited for the letter to come.

Problem is I moved not too soon after and my address changed, I forgot about the fine because I had some personal issues I was dealing with at the time, over 5 months on I get a letter from an enforcement agency saying I needed to pay a fine of the sum of £469, I thought it was completely outlandish and apparently they decided to prosecute as I didn't return their letters, I wasn't aware of the hearing at all. My letters are normally redirected in the case of me moving but I still didn't receive any letters, I did get letters that were re-directed at the time.

So I go to the magistrates court to investigate and see what I could do, they told me about the location but said they couldn't print off any paperwork but gave me a hearing number and a case number. I put in a statutory request like they had said and that the case would essentially restart and the fines would be on hold.

Now I know better to board a train without a ticket, I'm a big lover for the railways, and it was just that I was in a rush. I can understand that people dodge all the time and I'm in that predicament and regardless of the fact that railways are my passion, I'm still in the same kettle of fish as the other fare dodgers at the moment (personally not a fan of the thought but there we go). With the trial restarting, what should I do? I'm too poor to afford a solicitor and legal aid won't cover it. I don't really know what to do as I've never had to go to court before. I'd looked extensively on the topic and I doubt by this point arbitration or settling out of court isn't an option.

Any advice would be appreciated, and feel free the flame me for my mistake.

 

[furlong]

You tried to pay but the ticket machine wouldn't work. What exactly was wrong with it?
It was just that you were in a rush.

The train company will usually still settle with you out of court in the circumstances you describe if you get in touch with them and ask.

 

[WesternLancer]

Okay so basically a couple of months ago I tried to board a Class 387 train from Twyford to Didcot, I tried to pay at the Twyford station but the ticket machine wouldn't work, I boarded the train waiting for the inspectors to come, they came and I asked to buy a ticket, they replied that I had violated railway byelaws and I would be fined, they asked if I wanted to pay upfront and obviously I said no as I knew I could probably contest it pretty easily. I gave the my address and alas waited for the letter to come.

Problem is I moved not too soon after and my address changed, I forgot about the fine because I had some personal issues I was dealing with at the time, over 5 months on I get a letter from an enforcement agency saying I needed to pay a fine of the sum of £469, I thought it was completely outlandish and apparently they decided to prosecute as I didn't return their letters, I wasn't aware of the hearing at all. My letters are normally redirected in the case of me moving but I still didn't receive any letters, I did get letters that were re-directed at the time.

So I go to the magistrates court to investigate and see what I could do, they told me about the location but said they couldn't print off any paperwork but gave me a hearing number and a case number. I put in a statutory request like they had said and that the case would essentially restart and the fines would be on hold.

Now I know better to board a train without a ticket, I'm a big lover for the railways, and it was just that I was in a rush. I can understand that people dodge all the time and I'm in that predicament and regardless of the fact that railways are my passion, I'm still in the same kettle of fish as the other fare dodgers at the moment (personally not a fan of the thought but there we go). With the trial restarting, what should I do? I'm too poor to afford a solicitor and legal aid won't cover it. I don't really know what to do as I've never had to go to court before. I'd looked extensively on the topic and I doubt by this point arbitration or settling out of court isn't an option.

Any advice would be appreciated, and feel free the flame me for my mistake.

So are you saying you have made statutory Declaration that you were unaware you had been prosecuted when you went to ask at the court what had happened?

 

[Gloster]

Was the ticket office open at the time?

As persons more expert than me will no doubt post, you need to get in touch with the railway before the case comes to court again and try to arrange an out of court settlement, which might have been possible originally of your post had caught up with you.

 

[WesternLancer]

You tried to pay but the ticket machine wouldn't work. What exactly was wrong with it?
It was just that you were in a rush.

The train company will usually still settle with you out of court in the circumstances you describe if you get in touch with them and ask.

Not if the prosecution has already happened albeit unknown to the op because they did not receive their mail.

I suspect paperwork needs to be shared to understand what actually has happened and where things are at at this point in time.

 

[furlong]

It is important to get the court paperwork though. If you post it here, people can check the train company followed the correct procedures. There've been some cases recently where the train companies broke the rules. You ought to make sure it's not one of those cases before you do the stat dec.

 

[Gloster]

If you post any paperwork, please obscure your name, address and any other identifying details, such as reference numbers.

 

[furlong]

Not if the prosecution has already happened albeit unknown to the op because they did not receive their mail.

Yes, in those circumstances: There is usually a settlement offer before commencing prosecution which is put back onto the table if it wasn't received.

 

[John R]

Yes, in those circumstances: There is usually a settlement offer before commencing prosecution which is put back onto the table if it wasn't received.

Though in many cases a settlement offer only comes after a suitably apologetic reply to a first letter asking for their side of the story.

So it’s not the case that there will automatically have been an offer made.

 

[WesternLancer]

Okay so basically a couple of months ago I tried to board a Class 387 train from Twyford to Didcot, I tried to pay at the Twyford station but the ticket machine wouldn't work, I boarded the train waiting for the inspectors to come, they came and I asked to buy a ticket, they replied that I had violated railway byelaws and I would be fined, they asked if I wanted to pay upfront and obviously I said no as I knew I could probably contest it pretty easily. I gave the my address and alas waited for the letter to come.

Problem is I moved not too soon after and my address changed, I forgot about the fine because I had some personal issues I was dealing with at the time, over 5 months on I get a letter from an enforcement agency saying I needed to pay a fine of the sum of £469, I thought it was completely outlandish and apparently they decided to prosecute as I didn't return their letters, I wasn't aware of the hearing at all. My letters are normally redirected in the case of me moving but I still didn't receive any letters, I did get letters that were re-directed at the time.

So I go to the magistrates court to investigate and see what I could do, they told me about the location but said they couldn't print off any paperwork but gave me a hearing number and a case number. I put in a statutory request like they had said and that the case would essentially restart and the fines would be on hold.

Now I know better to board a train without a ticket, I'm a big lover for the railways, and it was just that I was in a rush. I can understand that people dodge all the time and I'm in that predicament and regardless of the fact that railways are my passion, I'm still in the same kettle of fish as the other fare dodgers at the moment (personally not a fan of the thought but there we go). With the trial restarting, what should I do? I'm too poor to afford a solicitor and legal aid won't cover it. I don't really know what to do as I've never had to go to court before. I'd looked extensively on the topic and I doubt by this point arbitration or settling out of court isn't an option.

Any advice would be appreciated, and feel free the flame me for my mistake.

Just going back to this to help clarify a few points

for future ref - If you were offered Penalty fare on the train it would almost certainly have been best to take that option, you are not obliged to pay them then and there and there is a route for an Appeal, which as you said, you hoped you would have been overturned.

If you refuse that they will 'report you for investigation' - without some proof of no ticket buying facilities or actually having a valid ticket that the inspectors don't understand is valid -- the best end result of that is negotiating an out of court settlement. This is rarely if ever going to cost less than a £50 Penalty fare as they habitually charge an 'admin fee' for investigating the ticket irregularity and these are usually £150. And they have you over a barrel because if you don't pay that they will take you to court and without he proofs I mention they would win, and the court outcome is more costly than the £150 admin fee and also results in a criminal record.

But it looks like they took you to court after you moved address and you never got any of the letters about them 'investigating' the incident, or the letters from the court informing you you were being prosecuted. That process must have concluded and resulted in the demand for £469 you mention.

Is that the case? Have you been prosecuted, found guilty and fined by the court?

Is it GWR you are dealing with? If so have a read of the GWR revenue protection policy as downloadable from their website - see

https://www.gwr.com/-/media/gwr-sc-website/files/revenue-protection-policy/GWR-Revenue-Protection-Policy-January-2023.pdf

Is it possible for you to answer the questions in the posts above so that people can advise you what best to do?

But basically I would suggest you need to urgently contact GWR - say that you had no knowledge of the prosecution, and ask them if they would be prepared to settle the matter out of court if the case is 're started' as a result of the Statutory Declaration process.