Triple Headed Services

[E_Reeves]

Hi,

Just wondering, how common are triple headed freight services?
I've only seen one made up of a 90 + 2 86s.

I guess they are not that common, but I'd love to know.

Thanks!

 

[Domh245]

In a lot of cases like that, at least one or more of the locos would be Dead-in-Tow, so effectively a very heavy wagon. I would guess that triple heading would have to be defined as all 3 locomotives pulling the train.

 

[Harbornite]

Hi,

Just wondering, how common are triple headed freight services?
I've only seen one made up of a 90 + 2 86s.

I guess they are not that common, but I'd love to know.

Thanks!

They are uncommon and probably only occur in the event of a failure or to kove a loco to depot and thus saving a path.

The only triple header I recall seeing recently was at Tamwort and also consisted of two 86s and a 90.

 

[E_Reeves]

They are uncommon and probably only occur in the event of a failure or to kove a loco to depot and thus saving a path.

The only triple header I recall seeing recently was at Tamwort and also consisted of two 86s and a 90.

That could've been the one I saw; I saw it at Nuneaton

 

[Kentish Paul]

Long gone now but in the past the South Wales iron ore trains were hauled by 3 class 37s. (all working).

 

[DarloRich]

Hi,

Just wondering, how common are triple headed freight services?
I've only seen one made up of a 90 + 2 86s.

I guess they are not that common, but I'd love to know.

Thanks!

depends if they are all under power or being shifted around the country.

 

[apk55]

The Worsborough incline on the Woodhead line Wath branch used to have four engines per train. In steam days this was 4 O4 2-8-0 engines, then in electric days 4 EM1 locos.

 

[RichmondCommu]

Long gone now but in the past the South Wales iron ore trains were hauled by 3 class 37s. (all working).

I've got a feeling that prior to the introduction of the class 59's some aggregate trains were triple headed too.

 

[SpacePhoenix]

I've got a feeling that prior to the introduction of the class 59's some aggregate trains were triple headed too.

The Lickey incline would have probably needed freights to be tripple headed at times before 59s and 66s were introduced

 

[JN114]

The Lickey incline would have probably needed freights to be tripple headed at times before 59s and 66s were introduced

No that's be a waste of motive power, trains would have been double headed and banked over the lickey.

 

[racklam]

As I read this, this http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/H36312/2016/08/18/advanced went past my window with 2 Class 66 and 1 Class 70 on the front.

 

[JN114]

As I read this, this http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/H36312/2016/08/18/advanced went past my window with 2 Class 66 and 1 Class 70 on the front.

Class 66 and Class 70 aren't compatible in multiple, so unless an additional driver was provided (highly unlikely) the train wasn't triple-headed, the additional loco(s) were Dead-in-Train.

The OP is asking whether trains are triple-headed - that is to say 3 locos leading all of which are contributing to the power output of the train.

 

[D6975]

Long gone now but in the past the South Wales iron ore trains were hauled by 3 class 37s. (all working).

and similarly the Motherwell iron ores were 3x37 for part of their journey.

 

[Andyjs247]

and similarly the Motherwell iron ores were 3x37 for part of their journey.

Yes. Around the early 80s in South Wales the heavy iron ore trains from Port Talbot to Llanwern were booked for 3x37s. Soon after 2x56s became the regular traction IIRC. And in Scotland the flow from Hunterston to Ravenscraig / Motherwell was 3x37s. I don't remember any other cases of booked triple headed traction but happy to be corrected.

These days 3 locos up front is more likely following a failure or for positioning reasons with one or more dead in train. It's very unlikely all 3 will be under power.

 

[PHILIPE]

The Lickey incline would have probably needed freights to be tripple headed at times before 59s and 66s were introduced

As many as 4 Jinties banking in rear in Steam days.

 

[Harbornite]

As many as 4 Jinties banking in rear in Steam days.

Aye, sometimes assisted by the ex MR 2-10-0 big bertha which was replaced by a 9F. The jinties were replaced by panniers and eventually the whole lot was replaced by class 37s.

 

[RJ21]

I seem to recall a few years back a mention in Modern Railways of a short lived freight service, I think from somewhere in East Anglia to the West Midlands, which was hauled by 3x Class 31, they could have been ex-FM locos.

 

[sprinterguy]

Yes. Around the early 80s in South Wales the heavy iron ore trains from Port Talbot to Llanwern were booked for 3x37s. Soon after 2x56s became the regular traction IIRC.

I thought that 3 x "heavyweight" 37s took over from 2 x 56s on the South Wales steel trains due to their superior braking capabilities, rather than the other way around? That's how RAIL magazine reported it at the time.

And I thought that the Ravenscraig steel traffic only typically used pairs of their short-lived class 37/3 fleet - The evidence of multiple forum members seems to state otherwise, though, so I've learnt something new there.

 

[PHILIPE]

I thought that 3 x "heavyweight" 37s took over from 2 x 56s on the South Wales steel trains due to their superior braking capabilities, rather than the other way around? That's how RAIL magazine reported it at the time.

And I thought that the Ravenscraig steel traffic only typically used pairs of their short-lived class 37/3 fleet - The evidence of multiple forum members seems to state otherwise, though, so I've learnt something new there.

No. The 3x37s were first while the 56s were still being built.

 

[fowler9]

There was a period when quadruple header class 20's passed the bottom of our garden by West Allerton station pulling coal trains that had come up from Liverpools docks. 56's and occasionally 58's were more common though. I think the 56's were often double header.

 

[30907]

And if we go back far enough, triple headed steam was a summer Saturday regular from Exeter Central to Yeoford, for positioning purposes on a fairly lightweight train. And then there was the Folkestone Harbour branch with up to 4 R1s or 57xx...

 

[ac6000cw]

I thought that 3 x "heavyweight" 37s took over from 2 x 56s on the South Wales steel trains due to their superior braking capabilities, rather than the other way around? That's how RAIL magazine reported it at the time.

AFAIK, it started with 3 x 'as built' 37s, then switched to 2 x rebuilt 'heavy' 37s (which used less fuel overall), then 2 x 56s and lastly 1 x 60 (the most economical of the lot). Then Llanwern closed its blast furnaces...

The trains were always fully (air) brake fitted, so the loco brake force probably wasn't that relevant (and no UK diesels until the 68s arrived had electric/dynamic/rheostatic braking, which might have influenced the loco choice if they had).

 

[randyrippley]

a few years back the Heysham nuclear flasks were sometimes delivered by a 20/37/20 triple header. It was around the time they stopped using barrier wagons between locomotive and flask, so part of the reason may have been to create a buffer zone for the crew.
On other occasions I've seen flasks top and tailed with a 37 at one end and 2x20 at the other

 

[theageofthetra]

Going a bit OT -Although common abroad, particular in the US, have there ever been any trains run in the UK with an assisting locomotive(s) in the middle?

I'm not including centre powered trains like a GWR auto train with a coach either side of a loco or centre powered MU's e.g APT.

I would guess that if it ever did occur it may have been in the very early days of the railways with early low powered locomotives.

 

[sprinterguy]

No. The 3x37s were first while the 56s were still being built.

Not in the scenario I'm thinking of - this was in Trainload coal days (so mid nineties, rather than eighties, to be fair), long after the 56s had been constructed. Hadn't realised that there had in fact been an earlier occurrence.