Trivia : Historical National Express operators and depots

[Simon75]

Which National Bus Company (NBC) companies did National Express work during the NBC years, and what depots were used ?

 

[Cesarcollie]

Which National Bus Company (NBC) companies did National Express work during the NBC years, and what depots were used ?

Most of them, if not all!

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Which National Bus Company (NBC) companies did National Express work during the NBC years, and what depots were used ?

It's an almost impossible question. At which point in the NBC years are you talking about?

For instance... in the early 1970s, lots of firms that operated expresses that then lost some/all of them as National consolidated operations to form specialist units e.g. in London where you had Timpsons, Tillings, Samuelsons plus part of Eastern National and East Kent etc that were then to form National Travel South East, which later became National Travel London.... Same went for NT (East), NT (South West) and NT (West) - a mix mash of different firms.

Even with an operator that was relatively stable.... United Automobile Services. During the 1970s, most depots had an ageing white National RELH (usually woefully underemployed or chucked out on something local) that would do Nat Ex work during the weekend or in summer. It was something that my late father did at his depot. When it was really busy, they would also use DP vehicles to provide duplicates. By 1980, things had been rationalised so that United had defined coaching units based at Gallowgate, Jesmond, Ashington, Sunderland, Sedgefield, and Scarborough but dupes were still provided from elsewhere - Darlington and Alnwick were regularly raided as they had plenty of DPs. By 1985, Sedgefield had gone but Middlesbrough then took on NX work.

Of course, by the 1980s, there was the break up of the larger NBC firms in readiness for privatisation e.g. the recreation of Shamrock & Rambler and the creation of Pilgrim Coaches, whilst operations like National Travel West were reintegrated into Ribble and Crosville.

So as I said, it's a question that almost has infinite answers.

 

[GusB]

Which National Bus Company (NBC) companies did National Express work during the NBC years, and what depots were used ?

The thread title suggests that you're just looking for a list of historic National Express operators. I'd just leave it at that, rather than insisting on a list of NBC subsidiaries.

Consider that companies NBC were gradually sold off and that there was a period when some were still public ownership and some private, so "NBC years" is a bit woolly! There's also the issue that the National Express brand has been in use for much longer in privatisation than it was under the NBC.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

The thread title suggests that you're just looking for a list of historic National Express operators. I'd just leave it at that, rather than insisting on a list of NBC subsidiaries.

Consider that companies NBC were gradually sold off and that there was a period when some were still public ownership and some private, so "NBC years" is a bit woolly! There's also the issue that the National Express brand has been in use for much longer in privatisation than it was under the NBC.

As I said above, you also had a period of consolidation as firms like Hebble, SUT, Tillings, Timpsons, Samuelsons, Greenslades, Black & White, Standerwick etc were integrated into National Travel regional units, and then the splitting back out to create firms like Pilgrim (or Midland Red x 5).

Not only that, what constitutes an operator? Do they do service car work? Or do they just do extras/dupes?

As for working out which depots... It's a huge, huge number.

 

[GusB]

As I said above, you also had a period of consolidation as firms like Hebble, SUT, Tillings, Timpsons, Samuelsons, Greenslades, Black & White, Standerwick etc were integrated into National Travel regional units, and then the splitting back out to create firms like Pilgrim (or Midland Red x 5).

Not only that, what constitutes an operator? Do they do service car work? Or do they just do extras/dupes?

As for working out which depots... It's a huge, huge number.

Well, quite.

Most of my National Express journeys have been wholly within Scotland. I can count on two fingers the number of my journeys that have crossed the border; the first was a southbound Aberdeen to London which was operated by Amberline. The return journey was on a coach that I think was actually owned by National Express - it was one of the original NXI900x-registered batch of Expressliners.

There was Tayside Travel Services, which was the company that was set up to acquire the routes and assets of the express operation of Stagecoach - based at Walnut Grove, Perth. The coaches were branded as "Stagecoach Caledonian Express" under a licencing agreement for a time. Details are hazy, but I recall that it was merged with another company and re-named Express Travel Ltd. Grampian Transport had vehicles in CalEx livery, too. I didn't ever travel National Express from Inverness, but Rapson's certainly had National Express-liveried vehicles. Bluebird Buses also had a few Expressliner IIs.

For a time, Bebb used to operate the first express service out of Aberdeen. If I was up early enough I'd always try to make the 07xx (can't remember the exact time) run south as the allocated coach was usually one of their Setras; I can recall one particularly exhilirating journey down the coast road from Aberdeen.

I'm not sure which firm operated it but I also recall seeing a fairly dilapidated Caetano Alpha-bodied coach (possibly a Volvo B58) with Caledonian Express branding at Arbroath bus station.

 

[Mr Manager]

I do not recall Provincial doing Nat Ex work only when the rail strike was on iirc a National 2 was used on dupes.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I do not recall Provincial doing Nat Ex work only when the rail strike was on iirc a National 2 was used on dupes.

They had a couple of Leyland Tigers A100/101JJT from new but they were soon transferred to Shamrock and Rambler.

The return journey was on a coach that I think was actually owned by National Express - it was one of the original NXI900x-registered batch of Expressliners.

They had a single coach that was owned by them (in order to have an O license) but was operated by Rapsons.



On a tangent, TrentBarton are viewed as the last independent ex NBC firm (ish) but I was in Great Yarmouth a couple of weeks ago and saw Ambassador Travel still going strong though I can't recall if it's still exactly the same actual business. It was formed out of Eastern Counties coach ops in Norfolk in 1984.

 

[Steve440]

I can only speak from my local knowledge, West Yorkshire, who I worked for in the 70s and 80s ran National Express routes from all main depots, Harrogate, Leeds, Bradford, Keighley and York but not from any of the sub depots.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I can only speak from my local knowledge, West Yorkshire, who I worked for in the 70s and 80s ran National Express routes from all main depots, Harrogate, Leeds, Bradford, Keighley and York but not from any of the sub depots.

I guess that would be service car (regular) workings but that somewhere like Malton (that had a few RELHs and Leopards) might do the odd dupe?

In the late 1970s and through into the 1980s, United Auto would allocate an RELH (and later a Leopard) to Ripon depot in case of a NatEx breakdown on the A1 between Wetherby and Catterick. It did mean that you had perhaps the best vehicle in the depot pootling around doing local stuff in the main...just in case.

 

[Steve440]

I guess that would be service car (regular) workings but that somewhere like Malton (that had a few RELHs and Leopards) might do the odd dupe?

In the late 1970s and through into the 1980s, United Auto would allocate an RELH (and later a Leopard) to Ripon depot in case of a NatEx breakdown on the A1 between Wetherby and Catterick. It did mean that you had perhaps the best vehicle in the depot pootling around doing local stuff in the main...just in case.

Yes it would only be service car workings, I can't comment on dupes.

 

[Pyewipecarshed]

East Yorkshire kept one National Express coach at Bridlington in NBC days. The rest worked out of Anlaby Road garage in Hull.
However all garages had at least one dual-purpose vehicle which could be pressed into service as a NatEx duplicate if required

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 7 Aug 2025 ==

As others have said the answer becomes more interesting after privatisation. My 1991 "National Express Handbook" lists many operators who no longer run on NatEx services or who have ceased trading altogether.
Just a few examples are AJC Coaches (Leeds), Charterplan (GM Buses' coach operation), Bleanch's (Hetton-le-Hole) and White Hart (Barnstaple), the latter listed as operating route 734 from Westward Ho! to Wrexham, and there are many, many more.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Yes it would only be service car workings, I can't comment on dupes.

Yeah, United was the same with regular NX workings concentrated into a few main depots by c.1980. I remember Darlington having three white REMHs which were then moved into these consolidated allocations elsewhere.

As for dupes, there were so many DPs that everyone participated. To illustrate, a Leeds to Newcastle working (photo John Carter on flickr) in Darlington - it was an Alnwick car IIRC.

East Yorkshire kept one National Express coach at Bridlington in NBC days. The rest worked out of Anlaby Road garage in Hull.
However all garages had at least one dual-purpose vehicle which could be pressed into service as a NatEx duplicate if required

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 7 Aug 2025 ==

As others have said the answer becomes more interesting after privatisation. My 1991 "National Express Handbook" lists many operators who no longer run on NatEx services or who have ceased trading altogether.
Just a few examples are AJC Coaches (Leeds), Charterplan (GM Buses' coach operation), Bleanch's (Hetton-le-Hole) and White Hart (Barnstaple), the latter listed as operating route 734 from Westward Ho! to Wrexham, and there are many, many more.

By the mid 1990s, you had a lot of ex NBC firms who decided the returns weren't worth the investment. Many just wanted shot of them.

I seem to recall ones that were still heavily involved were East Kent, South Wales, Western National, North Devon, Yorkshire Traction, East Yorkshire, Northern, Cumberland, Northumbria.

 

[Martin1988]

Not sure if this is the right place to post this or not. I am aware that during the 90s Wessex were the main provider of NX services out of Bristol but by the early 00s Turners Coachways also seemed to be involved in providing services

I have had it suggested to me before that Turners were a dupe operator during the 90s but does anyone have any recollection of when they went from being a dupe operator to having scheduled services? Its been suggested to me before that Turners might have contributed to a Sunday only service that ran between Bristol and Birmingham and was numbered 332 but the 1996 and 1998 NX handbooks have stated that as being provided by Wessex. Someone recently suggested to me that in the mid 90s, Wessex were the operator but have also spoken to a driver who has claimed to drive it for both Wessex and Turners.