Trivia: Special work site bus routes?

[RUK]

Works buses directly operated by the employers must be very rare today?

Similar but not exactly the same - the private school Norwich School have their own liveried, owned and operated double-decker buses, and coaches, for e.g. taking their pupils and P.E. teachers to the UEA Sportspark for their P.E. lessons.

Imperial College London also run an un-numbered shuttle bus on week-days with a time-table between their campuses, which is free, but is only for the use of students and staff, and isn’t for travelling to/from home to the workplace.

 

[M60lad]

Regarding the Alton Towers services if I remember rightly when the services were operated in house I seem to remember they operated to more destinations then they do now and also the services were actually open to the public as I remember using one myself many years ago.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I largely agree with you. It's down to who is paying for the service. Is the original business being given the choice and offered the chance to make the route open? Increasingly operators are just throwing a price on a contract and running as per the original script and don't even try to say 'have you considered doing things this way'. An interesting connection that I have picked up on too is that where Amazon seem to deal direct with the bus operators, that routes are open to the public, but as soon as it goes through a 'travel solutions' company/broker, then it becomes closed door. This strongly suggests to me that Amazon don't mind the services being open, and that it's just because of the middlemen why the services become closed door. How many businesses, if they were given the choice and the pros/cons (to make an informed decision. Ie the route can claim BSOG, but you will lose some of the flexibility), would instead choose open door? I know Zeelo and First Travel Solutions etc just point blank won't offer these options to businesses.


Of course without specifics (which I appreciate you are unlikely to share), it would be hard for my to confirm your thoughts. There can often be strange flows that pop up though on these sorts of routes. Speaking to other commercial management/staff, they have been surprised that similar workers routes have ended up with some very dedicated, regular passengers who aren't/weren't using the services for the purpose of travelling to the main workplace for which the service was intended. The upset with Ensign & Hornsby too when their routes went closed door, similarly says that there was demand for trips despite them being strange routes.
It's easy to just say 'the service would be useless', doesn't mean it's always right though.

Ok... here's some alternative bits and pieces drawn from experience.

You are right that most businesses don't know of the intricacies of BSOG. What that means is that their procurement and ops team will create a tender specification that simply asks for a dedicated service. The fact that there may be a cost benefit is minimal against the site costs. That Zeelo or FTS don't want to be in the business of running regular bus services makes some sort of sense and clearly, that they are able to win those contracts suggests that they aren't being disadvantaged on cost.

Yes, you are right that there are some services that would appeal. For instance, the service from Newport to Severn Beach might attract some but the Swindon to Stonegate Egg factory is pretty niche, and would fall into the "useless" category. Those that do have an attractiveness to other passengers then do run the risk of losing capacity if they prove popular, as @Dwarfer1979 mentioned.

However, here's perhaps another consideration that we haven't really discussed. Why do companies go out and lay on a service? In short, the provision of a bus service is a "perk" that is used to attract people to work in your warehouse or factory, making it easier for them to get to work. It's a more cost effective way too than indulging in a wages war with other employers. Why on earth would I then want to offer that same perk to someone working at the warehouse next door? You're removing one of your own differentiators.

 

[318266]

Historically, First Glasgow ran routes 709 and 765, from Drumchapel and Easterhouse to Hillington Industrial Estate. Curiously, these only ever ran in the mornings. If I recall, they were operated without subsidy from the industrial estate for all workers in the industrial estate - therefore, no one business could claim it as an "exclusive perk".

 

[edwin_m]

However, here's perhaps another consideration that we haven't really discussed. Why do companies go out and lay on a service? In short, the provision of a bus service is a "perk" that is used to attract people to work in your warehouse or factory, making it easier for them to get to work. It's a more cost effective way too than indulging in a wages war with other employers. Why on earth would I then want to offer that same perk to someone working at the warehouse next door? You're removing one of your own differentiators.

If the bus allows some employees to get by without owning a car then they save themselves rather more than £1000 per year even for the oldest and most basic vehicle that a low-wage worker might be forced to choose. So instead of running the bus the employer would have to pay that amount, plus taxes and other costs, extra to those workers and probably to all the others as well. They might also face extra costs providing parking, although that's probably not significant for the sorts of places most of these buses operate where land is plentiful and relatively cheap.

One exception is the services I mentioned to Hinkley Point C. The construction workers are likely to be relatively well paid and indeed some of the buses run from park and ride sites where people will need a car to use them. I imagine the buses were a planning condition, and even if they weren't it would be very difficult for the workforce to get to site in their own cars down some quite minor roads, or to park once they arrived.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

If the bus allows some employees to get by without owning a car then they save themselves rather more than £1000 per year even for the oldest and most basic vehicle that a low-wage worker might be forced to choose. So instead of running the bus the employer would have to pay that amount, plus taxes and other costs, extra to those workers and probably to all the others as well. They might also face extra costs providing parking, although that's probably not significant for the sorts of places most of these buses operate where land is plentiful and relatively cheap.

One exception is the services I mentioned to Hinkley Point C. The construction workers are likely to be relatively well paid and indeed some of the buses run from park and ride sites where people will need a car to use them. I imagine the buses were a planning condition, and even if they weren't it would be very difficult for the workforce to get to site in their own cars down some quite minor roads, or to park once they arrived.

Your first point is exactly that. You can offer something that is of greater value to an employee, and lower cost to the employer.

Employer pays £350k for a bus to provide something that is equivalent to £1000 per employee. It may only benefits 40 staff (which is 10% of your workforce). However, if you paid the £1000 to the staff, it would really be £1600 with on-cost, and you'd have have to pay it to all 400 staff = £640k. So your point is bang on. As I say, it is a way of making a job more attractive and ensuring recruitment. It would be a bit short-sighted to then open it up if you had another firm next door who was fishing in the same employment pond as you.

I believe the HPC network is just that. There are direct coaches from elsewhere, and shuttles to/from P&Rs, to avoid having large car parks on site, flooding the local roads, and delaying both inbound deliveries as well as the local residents.

 

[markymark2000]

However, here's perhaps another consideration that we haven't really discussed. Why do companies go out and lay on a service? In short, the provision of a bus service is a "perk" that is used to attract people to work in your warehouse or factory, making it easier for them to get to work. It's a more cost effective way too than indulging in a wages war with other employers. Why on earth would I then want to offer that same perk to someone working at the warehouse next door? You're removing one of your own differentiators.

There are arguments to say though that by opting for dedicated buses, people will not tend to know the bus routes exist until they are in the workplace because, understandably, closed door buses aren't very well advertised. If they opt for more open buses, people can use journey planners to plan their journeys to work.
Take your example of the Stonegate Farm bus would probably be completely useless for the public, however when people without private transport in Swindon are applying for jobs though, they are unlikely to consider Stonegate Farm simply because there are no public transport options showing anywhere (bar an advert from 3 years ago about a little minibus). Why is someone without a car going to apply for a job when there is no half decent information on transport to get to that job?
If you compare that to Amazon Tilbury or Amazon Dunstable, where you search online and find out there are full bus networks to the sites, people know they can get to work and can find out the costs etc. Far better for recruitment if people know they can use the bus to get to that workplace rather than having to apply and get the job before you can find out that there is a bus.

 

[MotCO]

Your first point is exactly that. You can offer something that is of greater value to an employee, and lower cost to the employer.

Employer pays £350k for a bus to provide something that is equivalent to £1000 per employee. It may only benefits 40 staff (which is 10% of your workforce). However, if you paid the £1000 to the staff, it would really be £1600 with on-cost, and you'd have have to pay it to all 400 staff = £640k. So your point is bang on. As I say, it is a way of making a job more attractive and ensuring recruitment. It would be a bit short-sighted to then open it up if you had another firm next door who was fishing in the same employment pond as you.

I believe the HPC network is just that. There are direct coaches from elsewhere, and shuttles to/from P&Rs, to avoid having large car parks on site, flooding the local roads, and delaying both inbound deliveries as well as the local residents.

Is there a benefit-in-kind tax implication for the employee? Providing free travel to work is surely counted as a perk.

 

[RUK]

The staff travel’s not always free - there’s mention on-line of the Bernard Matthews routes charging their passengers, with unions being unhappy when ticket prices increase.

 

[mangad]

There are arguments to say though that by opting for dedicated buses, people will not tend to know the bus routes exist until they are in the workplace because, understandably, closed door buses aren't very well advertised. If they opt for more open buses, people can use journey planners to plan their journeys to work.
Take your example of the Stonegate Farm bus would probably be completely useless for the public, however when people without private transport in Swindon are applying for jobs though, they are unlikely to consider Stonegate Farm simply because there are no public transport options showing anywhere (bar an advert from 3 years ago about a little minibus). Why is someone without a car going to apply for a job when there is no half decent information on transport to get to that job?

A sensible employer would mention such things in their job adverts, and if recruiting via the Job Centre, would let them know too.

Out of interest I checked some of the jobs at Stonegate Farmers website, and found this on one advert: "As part of our team, you'll enjoy a competitive salary, workplace pension scheme, and additional benefits such as a cycle-to-work scheme, on-site parking, free eggs, and subsidised transport from select locations." But equally another job advert on their site didn't mention it at all.

 

[markymark2000]

Out of interest I checked some of the jobs at Stonegate Farmers website, and found this on one advert: "As part of our team, you'll enjoy a competitive salary, workplace pension scheme, and additional benefits such as a cycle-to-work scheme, on-site parking, free eggs, and subsidised transport from select locations." But equally another job advert on their site didn't mention it at all.

Which means any employee is going to have to spend more time emailing in to find out the information, and then hope that it fits the shift patterns for that shift (some places only have buses for some shift patterns). And we all know how good employers are at replying to applicants....

In theory it works, in reality it doesn't.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

There are arguments to say though that by opting for dedicated buses, people will not tend to know the bus routes exist until they are in the workplace because, understandably, closed door buses aren't very well advertised. If they opt for more open buses, people can use journey planners to plan their journeys to work.
Take your example of the Stonegate Farm bus would probably be completely useless for the public, however when people without private transport in Swindon are applying for jobs though, they are unlikely to consider Stonegate Farm simply because there are no public transport options showing anywhere (bar an advert from 3 years ago about a little minibus). Why is someone without a car going to apply for a job when there is no half decent information on transport to get to that job?
If you compare that to Amazon Tilbury or Amazon Dunstable, where you search online and find out there are full bus networks to the sites, people know they can get to work and can find out the costs etc. Far better for recruitment if people know they can use the bus to get to that workplace rather than having to apply and get the job before you can find out that there is a bus.

Different firms will have different policies, and it reflects their individual circumstances. Amazon need such a large group of people that they may feel that open door and publicity works for them.

Stonegate - different priorities and that influences their decision, and that's directly contracted with Stagecoach. Certainly, some of their ads do reference transport (as does the main website) but they don't make a huge thing about it. Perhaps that's a conscious thing? Maybe word of mouth is a factor there - I don't know. They are a well regarded employer

Some of the places simply won't wish to advertise except in job ads (and open up to everyone) because of the competitive advantage as I outlined. And others won't want to lose the flexibility that them not being registered gives them. I'd imagine that JLR are quite happy that they can turn off their services at the moment!

One that I was involved with fell into the category of... Highly volatile staff requirements as volumes could alter quickly (and disappear too), limited other potential customers (i.e. the useless category), and the client didn't want the complexity of sharing their transport with anyone else = closed door.

 

[Simon75]

Do in house buses have to be registered with the traffic commissioner as a service and operation centre?

 

[Stan Drews]

Historically, First Glasgow ran routes 709 and 765, from Drumchapel and Easterhouse to Hillington Industrial Estate. Curiously, these only ever ran in the mornings. If I recall, they were operated without subsidy from the industrial estate for all workers in the industrial estate - therefore, no one business could claim it as an "exclusive perk".

The 700 series of routes to the big Industrial Estates, like Hillington, did originally have both AM and PM journeys - often several in their heyday.

 

[WibbleWobble]

Do in house buses have to be registered with the traffic commissioner as a service and operation centre?

It is down to how fares are taken (if any). If passengers pay on boarding, then the service does need to be registered. If the contracting party (such as Amazon) take payments off-bus, like via salary deductions, or if they are doing it as a complimentary staff provision, then no.

The company would probably still need an operating license and registered base.