Travelling (unknowingly) with an expired railcard on the Thameslink

[Railhelp]

Hi all,

I'm looking for some guidance on a incident that happened around 3 weeks ago. I would like to preface this post by saying I know what I did was wrong and I am genuinely sorry.

I was taking a Thameslink train from Brighton to London Victoria. When the train got to East Croydon about 10 revenue protection officers got on and started checking tickets. I had purchased the correct ticket and so I thought things would be okay however when I went to load my railcard I realised that it had expired towards the end of November. In panic and with the officer approaching, I decided I would tell him that my phone had died. They had just fined the lady in front of me £120 on the spot and I was very nervous so I came up with this excuse. I know that it is wrong to have an expired railcard but I genuinely was not aware of this and have literally no history of doing anything like this before.

When he approached I provided my ticket and when asked for my railcard I informed him that my phone was dead. He took down my details and told me I had 14 days to upload proof of a valid railcard. However, when he asked for my name I gave a fake name and I also gave the wrong address (an address two doors down from mine- stupid, I know). I know that this was incredibly stupid of me but I genuinely panicked in the moment. He was asking me things like my eye colour, my hair colour, my height and reading me my rights and I genuinely got so stressed out at the prospect of a fine that I messed up and gave a fake name and address. He took a picture of my ticket so I assume that through this they will access information about me a well as my other journey. I checked my journey history and since November I have probably made around 7 journeys with this expired railcard. These were all single advanced off peak tickets.

I have a genuine history of severe anxiety and I know this is no excuse but I would have never knowingly travelled with an expired railcard because I am such an anxious traveler! I literally had a session with my therapist an hour before I got on the train and we were listing all the hypothetical things that could go wrong because I was so anxious to get on the train. When I eventually got to Victoria I just sat in the toilets for an hour because I was so scared to leave and since the incident I have been so incredibly stressed about the fine and the lying about my name and address. I cried so much that night and barely ate because I am a student and don't even have that kind of money in my account to be able to pay the fine. I even wanted to call them that night and confess to everything but they don't have a phone number and it was a thursday night. I purchased a railcard the very next day. This was a case of me genuinely not knowing that my railcard had expired but either way I messed up and I messed up more by giving a fake name.

I have since spoken to my therapist and she has advised my to be honest and pay the fine however I can. She also mentioned in my letter that I should mention my history and my anxiety. I won't know about any letters they send to me as I gave the wrong address, however my witness statement receipt says the address I gave so I can go over and ask them if they've received any letters for me.

My question is, since I gave a fake name and address is there even just the tiniest chance that this will go away or will I have to spend the rest of my life looking over my shoulder waiting to be slapped with a fine. If I do end up magically finding the letter they sent, can I just pay the fine and not mention anything about having given a fake name? I'm not sure how the money is paid to Thameslink but can't I just pay the fine with my bank card without having to let them know about the name/address issue? Any help would be much appreciated!

 

[Trainman40083]

Did you buy your ticket on line, from such as The Trainline?

 

[Railhelp]

Did you buy your ticket on line, from such as The Trainline?

Hi, yes I purchased my ticket online but from TrainPal.

 

[alholmes]

So to answer your questions…

This won’t go away. If you can’t / don’t get the letter then it will ultimately just progress to court and you’ll be found guilty in absence. The court are then very good at finding people with unpaid fines, so you should assume that they will find you.

But ideally you want to stop this from reaching court in the first place, but it will require some effort by you and some money to settle with GTR Thameslink.

Is there any way you can speak to the people at the address that you’ve given and explain that there’s some important post for you (or the fake name that you gave) that may be dropping through their letterbox, albeit it may not be for a few weeks? Don’t worry too much about giving GTR Thameslink a fake name & address - they may get your correct name from TrainPal anyway, but ultimately they just want money.

 

[island]

I was taking a Thameslink train from Brighton to London Victoria.

Thameslink do not operate trains to London Victoria, so you should make sure you give the correct information in any correspondence. For example a Thameslink train to London Bridge, or a Southern train to Victoria.

 

[Railhelp]

So to answer your questions…

This won’t go away. If you can’t / don’t get the letter then it will ultimately just progress to court and you’ll be found guilty in absence. The court are then very good at finding people with unpaid fines, so you should assume that they will find you.

But ideally you want to stop this from reaching court in the first place, but it will require some effort by you and some money to settle with GTR Thameslink.

Is there any way you can speak to the people at the address that you’ve given and explain that there’s some important post for you (or the fake name that you gave) that may be dropping through their letterbox, albeit it may not be for a few weeks? Don’t worry too much about giving GTR Thameslink a fake name & address - they may get your correct name from TrainPal anyway, but ultimately they just want money.

Hi, yes thank you so much for your response. I will be going over to ask tomorrow as it has now been 3 weeks since the incident and one week past the 14 days I was given to upload my railcard to the link they provided. I just worry about when GTR decide to send the letter as I have seen in some cases it can take up to 6 months and I wouldn't want to miss the letter as I would want to pay the fine as soon as it comes so that they don't think i'm ignoring them. Should I write a letter to them or would it be best to wait for their letter?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 9 Mar 2025 ==

Thameslink do not operate trains to London Victoria, so you should make sure you give the correct information in any correspondence. For example a Thameslink train to London Bridge, or a Southern train to Victoria.

Hi yes sorry, it was a Thameslink train to East Croydon and then a Southern train to London Victoria. Will be sure to keep that in mind for any future correspondence.

 

[Hadders]

Welcome to the forum!

You've got yourself in a bit of a mess but it should be sortable if you follow the advice forum members give on here.

Firstly, were you given any paperwork by the inspector who questioned you? If so, can you upload a redacted copy of it in this thread?

Next, however it gets resolved it's going to cost you some money. you need to start thinking about how your going to raise the money. Can you get a part time job? Or borrow it from family?

 

[AlterEgo]

If the company doesn’t bother to check the ticketing history they won’t find out who purchased the ticket (which, to note, isn’t proof of who was stopped in and of itself). So, there is a chance this will “go away”, as the OP gave false details which were accepted.

It’s best for the OP to wait to be contacted.

 

[Hadders]

If the company doesn’t bother to check the ticketing history they won’t find out who purchased the ticket (which, to note, isn’t proof of who was stopped in and of itself). So, there is a chance this will “go away”, as the OP gave false details which were accepted.

It’s best for the OP to wait to be contacted.

While I don't disagree with this assessment there is a risk that if the train company do discover who has purchased the tickets (which is simple for them to do) we should point out that a prosecution for giving false details could be the end result.

 

[Camsus]

Hi all,

I'm looking for some guidance on a incident that happened around 3 weeks ago. I would like to preface this post by saying I know what I did was wrong and I am genuinely sorry.

I was taking a Thameslink train from Brighton to London Victoria. When the train got to East Croydon about 10 revenue protection officers got on and started checking tickets. I had purchased the correct ticket and so I thought things would be okay however when I went to load my railcard I realised that it had expired towards the end of November. In panic and with the officer approaching, I decided I would tell him that my phone had died. They had just fined the lady in front of me £120 on the spot and I was very nervous so I came up with this excuse. I know that it is wrong to have an expired railcard but I genuinely was not aware of this and have literally no history of doing anything like this before.

When he approached I provided my ticket and when asked for my railcard I informed him that my phone was dead. He took down my details and told me I had 14 days to upload proof of a valid railcard. However, when he asked for my name I gave a fake name and I also gave the wrong address (an address two doors down from mine- stupid, I know). I know that this was incredibly stupid of me but I genuinely panicked in the moment. He was asking me things like my eye colour, my hair colour, my height and reading me my rights and I genuinely got so stressed out at the prospect of a fine that I messed up and gave a fake name and address. He took a picture of my ticket so I assume that through this they will access information about me a well as my other journey. I checked my journey history and since November I have probably made around 7 journeys with this expired railcard. These were all single advanced off peak tickets.

I have a genuine history of severe anxiety and I know this is no excuse but I would have never knowingly travelled with an expired railcard because I am such an anxious traveler! I literally had a session with my therapist an hour before I got on the train and we were listing all the hypothetical things that could go wrong because I was so anxious to get on the train. When I eventually got to Victoria I just sat in the toilets for an hour because I was so scared to leave and since the incident I have been so incredibly stressed about the fine and the lying about my name and address. I cried so much that night and barely ate because I am a student and don't even have that kind of money in my account to be able to pay the fine. I even wanted to call them that night and confess to everything but they don't have a phone number and it was a thursday night. I purchased a railcard the very next day. This was a case of me genuinely not knowing that my railcard had expired but either way I messed up and I messed up more by giving a fake name.

I have since spoken to my therapist and she has advised my to be honest and pay the fine however I can. She also mentioned in my letter that I should mention my history and my anxiety. I won't know about any letters they send to me as I gave the wrong address, however my witness statement receipt says the address I gave so I can go over and ask them if they've received any letters for me.

My question is, since I gave a fake name and address is there even just the tiniest chance that this will go away or will I have to spend the rest of my life looking over my shoulder waiting to be slapped with a fine. If I do end up magically finding the letter they sent, can I just pay the fine and not mention anything about having given a fake name? I'm not sure how the money is paid to Thameslink but can't I just pay the fine with my bank card without having to let them know about the name/address issue? Any help would be much appreciated!

If this is worrying you so much, why don't you just grab the bull by the horns and email GTR, quoting the reference on your receipt, telling them you stupidly panicked in the moment? Provide them with your correct details and at least you can then deal with the situation. Pretty much every thread on here involving GTR ends in an out of court settlement for people who cooperate with them, so I don't see why you'd want to risk sticking your head in the sand hoping you aren't found.

gtr.prosecutions@gtrailway.com

 

[AlterEgo]

While I don't disagree with this assessment there is a risk that if the train company do discover who has purchased the tickets (which is simple for them to do) we should point out that a prosecution for giving false details could be the end result.

A prosecution for this could arise anyway in theory because the OP has committed the offence and either has to wait to be discovered or confess to that offence. But I don’t think we have ever seen them prosecute for this offence regardless.

 

[John R]

While I don't disagree with this assessment there is a risk that if the train company do discover who has purchased the tickets (which is simple for them to do) we should point out that a prosecution for giving false details could be the end result.

And whilst it’s clearly possible for the rail company to accept an explanation that an expired railcard is an oversight, and not deliberate fare evasion, it’s impossible to believe that giving an incorrect name and address was anything other than a deliberate attempt to evade being held to account for travelling with an invalid ticket.

Which might colour their judgement in deciding whether to offer a settlement, depending on how much hassle they are put through before the OP is “found”.

 

[Haywain]

If the company doesn’t bother to check the ticketing history they won’t find out who purchased the ticket (which, to note, isn’t proof of who was stopped in and of itself). So, there is a chance this will “go away”, as the OP gave false details which were accepted.

It’s best for the OP to wait to be contacted.

In general terms I agree with you but I can't see a 'wait and see' approach being good for the OP's severe anxiety. That being the case I am inclined to advising that the OP should contact GTR and advise the correct details.

 

[WesternLancer]

If this is worrying you so much, why don't you just grab the bull by the horns and email GTR, quoting the reference on your receipt, telling them you stupidly panicked in the moment? Provide them with your correct details and at least you can then deal with the situation. Pretty much every thread on here involving GTR ends in an out of court settlement for people who cooperate with them, so I don't see why you'd want to risk sticking your head in the sand hoping you aren't found.

gtr.prosecutions@gtrailway.com

I do tend to think this is probably a good idea.

 

[Hadders]

In general terms I agree with you but I can't see a 'wait and see' approach being good for the OP's severe anxiety. That being the case I am inclined to advising that the OP should contact GTR and advise the correct details.

I agree which is why I asked to see a copy of the paperwork that was given. This often has a link to upload a copy of a forgotten railcard and, assuming this is what was given, then my suggestion would be to upload a letter explaining what has happened to this link.

 

[Railhelp]

Welcome to the forum!

You've got yourself in a bit of a mess but it should be sortable if you follow the advice forum members give on here.

Firstly, were you given any paperwork by the inspector who questioned you? If so, can you upload a redacted copy of it in this thread?

Next, however it gets resolved it's going to cost you some money. you need to start thinking about how your going to raise the money. Can you get a part time job? Or borrow it from family?

Hi, thanks so much for the response. I was given a witness statement receipt, yes. I will attach a photo of it. I have been looking into ways I can raise the funds for the fine, would you happen to know how much they will decided to fine me? It was a total of 7 journeys and they were all around the £10 to £15 mark full price.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 12 Mar 2025 ==

If the company doesn’t bother to check the ticketing history they won’t find out who purchased the ticket (which, to note, isn’t proof of who was stopped in and of itself). So, there is a chance this will “go away”, as the OP gave false details which were accepted.

It’s best for the OP to wait to be contacted.

Thanks for the response. How likely is it that the company won't bother checking the ticketing history? I have been fully preparing myself for the worst outcome.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 12 Mar 2025 ==

If this is worrying you so much, why don't you just grab the bull by the horns and email GTR, quoting the reference on your receipt, telling them you stupidly panicked in the moment? Provide them with your correct details and at least you can then deal with the situation. Pretty much every thread on here involving GTR ends in an out of court settlement for people who cooperate with them, so I don't see why you'd want to risk sticking your head in the sand hoping you aren't found.

gtr.prosecutions@gtrailway.com

Hi, yep that's what I wanted to do immediately that day when I got home but I've been trawling all the threads here and have seen some people say to not contact them unless contacted and others saying to contact them so I thought to post about my own situation and see what the advice is. I just worry that if I do contact them and tell them about my fake name i'll be making things even worse for myself then if I were to wait for the letter (to the wrong address) and then just pay the fine.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 12 Mar 2025 ==

Also, I visited the address given to ask about any letters but they said they hadn't received anything. I asked if they could kindly forward any letters for me to my address and they said that they would.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 12 Mar 2025 ==

If the company doesn’t bother to check the ticketing history they won’t find out who purchased the ticket (which, to note, isn’t proof of who was stopped in and of itself). So, there is a chance this will “go away”, as the OP gave false details which were accepted.

It’s best for the OP to wait to be contacted.

I do worry that i'll think it's 'gone away' after them not contacting me and then in 10 years time I'll be given a letter for a £5000 fine or something because I didn't pay the fine and assumed it had just gone away.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 12 Mar 2025 ==

A prosecution for this could arise anyway in theory because the OP has committed the offence and either has to wait to be discovered or confess to that offence. But I don’t think we have ever seen them prosecute for this offence regardless.

Which do you think I should do? wait to be discovered or confess to the offence?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 12 Mar 2025 ==

And whilst it’s clearly possible for the rail company to accept an explanation that an expired railcard is an oversight, and not deliberate fare evasion, it’s impossible to believe that giving an incorrect name and address was anything other than a deliberate attempt to evade being held to account for travelling with an invalid ticket.

Which might colour their judgement in deciding whether to offer a settlement, depending on how much hassle they are put through before the OP is “found”.

Hi, in terms of the situation with the fake name and it affecting their judgment, do you mean in terms of how much I am fined or in terms of if they decide to offer me a settlement or take me to court?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 12 Mar 2025 ==

In general terms I agree with you but I can't see a 'wait and see' approach being good for the OP's severe anxiety. That being the case I am inclined to advising that the OP should contact GTR and advise the correct details.

Thank you for the advice. And yes the waiting has left me very stressed. I think I've read about 200 posts on this forum since the incident. What would be the best way to approach writing a letter? I have seen the advice on here about letters and my therapist did advise me to mention my anxiety but I'm not sure given that the advice on here is to keep it straight to the point and apologetic.

 

[Railhelp]

Thanks everyone for all the help in advance!

 

[WesternLancer]

Thanks everyone for all the help

Have you e mailed them with your correct details? If not you may want to put your wording draft here before sending it to get it checked

Or have you decided to see if you get a letter before responding.

 

[Railhelp]

Have you e mailed them with your correct details? If not you may want to put your wording draft here before sending it to get it checked

Or have you decided to see if you get a letter before responding.

I haven't made contact yet, wanted to see what the majority advice was on here before doing so! I feel like I will definitely be receiving a letter at some point, it's just a question of if should confess about the name or wait it out and pay the fine when it arrives.

 

[AWM]

Hello,

Do you know how much the fine is?

Please don’t worry, Please let me know how much it is?

 

[WesternLancer]

I haven't made contact yet, wanted to see what the majority advice was on here before doing so! I feel like I will definitely be receiving a letter at some point, it's just a question of if should confess about the name or wait it out and pay the fine when it arrives.

As I see it the way things get worse is if you don’t get the letter and don’t reply. But others will have different views.

 

[Railhelp]

Hello,

Do you know how much the fine is?

Please don’t worry, Please let me know how much it is?

Hi, i'm not sure how much it is yet as I haven't received a letter yet.

 

[WesternLancer]

Hello,

Do you know how much the fine is?

Please don’t worry, Please let me know how much it is?

There isn’t a fine unless you go to court. If you don’t go to court they want the money for the fares evaded at the peak rate fare price plus the costs of investigating what the fare evader has done. The forum is not short of examples you can read where that is clear in terms of the money requested.

The court levies a fine for people who are found guilty, instead of a prison sentence. It’s the punishment set by the court. Well that’s the basic explanation.

 

[Railhelp]

Hi all,

I have not received a letter yet but wanted some advice. I am slightly worried about the name and address issue and from reading some of the advice I don't want to get myself in bigger trouble by confessing this to them. Would it be advisable for me to just write to them letting them know my address has changed and if they could please send any letters to my actual address instead? There is the issue of the name but would I be able to just pay the fine under the other name I gave? apologies if that sounds like an incredibly stupid idea but it occurred to me while I was drafting my letter.

 

[Hadders]

There's nothing wrong with contacting GTR as suggested by @Camsus in their post upthread.

 

[Railhelp]

There's nothing wrong with contacting GTR as suggested by @Camsus in their post upthread.

Thank you. I will be contacting them for sure. My only question is should I be mentioning the name mishap or should I just let them know that I am not at the address I gave them?

 

[Camsus]

That's up to you. Personally, I'd be completely honest about it, as well as emphasising the point that you would like to resolve the matter directly with them if at all possible

 

[Railhelp]

That's up to you. Personally, I'd be completely honest about it, as well as emphasising the point that you would like to resolve the matter directly with them if at all possible

Thank you

 

[IAmStupid]

Out of pure curiosity did this all sort itself out OP?

 

[30907]

Out of pure curiosity did this all sort itself out OP?

It is 3 months since they last posted, and your own case is rather different anyway.