TRIVIA: Buses that stop to pick up or set down only

[AY1975]

Does anyone know of any bus services that make pick-up only or set-down only stops anywhere?

I guess this is quite common with long distance coach services, but what about buses (though it can sometimes be difficult to draw the line as to when you class it as a bus and when you class it as a coach)?

 

[ANDREW_D_WEBB]

Lots of one day a week rural services with one round trip will be set down only for many stops on the return trip. Saves going round lots of little villages for no reason.

 

[carlberry]

I assume you mean 'other than at the terminus'!

It used to be quite common before deregulation where 'company' buses could only drop passengers once the service had passed into a 'corporation' area and could only pick them up until they passed the boundary going the other way. Bristol Omnibus even had the same between city and country services that they operated. Whilst it's annoying for passengers to see a bus go past that they could (in theory) catch it means that longer distance services didn't have to hang around as much in the cities.

 

[Kent Dreamer]

Talking of boundaries, something similar still happens in Thanet. The 9X which runs in morning peak only, operates all stops from Broadstairs through Ramsgate to Sarre, which is part of the Thanet District Council boundary, then once past that, it operates set down only to Canterbury. I have been told that this is because Thanet District Council funds the 9X, whereas the regular 9, is funded by Kent County Council and so therefore serves all stops along the route.

 

[adrock1976]

I can remember back to the late 1980s/early 1990s when I was residing in my native West Midlands that West Midlands Travel (the former corporation buses) operated the 962 Timesaver between Birmingham and Chelmsley Wood.

This ran via Aston Expressway, Tyburn Road, Kingsbury Road, and the A452 Collector Road (that runs parallel to the M6 at Junction 5). The first set down stop towards Chelmsley Wood was somewhere along Tyburn Road (may have been before the junction at Kingsbury Road - not sure exactly), with the last pick up stop to Birmingham at the same location on the opposite side of the road. For local journeys between Birmingham and Tyburn Road/Kingsbury Road, the 67 covered that section albeit via Aston Cross.

 

[AJW12]

In Leeds, there is the X84/5 and the X98/99 - which are both made 'limited-stop' in order to essentially keep away passengers that are just making short journeys within the City boundary. So most stops in Leeds on outbound journeys are pick-up only, and inbound are set-down only.

There's also the 36 from Leeds to Harrogate. I'm not too sure on how it works but I saw something on their Twitter a few months ago that clarified to a customer that it was Limited Stop in Leeds and then in addition to that, doesn't set-down until just before the outer ring road. (edit: here's the source https://twitter.com/harrogatebus/status/932948460432740352)

Think the two main advantages of this are firstly keeping the service fast (old people slowing the bus right down to get a free ride four stops down the road massively add to the journey time) and making sure the right people can get a seat on the bus - i.e. meaning the bus won't leave passengers for far out behind, when seats are being taken by people going somewhere close served by many other services.

 

[Ayman Ilham]

The TrawsCymru T4 does this in Cardiff on all stops south of the M4, where the northbound service is pick-up only and the southbound service is set-down only since the full route stretches all the way to Newtown in Mid-Wales, which is a good 4 hours end to end! The route is mainly for interurban travellers between Powys, the Valleys and Cardiff so yeah!

 

[Mitch in Notts]

Nottingham City Transports rural 46, 47, 100 all have peak time restrictions whereby evening peak journeys do not set down outbound until they become the sole service. They will of course pick up at all stops. This basically harks back to pre deregulation days when rural services had pick up/set down restrictions to protect urban operators. Ironic that it is an urban operator that has this restriction now - I'm not aware of any of the routes out of the city provided by trent barton etc. having any such restrictions.

 

[carlberry]

The TrawsCymru T4 does this in Cardiff on all stops south of the M4, where the northbound service is pick-up only and the southbound service is set-down only since the full route stretches all the way to Newtown in Mid-Wales, which is a good 4 hours end to end! The route is mainly for interurban travellers between Powys, the Valleys and Cardiff so yeah!

Given the free travel at weekends offer you can only imagine how rammed it would be otherwise!

 

[CatfordCat]

Nottingham City Transports rural 46, 47, 100 all have peak time restrictions whereby evening peak journeys do not set down outbound until the become the sole service. They will of course pick up at all stops. This basically harks back to pre deregulation days when rural services had pick up/set down restrictions to protect urban operators. Ironic that it is an urban operator that has this restriction now - I'm not aware of any of the routes out of the city provided by trent barton etc. having any such restrictions.

When I lived in Nottingham (early 90s) the Trent routes on the Nottingham - Bulwell - Hucknall corridor didn't set down (northbound) before Bulwell market place and vice versa. Think this was as much a commercial decision on Trent's part so as to keep running times quick and not to fill buses with local passengers.

At that time, Trent had Volvo B10 citybuses, and NCT's Bulwell routes were run with Atlanteans that were getting a bit tired, so it was usually quicker to catch a Trent bus to Bulwell Market and walk back a couple of stops to where I lived...

In answer to the original question, I can think of a few routes that will 'continue to this point to set down if required' beyond a certain point on the last journey/s of the day.

And Reading Buses' Green Line 702 is set down only between Hammersmith and Victoria (timetable doesn't say clearly if it's pick up only on the westbound journeys)

 

[neilmc]

In Leeds, there is the X84/5 and the X98/99 - which are both made 'limited-stop' in order to essentially keep away passengers that are just making short journeys within the City boundary. So most stops in Leeds on outbound journeys are pick-up only, and inbound are set-down only.

There's also the 36 from Leeds to Harrogate. I'm not too sure on how it works but I saw something on their Twitter a few months ago that clarified to a customer that it was Limited Stop in Leeds and then in addition to that, doesn't set-down until just before the outer ring road. (edit: here's the source https://twitter.com/harrogatebus/status/932948460432740352)

Think the two main advantages of this are firstly keeping the service fast (old people slowing the bus right down to get a free ride four stops down the road massively add to the journey time) and making sure the right people can get a seat on the bus - i.e. meaning the bus won't leave passengers for far out behind, when seats are being taken by people going somewhere close served by many other services.

Hi, I've looked at the Metro timetables and I'm not sure this is correct. I can't find ANY restriction on the X84/85/98/99 but the 36 declares that the following restriction:

"Between Chapel Allerton & Moortown Corner this service will stop only at Queens Arms & Kingsway Court."

Doesn't mention any set-down/pick-up restriction, nor whether it stops PRIOR to Chapel Allerton (I think it does but the timetable assumes for boarding-only)

In practice local knowledge may agree with what AJW12 declares to be the case.

Leeds used to be rife with limited-stop restrictions, not only on "Company" buses going out beyond the city but also Leeds City Transport services to estates beyond the former tram termini being limited-stop (limited set-down conditions) at peak-times on outwards journeys, although some such as 39 Whitkirk and 41 Colton were limited stop all day. These conditions didn't normally apply on any inwards journeys, since the passengers from the outer suburbs were already on the bus! Most of the company services, and a few LCT ones such as the 72 Bradford and later 508 Halifax had minimum fares to discourage short-riders within the city area even when they weren't limited stop, however with the advent of prepaid MetroCards there grew a number of passengers (like me) who would look out for a West Yorkshire bus to facilitate a speedy journey into town from places such as Harehills, Headingley, Kirkstall and York Road; sometimes they wouldn't stop to pick up but if it was a busy stop with alighting passengers they couldn't bar me from boarding as TECHNICALLY they weren't limited stop.

Basically it was a mess, most of the LCT restrictions disappeared as more and more services were recast as cross-city routes, but it looks like things are still confusing.

 

[neilmc]

The weekly rural service which is now my only local public transport doesn't really have limited-stop conditions, except that it does not serve Eamont Bridge or the suburbs of Penrith since these are on a route served commercially by Stagecoach and the villages service is heavily subsidised and employs volunteer drivers.

As has already been stated the bus may miss out any villages for which there are no passengers on the return journey from Penrith as it is primarily a shopping service but should you wish to do an inter-village journey you can ring up and book it to call. However, I have never yet seen anybody alight before Penrith or board at any intermediate village on the return!

 

[Statto]

London X68, West Croydon-Russell Square & operates to Russell Square morning peak to West Croydon afternoon peak.

 

[Mag_seven]

I assume you mean 'other than at the terminus'!

It used to be quite common before deregulation where 'company' buses could only drop passengers once the service had passed into a 'corporation' area and could only pick them up until they passed the boundary going the other way. Bristol Omnibus even had the same between city and country services that they operated. Whilst it's annoying for passengers to see a bus go past that they could (in theory) catch it means that longer distance services didn't have to hang around as much in the cities.

I remember that sort of thing in Glasgow in the 70's when only Glasgow Corporation buses could be used for journeys entirely within the city boundary. Other companies buses (e.g. Western SMT) could only be used for journeys that crossed the city boundary.

 

[Statto]

Before D-Reg NBC owned companies had stopping restrictions imposed on them by Municipal & Corporation companies, in the those areas services were pick up or set down only like, Crosville had a few stopping restrictions imposed on most of there services that went to Chester & Warrington, Crosville used to have stopping restrictions in Merseyside where the local Corporations had services, until the early 70s, after the Corporations merged & became the Merseyside PTE, Crosville then operated limited stop until the PTE did timetable changes on some services which Crosville then served all stops. Biggest changes was on the Wirral were Crosville was almost everywhere but heavily restricted where Wallasey & Birkenhead corporations operated, PTE changed Crosville restrictions to limited stop, was late 70s when Crosville services were merged with PTE services & given PTE numbers.

 

[PeterC]

SNIP

And Reading Buses' Green Line 702 is set down only between Hammersmith and Victoria (timetable doesn't say clearly if it's pick up only on the westbound journeys)

In London Transport days you could use Green Line between any two central London stops as long as you were prepared to pay a fare that was at least double the minimum tube fare. Something that I did once at the age of 15 just to "grab" a new model of coach. A tactic also used by London Transport on the RF operated route 250 between Romford and Epping.

I am trying to remember where it was but I have a clear memory of being on a bus in the last few years that only picked up on one section of route with an annoyed passenger who wanted to be let off (presumably with a pass of some sort) ringing the bell all the time.

 

[daodao]

The TrawsCymru T4 does this in Cardiff on all stops south of the M4, where the northbound service is pick-up only and the southbound service is set-down only since the full route stretches all the way to Newtown in Mid-Wales, which is a good 4 hours end to end! The route is mainly for interurban travellers between Powys, the Valleys and Cardiff so yeah!

Most of the express buses along Manor Way (A470 south of the M4) do not convey passengers to/from the city centre and are only limited stop within Cardiff.

 

[Deerfold]

North Yorkshire council's 78A https://www.northyorkstravel.info/timetable/78Aaug14.pdf has complicated restrictions that are not mentioned on that timetable, but are on stops and at the unofficial resource at http://getdown.org.uk/bus/bus/78a.shtml
This basically prohibits any journey which could be made on the commercial 66. The service used to be run by the same operator when it had no such restrictions.

Incidentally, I'm not sure why NYCC retained the 78A number as there is no 78 and I've never seen it display anything other than "78" on the bus.

 

[daodao]

There's also the 36 from Leeds to Harrogate. I'm not too sure on how it works but I saw something on their Twitter a few months ago that clarified to a customer that it was Limited Stop in Leeds and then in addition to that, doesn't set-down until just before the outer ring road. (edit: here's the source https://twitter.com/harrogatebus/status/932948460432740352)

The 36 (ex-WYRCC/UAS) never conveyed local passengers between Moortown Corner and Vicar Lane Bus Stn, to avoid abstracting traffic from the LCT Roundhay circulars (2/3). It seems that this restriction still applies.

 

[Deerfold]

The 36 (ex-WYRCC/UAS) never conveyed local passengers between Moortown Corner and Vicar Lane Bus Stn, to avoid abstracting traffic from the LCT Roundhay circulars (2/3). It seems that this restriction still applies.

If it does, they really ought to put it in the timetables.

http://www.harrogatebus.co.uk/cmsUploads/route/files/H36webOCT2017.pdf
https://www.wymetro.com/buses/timetables/36/pdf

The Metro version mentions limited stop (though not *that* limited), but no pickup restrictions.

 

[Mitch in Notts]

When I lived in Nottingham (early 90s) the Trent routes on the Nottingham - Bulwell - Hucknall corridor didn't set down (northbound) before Bulwell market place and vice versa. Think this was as much a commercial decision on Trent's part so as to keep running times quick and not to fill buses with local passengers.

My own route, now called the Rainbow1 had the protection point moved in 1986 from Babbington Colliery after Cinderhill to Western Boulevard in Aspley. It was subsequently extended to Bentinck Road and is now unrestricted. Originally the route only called at alternate stops within the city boundary and at some point after deregulation all stops between Canning Circus & Gregory Boulevard were removed except for Bentinck Road. We now have the reverse situation where ALL stops are used within the city boundary with many passengers waiting for the less frequent Rainbow1 than NCTs 77/8/9 as it goes direct to Victoria rather than round the City Loop, hence our buses are always full!

 

[AJW12]

Hi, I've looked at the Metro timetables and I'm not sure this is correct. I can't find ANY restriction on the X84/85/98/99 but the 36 declares that the following restriction:

"Between Chapel Allerton & Moortown Corner this service will stop only at Queens Arms & Kingsway Court."

Doesn't mention any set-down/pick-up restriction, nor whether it stops PRIOR to Chapel Allerton (I think it does but the timetable assumes for boarding-only)

In practice local knowledge may agree with what AJW12 declares to be the case.

Leeds used to be rife with limited-stop restrictions, not only on "Company" buses going out beyond the city but also Leeds City Transport services to estates beyond the former tram termini being limited-stop (limited set-down conditions) at peak-times on outwards journeys, although some such as 39 Whitkirk and 41 Colton were limited stop all day. These conditions didn't normally apply on any inwards journeys, since the passengers from the outer suburbs were already on the bus! Most of the company services, and a few LCT ones such as the 72 Bradford and later 508 Halifax had minimum fares to discourage short-riders within the city area even when they weren't limited stop, however with the advent of prepaid MetroCards there grew a number of passengers (like me) who would look out for a West Yorkshire bus to facilitate a speedy journey into town from places such as Harehills, Headingley, Kirkstall and York Road; sometimes they wouldn't stop to pick up but if it was a busy stop with alighting passengers they couldn't bar me from boarding as TECHNICALLY they weren't limited stop.

Basically it was a mess, most of the LCT restrictions disappeared as more and more services were recast as cross-city routes, but it looks like things are still confusing.

Hi, I'm taking the 36 one from the Tweet I attached from my previous post.

The X98/99 arrangements are on the First route map - https://www.firstgroup.com/uploads/maps/X98_X99_map.pdf see here.

 

[Darklord8899]

In Edinburgh (dont quote me on this, but I am fairly sure) that the council doesn't allow bus operators to run a pick up only/set down only arrangement, whilst a bus may be limited stop it will pick up and set down at the stops it observes, the only exception to this were a couple of 'set down only' stops on Princes Street, but I think they were only to stop out of town express services cluttering up the normal service stops.

 

[backontrack]

In Edinburgh (dont quote me on this, but I am fairly sure) that the council doesn't allow bus operators to run a pick up only/set down only arrangement, whilst a bus may be limited stop it will pick up and set down at the stops it observes, the only exception to this were a couple of 'set down only' stops on Princes Street, but I think they were only to stop out of town express services cluttering up the normal service stops.

Seems sensible IMO.

 

[Silver Cobra]

While you did say buses specifically rather than coaches, I will mention that the X5 Oxford-Cambridge service has several set-down only stops within Cambridge city centre. The stops after Northampton Street up to the terminus at Parkside are all set-down only (it's stated on the stop signs themselves that this is the case).

For buses, I'll cheat a little bit here and say that pretty much all bus services in Bedford that run westbound along St Paul's Square and Horne Lane have two set-down only stops: the stop in front of the county court and the stop opposite the Harpur Centre car park entrance. Seeing the next and final stop for most routes is at the bus station just round the corner, it makes sense.

 

[PermitToTravel]

In Edinburgh (dont quote me on this, but I am fairly sure) that the council doesn't allow bus operators to run a pick up only/set down only arrangement, whilst a bus may be limited stop it will pick up and set down at the stops it observes, the only exception to this were a couple of 'set down only' stops on Princes Street, but I think they were only to stop out of town express services cluttering up the normal service stops.

Is this a power the council definitely have, or a mutual arrangement with (or polite request made of) bus operators?

 

[sjb-2812]

I assume you mean 'other than at the terminus'!...

I know there are a few around these parts (Cheshire East) that are nominally set-down only from a few stops prior to the terminus (but the terminus is only 50-100 yards or so further up the road). I don't know how rigorously this is enforced.

 

[DelW]

Probably not what the OP had in mind, but when I used them frequently a few years ago, Gatwick Airport long-term car park shuttle buses used to make a circuit of the car parks setting down, then the same circuit a few minutes later picking up. Used to create alarm among occasional users who would be waving agitatedly as the bus passed the stop despite it having 'Setting Down Only' on the displays. I think the practice is quite common with airport shuttles, to avoid delays caused by clashes in the doorways when passengers have lots of luggage.

 

[PeterC]

Swanbrook 853 is set down only between Andoversford and Gloucester. There is no published restriction on setting down in the opposite direction but I assume that there is no local fare.


EDIT - corrected typo in route number

 

[Darklord8899]

Is this a power the council definitely have, or a mutual arrangement with (or polite request made of) bus operators?

Having not actually seen the council's policy and legislation documents I'm not not entirely sure if it is actually a definitive policy or a more infered "if you don't follow this then the council will look less favourably on that company" type deal.
This comes from my own observations, talking to drivers and other people involved within bus companys.