Trespassers and Network Rail

[YorkshireBear]

This is the first i've heard of this, a friend was telling me other day after a driving experience at GCR that netwok rail are very close to banning railtours because of people getting on line to take pictures.

I never realised there was a problem with this kind of thing? how often and bad does it get?

 

[Anvil1984]

Its probably just chinese whispers but there are an increasing amount of incidents happening, this one sums it up http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lRGJTG8FYAQ&feature=related

 

[robert2000]

Never had this problem before, they usually stand in a field or platform.

 

[ainsworth74]

Well here are some recent issues:

1
2
3

Its probably just a rumour but still, I wouldn't blame them if they did enforce a ban on some of this evidence.

 

[The Planner]

Its the kettle tours where the problems occur. There is of course the recent one where some bloke was inches from being hit on YouTube and RailwayEye shows how idiotic some can be if you look at the story from 4th August.

Looks like Ainsworth got in a few seconds before me !

 

[ainsworth74]

Looks like Ainsworth got in a few seconds before me !

Happy to help

 

[12CSVT]

There was an incident at Kettering a few weeks ago when police had to be called because of some idiots trespassing too close to the track when Duke of Gloucester was due with a railtour

 

[YorkshireBear]

Jesus, never even realised it was that bad :/
Wouldn't blame them to be honest, is it not against the law and therefore worth arresting, would threat of prison or a night in a police cell put them off?

Not being funny but if there gonna do that and ruin it for people who quite happily do things properly and don't interfere then they deserve it, they must know what their doing is wrong?

 

[Clip]

There was an incident at Kettering a few weeks ago when police had to be called because of some idiots trespassing too close to the track when Duke of Gloucester was due with a railtour

Aye was just reading about that in a mag.. they were all over the place and well down the line..

i doubt they would ban them as they make a good bit of money from them dont they?

 

[Aictos]

At the end of the day, trespassing is still a offence and trespassers can be asked to move on by rail staff for their own safety and this is covered in both the general photo guidelines and in the railway byelaws as well.

 

[blackfive460]

There have always been a minority who behave stupidly and I recall things being much worse in the 1960s and 70s.
The problem at the moment is that incidents have been getting lots of publicity on the web and in other national media so NR are having to be seen to be taking notice of something that they have been aware of for some time.
Their problem now is that if they succeed in banning charters, particularly steam charters, they will put a few companies out of business.
It would be far better if those of us who go lineside behaved responsibly and where we see others not doing so attempt to police this problem ourselves but on no account draw attention to it on public forums, Youtube and the like.

 

[trentside]

I would sincerely hope that those who are doing their hardest to bring the enthusiast community into disrepute actually start to recognise that, by trespassing and taking unnecessary risks they are actually destroying their own hobby by breeding further hostility towards genuine rail enthusiasts.

Although I've never travelled on a charter, I do like to see them when they pass through my local stations if I happen to be around. If this were to stop, everyone is getting punished (for want of a better word) due to the actions of a few idiots.

 

[mumrar]

As a photographer of all kinds of traction, I must say it is largely the steam enthusiasts and elder generations who are doing this. They may have 'got away' with it in the old days, but this is no longer the old days. By virtue of the fact that digital has brought so many more photographers out, so the trespass is on a larger scale. When the Duke of Gloucester climbed the Lickey this year, between Bromsgrove and Blackwell there were at least 30-40 people lineside (within fences). Diesel has it's own nutters though, most noticably a young gentleman from South Wales, and everyone is putting these charters at risk. Network Rail do not need to allow them to run, and a ban is as simple as one decision, one piece of paper - it's their trainset after all.

 

[John Webb]

I would recommend that photographers who see such tresspassers should photograph them and forward the images to the British Transport Police with details of date, location, etc. - the knowledge that the police could be given such details may help to deter some of the idiots and protect the pleasures of those who do behave themselves.

John Webb

 

[Geezertronic]

I was reading this months issue of the online Railtalk Magazine (Issue 47) and some of the pics in there look as if they have been taken from... shall we say compromised positions.

In particular the pic on Page 17 (looks to be taken whilst leaning over level crossing barriers), Page 65 (looks as if the photographer is at the bottom of the platform ramp), and some of them look to be taken lineside. Fair enough if they have permission and are wearing the necessary high-viz stuff...

 

[scotsman]

My policy is call the BTP on sight of anyone without a hi-vis lineside.

 

[jimrbrobinson]

Page 8 of the October edition of The Railway Magazine shows another case of abject stupidity and railway tresspass, apparently of parents lining their children up for a photoshoot on 60mph track, including one child in a pushchair. To be honest though, every year there's talk at the build-up to the summer holidays of "massive publicity" warning of the dangers - particularly referring to children playing on railways during the summer holidays, yet I never seem to see or hear anything of the actual "high-profile campaign" promised?? Surely a proper information campaign backed up with some highly publicised successful prosecutions would be a better start at getting the message across than banning steamers from the metals.

 

[9K43]

Part of an EWS/DB charter train diagram instructs all passengers must only get off/on the the train at booked station stops.
It would be upto the promoter of the charter to have stewards on the train to stop folk getting on and off where they should not.
It will be written into the terms and conditions of the booking when a person buys a ticket, not to get off /on other than booked station stops.
I had had a Charter at Tinsley Yard, Sheffield, and there was bodies wandering all over the yard.
At this time, a loco was coming off the train, and another one being attached.
These people were in the way of this movement, and should not have been there.
When working trainspotter trains they can be a nightmare of stupid rowdy conduct and un safe acts, of leaning out of windows at line speeds, hanging out of the windows foul of the other running line.
If someone wants to get slapped in the face with lineside vegitation its upto them.
In my service, I have worked a lots of Charter trains all over the system.

 

[scotsman]

Folk with kids wandering foul of the line because it's a preserved steam train, ignoring the PASSENGERS MUST NOT PASS THIS POINT sign completely. Kudos to the man with his son who asked me if it meant he couldn't go down the ramp for a picture. "Eh, let's see the sign......Passengers must not pass this point, yeah - I'd say it does"
:mad:

 

[Peter Mugridge]

I would like to see a full scale get tough crackdown on trespassers; it would be easy enough for the BTP to put a few plain clothes officers in the crowd when a charter is due in then nick anyone who goes out of bounds before they realise there are police around.

 

[142094]

Have to disagree with that, there aren't that many BTP and they've probably got more important things to do such as security for terrorism and football fans etc. If every charter had to have BTP at the start and end it would add up to quite a high bill. Even when BTP are there I've seen people going past the "Passengers must not pass this sign" and BTP not do anything.

Plus then there are all the lineside areas where photters congregate, BTP will never be able to combat that unless they get in a van and follow the train.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

My thinking is that they don't need to "hit" the entire route of any charter; just pick a couple of the busier / more problematic locations for one and then make sure the arrests are high profile in the press.

After a couple of weeks of this, the deterent factor will come into play and trespassing will reduce generally ( I know it won't completely go away ) because those contemplating it would be wondering how many police were in the crowd nearby.

An occasional high profile anti-tresspass "hit" every so often afterwards would keep the factor in play.

 

[networkrail1]

The last time a steam charter came through newark, I went down to the footpath crossing to see it.

I was on my break at the time so was wearing full NR orange, when I got there I couldn't even see the tracks there were so many people lineside.

I started telling them to get off but most of them ignored me and the others just called me a jobsworth and said I'm being harsh, one guy even said I pay my taxes so I have a right to go where ever I want on the railway, he got that wrong as 5 minuets later the BTP turned up and arrested him but there were so many people there that the BTP could only deal with him and the rest got away with it.

All the best.

Simon

 

[Aictos]

Well I got told a few years there was a few idiots lineside at Hertford who got asked nicely to return back onto the platform who then became abusive at the staff member, now I wouldn't stand for that and would advise the signaller that I was waiting BTP assistance or Herts Police assistance and if the charter could be held outside until the idiots have been moved away from the lineside/trackside.

There's no need for the abusive behaviour from anyone and they're not doing themselves any favours either!

 

[158747]

I would like to see a full scale get tough crackdown on trespassers; it would be easy enough for the BTP to put a few plain clothes officers in the crowd when a charter is due in then nick anyone who goes out of bounds before they realise there are police around.

Was at Parson St. station in Bristol last year filming the Torbay Express. Two people were under the road bridge off the end of the platform. Little did they realise but there was a plain clothes officer on the platform who called up some uniformed officers who arrived shortly after the train had gone through and caught them in the act, they were still under the bridge packing up their kit.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Have to disagree with that, there aren't that many BTP and they've probably got more important things to do such as security for terrorism and football fans etc. If every charter had to have BTP at the start and end it would add up to quite a high bill. Even when BTP are there I've seen people going past the "Passengers must not pass this sign" and BTP not do anything.

Plus then there are all the lineside areas where photters congregate, BTP will never be able to combat that unless they get in a van and follow the train.

Preventing trespassing is very important! The way things are going its only a matter of time before one of these idiots gets killed or seriously injured, just think of the problems that will cause for the majority of law abiding entusiasts. Not to mention the trauma to the driver of the train and anyone else involved.

 

[Clip]

Page 8 of the October edition of The Railway Magazine shows another case of abject stupidity and railway tresspass, apparently of parents lining their children up for a photoshoot on 60mph track, including one child in a pushchair. To be honest though, every year there's talk at the build-up to the summer holidays of "massive publicity" warning of the dangers - particularly referring to children playing on railways during the summer holidays, yet I never seem to see or hear anything of the actual "high-profile campaign" promised?? Surely a proper information campaign backed up with some highly publicised successful prosecutions would be a better start at getting the message across than banning steamers from the metals.

I was shocked when i saw this - just what were the parents thinking..

 

[YorkshireBear]

simon,
partiularly like the bit about him paying taxes.... What kind of logic is that i pay my taxes so i can just walk around land i don't owna nd have no right to be on. Yeah don't know what drugs he's been taking.
If anywhere it's possible if i knew abusive enthusiasts were lineside i'd reroute it away from them. Then send a RHTT through. (am i right in thinking RHTT sprays something out of side, only seen one once and it was doing )

 

[GB]

Then send a RHTT through. (am i right in thinking RHTT sprays something out of side, only seen one once and it was doing )

The RHTT sprays water toward the rail head at a very high pressure. The resulting spray that bounces back of the rail would be enough coat anyone who is close enough.

 

[Vulcan]

The RHTT sprays water toward the rail head at a very high pressure. The resulting spray that bounces back of the rail would be enough coat anyone who is close enough.

The weedkiller train would also be unpleasent to be on the lineside when it's working.


This is a subject I have brought up on here before, and one that never seems to go away. There seems to be a thinking within the idiots that because it was OK to wonder around the railway back in steam days (when trains ran less frequently, and often slower) that it should still be ok on our high intensity, high speed, rail network.

Carnforth is a place where it happens a lot. When a southbound train sits in the platform, the only place to get the whole of the loco in shot is down the ramp, right next to the WCML with Pendolinos screaming past at 125mph. I've even seen parents with little kids down there before now.

I have also been on the end of platform 9 at York when some people that were previously on the platform taking numbers suddenly appeared on the trackside in an orange jacket they got off ebay, taking photos of the DRS 57 in the siding.

I have seen them on numerous occasions from the Scarbrough Spa Express. The worst one was at Knaresbrough, standing in the 4-foot of the Leeds-bound line in the tunnel at the end of the platforms, with his back to the potentially oncoming trains taking a photo of our engine. Luckily (and potentially life saving for him) one of the engine crew spotted him and gave him a good shouting at.

Its crazy what these 'enthusiasts' will do just for a photograph.

 

[Clip]

Its crazy what these 'enthusiasts' will do just for a photograph.

And then ruining it for everyone else.


Now there must be some of those concerned who read this forum but yet still wont try and be proactive and be a friend of the railway rather then a proper **** of it.

This sort of thing really angers me when at work i actively promote people to get pics and be a friend of the railway