UK switching to electric vehicles discussion

[jon0844]

I suspect there is a bit of a harder ceiling imposed by the fixed reduction gear between the motor and the wheels. The gear ratio must be a compromise between acceleration off the line and ultimate top speed. But the torque curve is such that these cars get to up to speed much faster than the top speed stat would suggest.

I think it will depend on the vehicle, as some cars have different trims with different power levels and it's possible that's just a software limit (hence why VW can offer more performance for a fee). On other cars, I am thinking that eventually we're going to see conversions and upgrades akin to the good old days of hot hatch tuning. You will get those that change a lot of mechanicals to get more power, and then you'll get the people who just chip the ECU.

So far, it doesn't seem like there's really much of a market for any tuning of EVs but it must be coming. The kids buying performance cars of tomorrow will be likely getting EVs, so all those in the market today doing great things with ICE cars should be preparing to transition!

 

[trebor79]

I think it will depend on the vehicle, as some cars have different trims with different power levels and it's possible that's just a software limit (hence why VW can offer more performance for a fee). On other cars, I am thinking that eventually we're going to see conversions and upgrades akin to the good old days of hot hatch tuning. You will get those that change a lot of mechanicals to get more power, and then you'll get the people who just chip the ECU.

So far, it doesn't seem like there's really much of a market for any tuning of EVs but it must be coming. The kids buying performance cars of tomorrow will be likely getting EVs, so all those in the market today doing great things with ICE cars should be preparing to transition!

I think it's probably more difficult to get a meaningful performance increase. You'll just bump into hard limits like the current capacity of a cable, connector, battery module etc.
That said, I don't see why you need one when there are family cars capable of 0-60 in less than 3 seconds.

 

[pdq]

I suspect the reason for the ever-increasing limited top speeds on day-to-day ICE cars is simply a function of having enough power to enable swift acceleration at normal road speeds resulted in the vehicles having the capability to carry on accelerating past those normal road speeds. Ignoring hard limiters, a petrol car with a top speed of, say 90mph will not have the power to accelerate safely from 50 to 70. This is much less true of EVs where the maximum obtainable speed doesn't need to be vastly above the typical usage speeds. My Niro EV will get to 60 in 7.8" with a top speed of 104mph. My previous Octavia did 0-60 in roughly the same time but, in order to achieve that acceleration, needed enough power to eventually get to 140mph.

 

[stuu]

I suspect the reason for the ever-increasing limited top speeds on day-to-day ICE cars is simply a function of having enough power to enable swift acceleration at normal road speeds resulted in the vehicles having the capability to carry on accelerating past those normal road speeds. Ignoring hard limiters, a petrol car with a top speed of, say 90mph will not have the power to accelerate safely from 50 to 70. This is much less true of EVs where the maximum obtainable speed doesn't need to be vastly above the typical usage speeds. My Niro EV will get to 60 in 7.8" with a top speed of 104mph. My previous Octavia did 0-60 in roughly the same time but, in order to achieve that acceleration, needed enough power to eventually get to 140mph.

Surely more around efficiency more than acceleration? An ICE is most efficient at the lower end of it's maximum RPM, so you want it to be able to do 60-70 mph at ~2.5k RPM, so it can go a lot faster. That doesn't apply to EVs

 

[pdq]

Surely more around efficiency more than acceleration? An ICE is most efficient at the lower end of it's maximum RPM, so you want it to be able to do 60-70 mph at ~2.5k RPM, so it can go a lot faster. That doesn't apply to EVs

Indeed, and just highlights that a high top speed isn't itself by design, rather a consequence of other requirements.

 

[75A]

Just spent a great day @ Kirkistown @ the Porsche Ireland Trackday,
Lots of proper Sports Cars doing proper speeds - safely, in a controlled environment

 

[quantinghome]

I think it will depend on the vehicle, as some cars have different trims with different power levels and it's possible that's just a software limit (hence why VW can offer more performance for a fee). On other cars, I am thinking that eventually we're going to see conversions and upgrades akin to the good old days of hot hatch tuning. You will get those that change a lot of mechanicals to get more power, and then you'll get the people who just chip the ECU.

So far, it doesn't seem like there's really much of a market for any tuning of EVs but it must be coming. The kids buying performance cars of tomorrow will be likely getting EVs, so all those in the market today doing great things with ICE cars should be preparing to transition!

There's just not much to tune on an EV. ICEs have an almost endless list of stuff to tinker with. EVs are literally just Battery > Motor > Wheels. Great for hassle free easy motoring, not so much for people who like to spend their evenings tinkering under the bonnet. What's there to change, maybe the stepper gear?

 

[jon0844]

Hyundai has experimented with using software to simulate gears and even introduce virtual limiters, but most 'tuning' will be just ways to boost motor output - either in software as Tesla and VW has done or replacing the motor entirely, possibly even adding a second motor on cars that have the room (say a platform that already offered dual motor options) and upgrading the suspension etc.

I doubt that once EVs are everywhere we won't be seeing companies popping up to do mods, especially as younger motorists get them.

 

[AM9]

Hyundai has experimented with using software to simulate gears and even introduce virtual limiters, but most 'tuning' will be just ways to boost motor output - either in software as Tesla and VW has done or replacing the motor entirely, possibly even adding a second motor on cars that have the room (say a platform that already offered dual motor options) and upgrading the suspension etc.

I doubt that once EVs are everywhere we won't be seeing companies popping up to do mods, especially as younger motorists get them.

Double negative there.

 

[bspahh]

I got a KIA EV3 in August and took it for a holiday from Cambridgeshire to the West of Scotland, driving 1500 miles.

It has an 81kWh battery, which is enough for about 240 miles cruising on a motorway at 70 mph. However, I prefer to not go under 20% which would be a 195 mile range, and its best to not charge higher than 80% on a fast charger, so from 20 to 80% gives an extra 144 mile range.

I set off fully charged and used 13 chargers. Two of those were AC chargers where I left it charging overnight. The rest were DC chargers, where I got a charging rate between 25kW and 125kW.

There were another 6 where I failed to charge the car. For two of those, the chargers were out of order. Two more should have worked, but the charging failed to start. At one site there were 2 working chargers that were busy and a 3rd that was broken. Another site had a broken 50kW charger, and a working 7kW one (although I didn't want to wait for that).

Most of the time I was able to use an Electroverse card to pay for the charging. You don't need to use them for your home electricity to get one. For one charger I had to install an app. The rest worked with a contactless credit card.

Some comments:

• Most petrol stations have a canopy which shelters them from the rain. None of the chargers that I used had a canopy and it was raining for three charging sessions. One had a screen which was hard to read in direct sunshine.
• Some of the charging problems might have been from me not following the instructions properly. I expected the process of starting the charging to be more consistent.
• DC charging cables are pretty heavy. They were fine for me, but would be too heavy for my 85 year old mother. One charger needed a sharp tug to remove the plug from its holder.
• On Skye, I was staying 20 miles from the nearest public charger. The first fast charger failed, and the next was busy, so I drove a 20 mile round trip to a fast charger the evening before a long trip.
• The Charging Scotland 50kW chargers have a time limit of 45 minutes, with a £1 a minute fee if you stay longer than that. Once that meant leaving a meal early to move the car. A couple of other times, it meant sitting in the car whilst it charged, as there wasn't anything else to do nearby.
• Three quarters of the chargers were near a public toilet
• The charger at Morrisons in Penrith is listed as a 50kW one. However, you only get 25kW if two cars are charging at the same time.

 

[jon0844]

I recommend getting an app like A Better Route Planner (I pay for the version that works on CarPlay/Android Auto) because you can filter chargers by many of the things you want/don't want. In most cases you can see in advance how many bays are free and when they last reported a charge (so you know it's working).

You can't filter solely on price or by charger type (not sure if either may be added) but as many older chargers get replaced, the load sharing issue and the weight of the cable (newer chargers have arms that carry the bulk of the weight) will become a thing of the past.

I am not sure you can filter by chargers that are covered BUT the app does use a crowd sourcing for pictures of sites so you can always look up a site that it proposes to use, or you choose to use (you can even plan routes from home, work etc on a desktop and save the plan for later travel).

While many people think EVs are a recent thing, they have been around for over a decade and we're now at the point where a lot of chargers are no longer fit for purpose.

 

[bspahh]

I recommend getting an app like A Better Route Planner (I pay for the version that works on CarPlay/Android Auto) because you can filter chargers by many of the things you want/don't want. In most cases you can see in advance how many bays are free and when they last reported a charge (so you know it's working).

You can't filter solely on price or by charger type (not sure if either may be added) but as many older chargers get replaced, the load sharing issue and the weight of the cable (newer chargers have arms that carry the bulk of the weight) will become a thing of the past.

I am not sure you can filter by chargers that are covered BUT the app does use a crowd sourcing for pictures of sites so you can always look up a site that it proposes to use, or you choose to use (you can even plan routes from home, work etc on a desktop and save the plan for later travel).

While many people think EVs are a recent thing, they have been around for over a decade and we're now at the point where a lot of chargers are no longer fit for purpose.

I've got the free version of A Better Route Planner, and I used it to pick a fast charger before setting out. However, I prefer the Waze interface for directions. The Electroverse app is free and works with Android Auto. It lists the speeds of the charger and when they were last used. A passenger might be able to check if chargers are free, but its too fiddly to scroll through them whilst driving.

One of the stops where all the chargers were out of action was when my wife wanted to stop for a toilet break, and I followed road signs to the Services. I would have used a charger if one had been available, but I would have stopped in any case, even if I knew that they were out of action.

Usually, I'll be close enough to home to not need to use a fast charger.

 

[jon0844]

We are spoilt for choice when it comes to navigation apps now, but it's worth noting that you can create an itinerary on ABRP and then export it to Google Maps. Waze is better for navigation (especially traffic management) but ABRP is improving month-by-month.

What you can do is plan a route on ABRP and pick out the best chargers (based on your favourites/criteria) and then just use Waze or Maps to navigate to the charger you selected. It's hardly difficult as all satnavs seem better than they were with working with EVs.

I do find it great to do a basic plan for a long journey (what few I've made thus far) but in reality I often just drive until someone in the car wants to stop for a break (toilet, drink, leg stretch, or even seeing somewhere interesting to stop) and then you just look to charge then - which means the whole plan goes out of the window.

Ultimately, if you just charge when you were stopped anyway then it doesn't impact your journey time the same as planning a stop where you may not actually want to stop but the car says so. Sure, you get a better charge if you let it run down low, but it's still very possible to do lots of mini charges of 5-10 minutes as and when.

 

[Noddy]

range, and its best to not charge higher than 80% on a fast charger, so from 20 to 80% gives an extra 144 mile range.

Just on this specific point it makes no difference to the battery whether it’s charged to 100% on a fast/rapid charger or slow home charger. The issue is the speed of charging slows down completely at high states of charge (typically above 80%). The reason to not charge above 80% at a public rapid charger is twofold: 1) it’s normally much quicker to leave early and move on and charge again sooner where the charging speeds where the charging will be higher, and 2) etiquette-you may be sat there charging from 85-95% while someone else might be waiting who can charge from 10-80% in the same amount of time.

This is the charging curve for the EV3-it’s actually pretty flat which is good (much better than my Cupra Born which peaks at about 20% iirc and then drops off rapidly) but it does start to drop off cliff edges about 70%.

(Image shows charging curve of Kia EV3-credit: EVKX.net)

 

[Snow1964]

Looked up Zapmap data on chargers
Rapid 50kW to 149kW and ultra-rapid 150Kw and higher
now in 6554 locations
17,132 devices
29,323 connectors
212 added in August (latest month of data)
2661 added so far in 2025 (Jan-Aug)

For all public chargers including slow (<8kW), fast (8-49kW), rapid & u-r
now 42,970 locations
85,163 devices
120,327 connectors
1234 added during August

So becoming lot easier to do a rapid charge if you are away from home with rapid and ultra-rapid now about 20% of chargers.

Rapid and ultra-rapid, most are Instavolt with 2103, then Tesla with 2054, then BP pulse with 1382

Rapid & ultra-rapid market share is Instavolt at 12.3%, Tesla supercharger 12%, BP pulse 8.1%, Osprey 7.9%, MPG EV at 7.2%, Gridserve electric highway at 5.9%, Shell recharge 4.1%, others remainder

EV charging statistics 2026 - Zapmap

view the latest monthly data on the uk public electric vehicle charging network. track growth across standard, standard plus, rapid, ultra-rapid and destination charging points with zapmap insights.

www.zap-map.com

 

[greyman42]

Does anyone know if the car on fire at Heathrow Airport car park was an electric vehicle?

 

[MicroLithium]

Does anyone know if the car on fire at Heathrow Airport car park was an electric vehicle?

According to London Fire Brigade, it was a diesel car - https://www.london-fire.gov.uk/incidents/2025/october/fire-in-car-park-heathrow-airport/

 

[jon0844]

According to London Fire Brigade, it was a diesel car - https://www.london-fire.gov.uk/incidents/2025/october/fire-in-car-park-heathrow-airport/

What would they know? The armchair experts know it was an EV because diesel doesn't burn. Haven't you seen proof on that YouTube video where a match dipped in diesel is extinguished?

Absolutely an EV, like all car fires. Thanks to AI even videos showing a diesel car or bus are clearly faked.
Just like your GP of twenty years was part of the Covid hoax, now all firemen and women are being paid by the EV Illuminati to give false statements.

I am sure George Soros is involved, somehow.

 

[Harpers Tate]

Mirror:
"Initial reports suggest car is an electric vehicle

The cause of the fire remains unknown at this stage, but initial reports suggest the car is an electrical vehicle. The vehicle was destroyed by the blaze, while two adjacent vehicles were damaged."

Huge fire breaks out inside car park at Heathrow Airport with major road closed

Bright orange flames tore through Heathrow Airport's Terminal 3 car park this morning, sparking a major emergency services response and travel chaos for those heading to the airport

www.mirror.co.uk

(Not later corrected)

Daily Mail:

"The London Fire Brigade says the cause of the blaze is 'under investigation' but the vehicle involved was diesel-powered and the flames were 'under control' by 10.06am."

Heathrow airport is hit by fire as blaze tears through car park

Four fire engines and around 25 firefighters arrived on scene this morning to tackle the blaze as it wrecked the multi-storey facility.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Express:

"Four fire engines and over 20 firefighters rushed to the scene to tackle the blaze, which involved a small diesel vehicle catching light."

Chaos at major UK airport as huge fire breaks out in car park

Flames have been filmed tearing through a car park.

www.express.co.uk

and London Fire Brigade themselves

"A diesel car on level one was destroyed by fire....."

Fire in car park - Heathrow Airport

Four fire engines and around 25 firefighters were called to a fire in a multi-storey car park at Heathrow Airport.

www.london-fire.gov.uk

Draw your own conclusions.

 

[Sun Chariot]

Electrical fire in a diesel car?

 

[jon0844]

Faulty electrical systems are common triggers for car fires. That's the slow smouldering you see sometimes minutes before, until the flammable or combustible material catches fire and all bets are off.

But mention the word electrical and obviously that means an EV!

 

[GusB]

Does anyone know if the car on fire at Heathrow Airport car park was an electric vehicle?

And your point is?

 

[jon0844]

And your point is?

Whenever there's a report of a vehicle fire, the comment section on any newspaper or social media post will very quickly include the assumption that it was an EV. Often such sections get bombarded in a short space of time - suggesting there are groups that share links to purposely get negative comments posted to spread FUD (are these just trolls or perhaps people funded by organisations working with the fossil fuel industry?).

When it is proven it wasn't an EV as is usually the case (given EVs catch fire around 1 in 60 times that an ICE car does), sometimes even with footage recorded of the vehicle and the plate that can be checked online, it is debunked as fake/AI/cover up.

It's as boring as someone calling an EV a milk float, but as every day goes by the anti-EV brigade are running out of arguments and 'gotchas'. The fact more people buy EVs every month shows that the transition is going to happen no matter what.

Rest assured as cars get faster to charge and newer batteries will offer ranges in excess of 400-500 miles (plus we now have the fastest car on the road being an EV, even if the battery dies in no time at all at max speed) the arguments will change.

 

[greyman42]

And your point is?

I was not making a point, I was asking a question. What made you think I was making a point?

 

[jon0844]

As I thought, given the new number plate in September, EV sales were way higher than even August - which was also another great month.

September new car market delivers record number of EVs - SMMT

New car market rises by 13.7% to reach 312,887 units – the best September performance since 2020.

www.smmt.co.uk

• New car market rises by 13.7% to reach 312,887 units – the best September performance since 2020.
• Manufacturer investments and model choice, complemented by new Electric Car Grant, deliver 72,779 new battery electric vehicles – the highest ever monthly volume and, when combined with hybrids, means electrified vehicles comprise the majority of registrations.
• Overall market up 4.2% YTD after second biggest month of the year, with BEV share rising to 22.1%.

 

[Mawkie]

As I thought, given the new number plate in September, EV sales were way higher than even August - which was also another great month.

Those PHEV sales (up 56.4%) are surely the last gasps of a dying fossil fuel industry; they really are the worst of both worlds.

Presumably the sales of PHEVs (and BEVs actually) are distorted by the low Benefit in Kind rates offered by HMRC? The salary sacrifice scheme TfL brought in recently has meant the staff car park is now awash with pure electric cars! Of course, the mess room is now also awash with BEV converts, who are spreading the positive news further (I haven't heard any negative news, which is quite unusual in the mess rooms I frequent - as train ops love to moan!)

 

[cactustwirly]

Those PHEV sales (up 56.4%) are surely the last gasps of a dying fossil fuel industry; they really are the worst of both worlds.

Presumably the sales of PHEVs (and BEVs actually) are distorted by the low Benefit in Kind rates offered by HMRC? The salary sacrifice scheme TfL brought in recently has meant the staff car park is now awash with pure electric cars! Of course, the mess room is now also awash with BEV converts, who are spreading the positive news further (I haven't heard any negative news, which is quite unusual in the mess rooms I frequent - as train ops love to moan!)

Who said the fossil fuel industry is dying?

 

[thejuggler]

As I thought, given the new number plate in September, EV sales were way higher than even August - which was also another great month.

September new car market delivers record number of EVs - SMMT

New car market rises by 13.7% to reach 312,887 units – the best September performance since 2020.

www.smmt.co.uk

The problem with new vehicle figures is 'registered' does not mean 'sold'. Autotrader currently has over 5,000 brand new EVs being advertised, some with huge discounts.

 

[Bald Rick]

The problem with new vehicle figures is 'registered' does not mean 'sold'. Autotrader currently has over 5,000 brand new EVs being advertised, some with huge discounts.

It also has 6000+ petrol, almost 3000 diesel and well over 7000 hybrids advertised as brand new, some with huge discounts.

This has always been the case.

 

[Snow1964]

It also has 6000+ petrol, almost 3000 diesel and well over 7000 hybrids advertised as brand new, some with huge discounts.

This has always been the case.

Yes, especially at the end of month or quarter when dealers register few extra vehicles to hit a manufacturer volume bonus.

5000 new EVs in a month when 72,779 were sold is couple of days worth, not much more than timing difference.

6000+ petrol of 141,308 sold again is just equivalent to couple of days sales. As @Bald Rick says, always been the case, so these figures roughly net out with those brought forward from last month.

But the percentages tell the story
Petrol 45.2% (it was over half few months back)
Diesel 4.0% (probably lowest percentage for 20-30 years)
Hybrids 15.3% (around 1 in 6.5 cars)
Battery EV 23.3% (getting close to 1 in 4)
PHEV 12.2% (excessively complicated, but given silly tax break, let's await the budget and see if it's tax break ends)

On current trends battery will grow to over 26% by end of the year, and PHEVs could easily switch if tax break ends. And a lot more new small EVs are going to go on sale in next few months which will boost EVs even more.