Twitter-the train driver's enemy

[455driver]

The world needs more people like her.

 

[Roverman]

Lord McAlpine has the right idea. Sue any mouthy idiot everytime they say something stupid.

 

[KA4C]

What, and you are saying train driver's don't use mobile phones. Driver's are doing it all the time. And there are cases where people have passed signals at danger and lost their job because they were on their phone.

The Black box will not tell you whether a driver was on his phone, booking his holiday on his I Pad or whatever else driver's get up

Absolute twaddle. There have been a minority of incidents as you describe and the drivers were found out. Its simple mobile phone records

To claim that drivers are "doing it all of the time" is simply untrue and shows a lack of understanding of a job that you claim to do (?) and your colleagues

No true driver would post such rubbish on here

 

[NorthernSpirit]

Trial by twitter is too common these days. Has to be stopped.

The passengers who do the trial by Twitter are the sort of people who have their phones glued to their hand all day. Complaining about absolutley anything, best punishment for these types of people is a former First North Western class 142 put on at rush hour.

 

[Moonshot]

There's something to be said for trains being updated (especially those that already have Wi-Fi and a modern PIS) to broadcast non safety critical information sent to it remotely. It wouldn't be dissimilar to sending a Tweet to announce problems, except people would receive it even if they're not checking Twitter or even carrying a phone at all.

On the Victoria Line, I've heard announcements about delays on London Overground that must be relayed to the train without the driver having to do anything.

This would allow the driver to just get on with driving, and only give information when it's specifically about a problem/situation affecting the train itself (like it's broken down!). If there's a general problem in the area, that could be done centrally.

I believe the new TL and Crossrail trains will have this, but it would be good to retrofit to other stock whenever being given a major overhaul. Now that every company has, or should have, a social media strategy - how difficult would it be for the same team to have a way to selectively pass on important messages to trains. There could be additional codes within the message to only have specific services told, based on location, direction or even headcode.

I actually asked that question a few years ago of a shift manager in the command post at the top of the Square One Building.....he was giving me a guide tour of what goes on up there, and that was one that did occur to me. As it happens, I believe there is an ongoing project covering that?

 

[VP185]

Had a good example of this today.... although it hasn't appeared on Twitter as yet to my knowledge.
I was on a 6-car set (2 units in multiple). The rear unit was all locked out of use and was to be detached further into the journey. As a result we stop at the 3-car marker boards as it prevents a delay whilst passengers trying to board the locked up set. However, a passenger was adamant in a discussion with me that I had stopped short and this was a serious safety issue. He even went back up the platform to take a photo with his phone.
I suggested he tried to board the rear 3-carriages..... he didn't even try.

 

[O L Leigh]

Actually at 20 mph it is not difficult to see what someone is doing in the other cab, especially as you are looking that way when you acknowledge them.

Just talking from experience mate. You say no, I say yes. The wonders of having different views/experiences and disagreeing. In today's world.

I'm sorry, but you can't see if someone is using a mobile phone or something similar inside the cab of a passing train no matter what speed it is doing unless that driver happens to be holding the device in question up to the windscreen. The most you will see is that the other driver is looking down rather than up out of the window, but that doesn't mean that they are doing something they shouldn't be. They could be checking their watch or their schedule cards, for example. But no, you want to think the worst.

Views or experiences...? Yes, if they were merely conjecture or opinion. However, what you are doing is attempting to present them as facts and, based on my own experience, you simply don't know what you're talking about. You've barely been in the grade for a year.

And it may be one incident but shows how easy it is to pass a signal at danger close to protecting a junction with an express travelling at 80 mph.

I shall be making my own enquiries about this alleged incident and reporting back.

It don't bother me. I am simply offering up a reason why TOC's might go down the line of installing cameras in cabs.

You must fit right in.

O L Leigh

 

[LondonJohn]

I like twitter. I will use it to compliment staff and companies for something general. Great service from xxx on till 17 tonight. Most usually get an acknowledgement so I hope the feedback will filter down to the individuals. I will also have a little grumble such as didnt have time to put train thru wash today I see. Things like this rarely gets an acknowledgement.

Some TOC twitter accounts are fantastic, especially in the times of disruption with really valuable information. Others are woeful and almost a waste of space.

I would never be abusive or rude in person or on twitter and whilst it does not excuse such actions, the lack of information at times of disruption can lead to frustration.

Someone somewhere must be sitting in a control room, knowing and planning what is going on. TOC need to get that info out to staff and passengers a lot quicker than they do.

A lot of TOC staff also tweet very valuable real time information as well from their personal accounts. This is also great. However some also tweet some pretty shocking statements. One was just a rant swearing about passengers on a particular line. I am guessing that they had a rough late Friday night journey but that doesn't excuse the unprofessionalism. Just the same as a passenger shouldn't tweet what they wouldn't say should be the same for the TOC staff.

FWIW putting comments my own and not that of my employer can't absolve you legally on social networks and whilst there have been a few high profile issues, Paris Brown the Kent Police Youth Czar who had to resign after a few days after her personal comments. I think twitter is growing in popularity so quickly it is going to bite someone on the bum sooner or later.

 

[Beveridges]

I'm just glad I'm on a Maintenance Depot and away from it all as I know how intolerable the public can be, some of them come to you just to wind you up!

 

[EM2]

Someone somewhere must be sitting in a control room, knowing and planning what is going on. TOC need to get that info out to staff and passengers a lot quicker than they do.

But that information can change literally by the minute, for example a decision by a signal man to give the road to a late xx:55 before an on-time xx:05 on an another platform. Control may ask a driver to work a particular service, different to their diagram, to then find that the driver can't do that.
And it doesn't matter what you do, someone will complain. I was in a situation where I was making PA announcements every five minutes during a disruption. Checking Twitter on the way home, there were a number of complaints that no announcements had been made.

 

[BestWestern]

Had a good example of this today.... although it hasn't appeared on Twitter as yet to my knowledge.
I was on a 6-car set (2 units in multiple). The rear unit was all locked out of use and was to be detached further into the journey. As a result we stop at the 3-car marker boards as it prevents a delay whilst passengers trying to board the locked up set. However, a passenger was adamant in a discussion with me that I had stopped short and this was a serious safety issue. He even went back up the platform to take a photo with his phone.
I suggested he tried to board the rear 3-carriages..... he didn't even try.

It always appears to me that, certainly at our place, Drivers are far less constrained by the tedium of 'customer service', and are thus often more open to 'lively conversation' with idiots like this. "P*ss off you prat" or something similar would have done very nicely I think!

 

[kipper]

Mobile phones, cameras, tweets, facebook. Let drivers drive and we'll get you there!!

 

[jon0844]

Mobile phones, cameras, tweets, facebook. Let drivers drive and we'll get you there!!

Nah, better to let drivers use their mobile to access Twitter and reply to people themselves.

@Angrygit: "@FirstCC I'm on the 0925 service that's delayed outside Hitchin and the driver hasn't said anything to us at all. Sack him! #fail #angry #firstcrapitalconnect #othertagithinkiswittybutisnt"

"@Angrygit This is your driver. Take your headphones off or wake the f*** up. I've been saying it's a signal problem ahead and we'll be moving shortly and so far we've been here just 45 seconds. Jeez!"

 

[redbutton]

"Announcements not being made" often times can be down to a problem with the PA system. I've been on trains (especially FCC 319s) where the driver is making announcements but the volume is so low as to be unintelligible above the background noise of compressors running, etc. I wonder if this is because they check the PA when the train is stationary in a (quiet) yard or siding?

So whenever I see people whinging about announcements on Twitter, I consider that the PA might be faulty. Of course, Joe Public probably won't.

 

[jon0844]

I've reported problems with the PA system (including one FCC 317 that had the volume so loud it was clipping and causing obvious discomfort) but don't know if they were fixed because of it.

 

[Antman]

It happens in all walks of life, it's called progress whether we like it or not. Complaints against staff at many establishments can be made in this way. I assume management would listen to both sides of the story before deciding what action (if any) to take so I really don't think it's anything to worry unduly about.

 

[EM2]

The anti-FCC mob's current stick to beat them with is drivers not making announcements during a delay (length not specified) is a breach of NRCoC.
I discussed this some time back: http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=73451

 

[infobleep]

I got complained about on FB yesterday for not walking through my train after Guildford despite:

A. Walking through before Guildford.
B. Making very regular announcements regarding our delay etc, etc throughout the entire journey.
C. The fact that two peak time train loadings boarded at Guildford and beyond rendering a ticket check impossible (full and standing throughout, 1st de-classified and people were left behind). I'm not exactly slim. But it simply wasn't realistic to do so.

Apparently I was "cowering in the back rather than face my angry customers like we always do". Bear in mind that the last time I was very late (1 hour and 15 minutes at peak time in the morning), I spent the majority of the time in the carriages and only went to the back to make an announcement or speak to the driver for any updates etc.

Of course the above is irrelevant. I'm a coward and can't face these people. I also know for a fact that this same person will never actually say anything to your face. I have walked through one of his delayed services once when he was on board and he said nothing to me. He did however go immediately onto FB to complain about the delay and demand compensation etc, etc. I really do feel sorry for these people, I really do. They must sit there trying to think of anything to complain about. It is irrelevant how perfect a job you do. They will still complain.

It got removed anyway. He started ranting that when I check his ticket I click my fingers to gain his attention (I don't, because I have never been able to do it in my life for some reason) because he has his headphones on and is reading a book and therefore doesn't pay attention to me. You wonder why you bother sometimes...

Given that was the case I do hope you didn't tell passengers that they can find you in coach X because if you can't pass through then passengers wouldn't be able to do the same either.

By the way I'm not disagreeing with you not being able to walk through the carriage. It's just that I once heard a guard say he can't walk through due to the number of passengers and then announce that if we wanted to speak to him we could find him in the last carriage.

 

[O L Leigh]

Perhaps you should talk to the driver who was dismissed because he was on his phone when he passed a signal at danger at a major junction.

Well I've made my enquiries and all the people I asked haven't got any idea about this alleged incident, nor have you been able to provide additional details. I can only assume that you've either exaggerated the details or simply made it up in order to bolster your claims.

O L Leigh

 

[VP185]

If this alleged incident had happened as described I'm pretty certain we, as an industry given the serious nature of such an occurrence, would have had it disseminated across the industry especially through driver safety briefing days.
As no one has heard of such an incident occurring in the context described, well, we can all draw our own conclusions from that.

 

[aleph_0]

It's just that I once heard a guard say he can't walk through due to the number of passengers and then announce that if we wanted to speak to him we could find him in the last carriage.

I'd understand such an announcement not to be saying that it was physically impossible for the guard to walk through, but it was impractical and imprudent safety-wise or operationally. A passenger could then make their way through the train, or use the platform at a station.

 

[infobleep]

I'd understand such an announcement not to be saying that it was physically impossible for the guard to walk through, but it was impractical and imprudent safety-wise or operationally. A passenger could then make their way through the train, or use the platform at a station.

Surely it's just as impractical and imprudent safety-wise for the passengers and the guard can also walk along the platform.

I'm not suggesting the guard should but then I'm also not suggesting the passengers should either.

Sent from my HUAWEI U8815 using Tapatalk

 

[island]

Depending on the model of train the guard may need to stay at the back to do the doors.

 

[Solent&Wessex]

I assume management would listen to both sides of the story before deciding what action (if any) to take

Not always no. At my TOC the Passenger's complaint is always considered to be correct and staff are presumed guilty by management until proven innocent (which is often very difficult to do as it is normally one persons word against another). The passenger can do no wrong and are always completely blameless and never at fault.

 

[whhistle]

There are so many false positives on Twitter that pretty much anything the passengers say gets taken with a grain of salt. I've certainly got no fear of being grassed up on it.

A grain? A barrel more like!

As others have said, the TOCs are at fault but they are all businesses remember. Businesses seem to want to bend over backwards to "please" the "customer", even when they are clearly wrong.

If someone complains through twitter, they should expect it to be for information only. A serious complaint needs more official routes.

 

[Tetchytyke]

Not always no. At my TOC the Passenger's complaint is always considered to be correct and staff are presumed guilty by management until proven innocent (which is often very difficult to do as it is normally one persons word against another). The passenger can do no wrong and are always completely blameless and never at fault.

That is a management failing, not a Twitter failing.

Part of my job is dealing with complaints. I obviously have to be seen to be taking the complaint seriously, but I take most of what I'm told with a cellar of salt. Any sensible manager would do the same. Being seen on Twitter as taking a complaint seriously is not the same thing as actually taking it seriously.

It's the same as in any customer service role. People will complain and the company has to be seen to be listening. A good manager will make the complainer think they're being listened to whilst defending their staff. But Twitter complaints are not going anywhere, because it works as much as anything. I've been waiting months for EastCoast to send me some vouchers that they promised after I complained to them and then Passenger Focus; I complained on twitter yesterday and today they say they're on the way.

 

[W230]

I've been waiting months for EastCoast to send me some vouchers that they promised after I complained to them and then Passenger Focus; I complained on twitter yesterday and today they say they're on the way.

I think this is the crux of it. You contact EC directly and get no response for ages. But as soon as you tweet a comment that other people can see in the public domain you get positive action.

We've had a recent safety briefing at work to announce to passengers that if leaving the train to conduct assistance protection etc we should make an announcement and suggest that they take to twitter for updates on what I'm doing out there on the track! How exactly the person sat in the office is supposed to know what I'm doing I have no idea - maybe just soothe and appease the punters by directing their wrath at them instead of me while broken down!

 

[infobleep]

Depending on the model of train the guard may need to stay at the back to do the doors.

Well fair enough but that would be the case I assume even if the train wasn't busy.

However on the train I wa on, that wasn't the case.

It just came across as the guard reading a prepared statement because he must regardless of the actual situation. Now that may not actually have been the case at all but it was how it came across to me at the time. Impressions don't have to be accurate.

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[bairy]

For a while I intensely followed FGW and CC and LM twitters to see what people said to them. I noticed a few things about most (not all) of those making comments (as oppose to inquiries)

1. People give a lot of abuse when angry. Right up to the c word. Saw a couple of death threats too.
2. On the whole people don't say "I had a problem with LM today, which was xyz", they say "LM is s*** and you shouldd lose the franchise!", unhelpfully.
3. People don't apologise even when proven completely wrong about a "fact" they claimed.
4. What they say: "your trains are always late". What they mean: "you were late twice in the last 10 days"
5. Everyone has an opinion, so few have knowledge.

There are also people who seem to dedicate large parts of their lives to "{TOC} is pure crap" with some users having thousands of tweets as a result of ranting day in day out. Even when presented with hard facts proving them wrong they simply dismiss the claimant and carry on ranting.

In short yes there are valid complaints but in my experience on the whole, ~70-80% of people lie, exaggerate and angry-rant stuff that sometimes doesn't even make logical sense.

 

[island]

It happens in all walks of life, it's called progress whether we like it or not. Complaints against staff at many establishments can be made in this way. I assume management would listen to both sides of the story before deciding what action (if any) to take so I really don't think it's anything to worry unduly about.

I'm not sure that's a valid assumption, judging from several of the posts we get here.