Hi to whoever is reading this I received a email recently from fraud investigations greater anglia stating that they have been led to believe that I am potentially not paying full fares and that there is a couple of incorrectly purchased tickets alongside they have also said in a attached letter that they are seeking to ascertain whether a valid ticket was held for the journeys and that I have a week to respond, any tips or advice on what I can possibly do?
-
Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!
Travel Irregularity
- Thread starter rajesh55
- Start date
- Status
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R
RailUK Forums
notmyrealname
Member
Hi, welcome to the forum.
If you would like the pros here to help you, they need to see all of the correspondence between you and Greater Anglia, please. Make sure you hide your name address and any reference numbers.
If you would like the pros here to help you, they need to see all of the correspondence between you and Greater Anglia, please. Make sure you hide your name address and any reference numbers.
The answer might be “do nothing at all” because railway companies have form for these kind of fishing emails which are trying to get you to incriminate yourself. However, without more information we can’t provide proper advice.
Just do not reply to them in haste because of their email. Wait to think about it and, hopefully, get advice and guidance here.
Just do not reply to them in haste because of their email. Wait to think about it and, hopefully, get advice and guidance here.
Please read the pinned message at the top of this section. It explains what we need to know in order to be able to help.
I've just added a link to it.
www.railforums.co.uk
I've just added a link to it.
Please read before posting in Disputes & Prosecutions
Guidance for those asking for advice: Please bear in mind the following, when asking for advice in this section: We need to know all relevant facts in order to assist you, including, for example: The stations* where you actually started & finished your journey The stations* where you changed...
www.railforums.co.uk
Hi I would like to repeat story again in more detail so its more understandable but pretty much nearly 2-3 months ago I found a way to get to chelmsford from Stratford cheaper so rather than paying for ticket from Stratford Ive been purchasing a ticket with return closer to chelmsford on trainline. Few weeks ago I believe I was on greater anglia train to chelmsford and was asked to show my ticket to ticket inspector which of course they didn't accept and told me to purchase a ticket for £36 but because I had a railcard it got reduced. I don't know if I received this email because of that but they also stated that I've been having travel irregularities since the start of this year which I actually don't know what they mean by that because I don't remember doing anything around then. Lastly they have asked me to provide mitigations or statements as well as 2ny supporting documentation. I have attached the letter below and personally the outcome I think would be satisfactory is worst case scenario paying off a fine and settling this case but if there's any other ways I can sort this out without doing that or incriminating myself please may I know what I can do?
.
.
Attachments
JBuchananGB
Established Member
It seems probable that arising from the incident when you were stopped and bought a new ticket on the train, your details were passed to the prosecutions office of Greater Anglia, who have found out what you have been doing. It should go without saying that you must by now have stopped short-faring and are now buying the right tickets for your journeys.
As it seems that when you were stopped you were not told you would be reported for consideration of prosecution, you may be able to ignore the letter which you have now received. You would probably receive some further letters, more strongly worded, but unless you respond, in effect admitting your criminal actions, GA have nowhere to go. They can see that short-fares were bought on your account but can't prove that you were the person who used them.
As it seems that when you were stopped you were not told you would be reported for consideration of prosecution, you may be able to ignore the letter which you have now received. You would probably receive some further letters, more strongly worded, but unless you respond, in effect admitting your criminal actions, GA have nowhere to go. They can see that short-fares were bought on your account but can't prove that you were the person who used them.
What you mean is "I evaded paying the correct fare and thought I would get away with it."
I would concur with the post above that your best approach is to a) pay the correct fare going forward b) not reply, and c) prepare for several follow up letters threatening prosecution or civil action. Whilst they will find it difficult to prosecute you without hard evidence that you used the tickets they have found on your account, it is more likely that a civil claim would succeed, given they have the evidence of the one time they stopped you. If they go down this route, you should come back here for more advice. You also need to think if you can pay the amount you have defrauded them in the event that they come back to you.
Mcr Warrior
Veteran Member
- Joined
- 8 Jan 2009
- Messages
- 17,194
If the journey is Chelmsford to Stratford, the one-way Anytime Day Single fare is currently £18.10. Same in the reverse direction. (Would have been £17.30 for journeys made before early March 2025). For multiple journeys over a nine/ten month period from January 2025 to October 2025, this could add up to significantly well over a four figure sum that's due. Plus admin fees on top.
I agree with this. The OP was potentially stopped by a guard rather than an RPI, though the services which call at both Stratford and Chelmsford are few and far between.
Ticket purchased online and scanned?
Based on the letter, your ticket purchasing history was automatically picked up by some kind of fraud detection algorithm. They tend to be pretty accurate, though even I've been handed an incorrect one before.
This means they likely have no evidence, but as you were stopped once it is possible. Was it a Norwich-bound service you were stopped on?
The “problem” with e-tickets is that whilst they offer a facility for those looking to short fare, they also leave an excellent trail for the authorities to both find you (via your account) and also see exactly how many times you have done the same thing, as opposed to just dealing with the instance where you were caught in the act.
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
Oh okk so do you think I should reply to the email or not reply but not do this same trick again
WesternLancer
Veteran Member
- Joined
- 12 Apr 2019
- Messages
- 15,058
The answer is in post #7
If you keep on doing your “trick” you will end up being prosecuted in court. They are already on to you and suspect what you are doing.
Travel without a valid ticket in England is a criminal offence. A prosecution, if you are found guilty, means a criminal record against your name that anyone can find out about.
Last edited:
WirralLine
Member
Or, not do any "tricks" and pay the correct fare for your journeys. They're already onto you so anything other than paying the correct fare is digging yourself into a deeper hole.
Guys I would like to know by the end of this week how many people think I should reply or not, based on that I will see what to do.
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
Reply yes or no please
WesternLancer
Veteran Member
- Joined
- 12 Apr 2019
- Messages
- 15,058
A good reply.
and presumably the OP can see how many people here have advised whether to reply or not to reply (or indeed not given a view).
You have a choice. You can follow the advice given by experienced people on this forum, or you can reply to GA and expose yourself to the risk of admitting something that they appear to have no evidence of.
The first option involves sitting tight, seeing some unpleasant letters come in, and having the strength to remain silent. It comes with a small risk (<10%?) that they do have real evidence about your fare dodging and that they use it, but the odds are that they don't have the proof that they would need to take action.
The second option has a very high risk (90%+) that you will provide them with evidence of your fare dodging, and give them the means to (best case) demand a settlement payment from you, probably over £1000, or prosecute you for the criminal offence you have been committing. That will also be expensive, and a criminal conviction will affect you in other ways too.
From your writing style, I suspect that English is not your first language and I will also assume that you have been brought up elsewhere. When considering your choice, it's worth remembering that English law, unlike many other systems, both gives you the right to remain silent and not incriminate yourself, and then protects that right strongly.
As @jfollows says, this is not a poll. We do not know the details, we do not know how you make your choices. You need to make that choice - but do so considering the advice you've been given.
The letter posted is almost identical to the one I have been given, word-for-word. It even starts with "Re: X account" the same as mine. This suggests to me that their suspicions are from data analysis rather than a report.
As you seem to believe that you were stopped on a Norwich (intercity) service, it is likely that you were caught by a guard with no revenue protection capabilities. This could still be flagged up and it may be a reason why they looked into your account.
Which tickets were you actually buying, and how frequently do you travel? Season tickets and flexi-season tickets may be worth looking into as GA are onto you and will eventually catch you in the act, and paying the correct fare now is crucial. Forum members can help suggest ways to legally reduce your travel costs.
Whether to reply or not is entirely dependent on how much risk you want to accept. If this is going to make you anxious (they will almost certainly continue to pester you), then it might be worthwhile calculating how much you owe and replying. Ignoring it will likely not lead to anything further as it appears they have no actual evidence at this moment.
The amount they would ask for if you replied would be the full Anytime Day Single price (two for a return) for every journey made (18.10 for Chelmsford to Stratford), plus around 150 for admin fees. This will add up very fast, with 10 return journeys costing upwards of 500 pounds.
As you seem to believe that you were stopped on a Norwich (intercity) service, it is likely that you were caught by a guard with no revenue protection capabilities. This could still be flagged up and it may be a reason why they looked into your account.
Which tickets were you actually buying, and how frequently do you travel? Season tickets and flexi-season tickets may be worth looking into as GA are onto you and will eventually catch you in the act, and paying the correct fare now is crucial. Forum members can help suggest ways to legally reduce your travel costs.
Whether to reply or not is entirely dependent on how much risk you want to accept. If this is going to make you anxious (they will almost certainly continue to pester you), then it might be worthwhile calculating how much you owe and replying. Ignoring it will likely not lead to anything further as it appears they have no actual evidence at this moment.
The amount they would ask for if you replied would be the full Anytime Day Single price (two for a return) for every journey made (18.10 for Chelmsford to Stratford), plus around 150 for admin fees. This will add up very fast, with 10 return journeys costing upwards of 500 pounds.
Last edited:
Mcr Warrior
Veteran Member
- Joined
- 8 Jan 2009
- Messages
- 17,194
£28.50 is indeed the one-way Anytime Day Single fare between Chelmsford and Stratford, but in first class. The standard fare is £18.10. Will still add up quickly if multiple journeys been made.
Whoops! Amended, thank you.
Kite159
Veteran Member
Have you been buying tickets Chelmsford to somewhere like Ingatestone (to bypass the gateline at Chelmsford) and using the platform side oyster readers to touch in/out of the TfL network at Stratford?
The choice is yours. You can either ignore and hope it goes away, but the downside is that if they do have evidence of your wrong-doing, they may be more tempted to prosecute, and this could give you a criminal record which could affect job prospects or visa applications.
Alternatively, you own up and get an Out of Court settlement which could cost you a lot, but that would be the end of the matter (providing you now buy the correct tickets).
The choice is yours.
Alternatively, you own up and get an Out of Court settlement which could cost you a lot, but that would be the end of the matter (providing you now buy the correct tickets).
The choice is yours.
That is a standard communication sent out when there is no response received.
The previous advice re the choices open to you still stand.
(see post #26)
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
The first step is to pay the correct fare going forward.
The previous advice re the choices open to you still stand.
(see post #26)
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
The first step is to pay the correct fare going forward.
- Status