Tunnel cleaning train still in use?

[Ladder23]

Hi all,

I just watched a old video regarding this, and wondered is it still a thing today?

 

[bluegoblin7]

Not for the best part of 20 years now, it was scrapped around a decade ago.

Plans for a replacement were also cancelled around the same time period.

 

[vuzzeho]

I watched the same video and was about to start a thread on the exact same thing! Funny. Sad to hear it was scrapped, I was going to ask if the replacement was in service but that's been answered. Are there any plans for a new one? With the Piccadilly trains coming out of service soon, maybe it could be worth converting some to make a new one, especially as I seem to constantly see on my Instagram complaints about how dirty the tunnels are.

 

[bluegoblin7]

There are no plans for a replacement.

 

[GFE]

Will be interesting what the LUL response/strategy will be to the increasing media comments about air quality on the underground.
Perhaps some form of easily replaced filters in trains or stations?

 

[Meerkat]

There are no plans for a replacement.

How come it is no longer needed?

 

[trainmania100]

How come it is no longer needed?

Does make you wonder. Must be lots of brake dust accumulation along tracks and walls. Few more years and they'll be mining the tunnels for iron

 

[Trackman]

Does make you wonder. Must be lots of brake dust accumulation along tracks and walls. Few more years and they'll be mining the tunnels for iron

They still have 'Fluffers' - more modern these days with vacuum cleaners and the sorts and not an all female affair now - obviously.

 

[Thames99]

On the Angel thread PG gave this link

Available online at:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0074tkn

to a documentary film of the old station pre 1993. Part of that showed fluffers at work. It seems a lot more than 30 years ago when you see the footage.

Do tube train ventilation systems have filters which would take out some of the dust in the tunnels?

 

[Camberman]

Just watched an old video apparently from LUL on YouTube about the need for tunnel cleaning.

At 25 seconds it states dirt "..builds up at a rate of an eighth of an inch each year..."

At 1 minute it says dirt "becomes hazardous in concentration..."

The video is at

 

[Ladder23]

Not for the best part of 20 years now, it was scrapped around a decade ago.

Plans for a replacement were also cancelled around the same time period.

Thanks for the update!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 1 Jan 2025 ==

Does make you wonder. Must be lots of brake dust accumulation along tracks and walls. Few more years and they'll be mining the tunnels for iron

Yep! Heck of a build up I'd say

 

[trebor79]

The air on the Piccadilly, Victoria and Central lines is absolutely filthy. You can see the haze when you look from one end of the platform to the other, and you can smell it and see the evidence when you blow your nose.
The Jubilee is much cleaner for some reason. No haze and no black snot. It's also a lot cooler so perhaps it's better ventilated.

 

[Recessio]

The air on the Piccadilly, Victoria and Central lines is absolutely filthy. You can see the haze when you look from one end of the platform to the other, and you can smell it and see the evidence when you blow your nose.
The Jubilee is much cleaner for some reason. No haze and no black snot. It's also a lot cooler so perhaps it's better ventilated.

The Jubilee Line Extension opened in 1999 so that half of the line will have newer ventilation systems, I wonder if that makes a difference compared to the older lines.

 

[vuzzeho]

The air on the Piccadilly, Victoria and Central lines is absolutely filthy. You can see the haze when you look from one end of the platform to the other, and you can smell it and see the evidence when you blow your nose.
The Jubilee is much cleaner for some reason. No haze and no black snot. It's also a lot cooler so perhaps it's better ventilated.

Don't forget the Northern!

 

[Camberman]

I see from the TfL website that a Freedom Of Information (FOI) request was made, titled "Tunnel Cleaning Train project" in March 2017. See https://tfl.gov.uk/corporate/transp.../foi-request-detail?referenceId=FOI-2395-1617

Part of the response stated "We are now continuing to work with industry and academics to look at best practice from around the world and develop other ways to modernise tunnel cleaning, including trialling filters fitted to trains that catch dust before it settles. Cleaning tunnels by hand removes up to 150 kilograms of dust per kilometre. While we explore other options to modernise tunnel cleaning, we will continue to use the tried and tested manual methods"

Surely there are public health issues relating to lung inflammation and potential diseases arising from the dust accumulated?

 

[trebor79]

Surely there are public health issues relating to lung inflammation and potential diseases arising from the dust accumulated?

There will be all sorts in that dust, it can't be good for you. I try and stick to the subsurface lines and Jubilee.

 

[Oldgaloot]

Can I make a daft laddie contribution? Could the Jubilee be a less polluted line because the wholly underground stations have platform edge doors?

 

[edwin_m]

Can I make a daft laddie contribution? Could the Jubilee be a less polluted line because the wholly underground stations have platform edge doors?

As the most modern Underground line it will have better ventilation than the older ones, which might help to blow the dust out. Also most of its underground section has never operated the older trains which made a lot of use of friction braking, so brake dust won't have been able to build up. The Bakerloo and Piccadilly still operate that type of train but the Northern and Victoria don't.

 

[Recessio]

Can I make a daft laddie contribution? Could the Jubilee be a less polluted line because the wholly underground stations have platform edge doors?

I don't think those doors reach the ceiling? So dust etc could still come over the top (though maybe the deflection of most of the tunnel wind makes a difference). The Elizabeth line platform edge doors do reach the ceiling though, so I think that could make a difference at keeping dust contained to the tunnels, as the doors are obviously only open when the train is stationary and there's no tunnel wind. Although you can definitely notice areas where the white concrete wall texture is starting to get dirtier in places!

 

[Meerkat]

The air on the Piccadilly, Victoria and Central lines is absolutely filthy. You can see the haze when you look from one end of the platform to the other, and you can smell it and see the evidence when you blow your nose.
The Jubilee is much cleaner for some reason. No haze and no black snot. It's also a lot cooler so perhaps it's better ventilated.

Isn't it cooler (on the newer bit) because its new? Originally the underground was advertised as being cooler than the streets above but over the decades the ground around the tunnels has been warmed up by the underground.