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Train travel - unenjoyable

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BPN2022

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Blackpool
Having been an enthusiast for many years in rail, I must say I am losing it with this industry - in terms of patience and interest.

The day to day disruption is quite frankly awful. This will take a while for Rail to recover from, and it is sad to see.

The downward spiral is on, I can only predict severe cuts to May23 TT, with routes being cut particularly where there is duplication.

Is anyone else just thinking of throwing the towel in on rail for the time being? What used to be fun, certainly isn’t anymore. Car for travelling is certainly pushing towards the norm, and that’s from a pro-rail, enthusiast, loyal traveller since I’ve been born.
 
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Hans

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Having been an enthusiast for many years in rail, I must say I am losing it with this industry - in terms of patience and interest.

The day to day disruption is quite frankly awful. This will take a while for Rail to recover from, and it is sad to see.

The downward spiral is on, I can only predict severe cuts to May23 TT, with routes being cut particularly where there is duplication.

Is anyone else just thinking of throwing the towel in on rail for the time being? What used to be fun, certainly isn’t anymore. Car for travelling is certainly pushing towards the norm, and that’s from a pro-rail, enthusiast, loyal traveller since I’ve been born.
I posted something very similar on the Avanti thread earlier today, as much I want to continue supporting the railways it is becoming increasingly difficult to justify doing so.
 

PaulMc7

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9 Jul 2019
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4,029
I'm in this boat to be fair. I very rarely use the train nowadays as the bus is so much better and generally far cheaper. Even with a shortage of bus drivers in the UK, it still tends to be more reliable than trains.
 

pokemonsuper9

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Greater Manchester
I always go for Train over Car, even for journeys when it might be double or triple the time to go by train because I much perfer going by train.
I see myself to be quite lucky when travelling recently tho, Avanti and TPE have both been in chaos and on Monday TPE only delayed me 30 mins going out and 0 mins (but I had to run for a change) on the way back.
But for me train travel will be enjoyable as long as there are trains for me to get.
 

ABDeltic

Member
Joined
3 Oct 2018
Messages
64
Having been an enthusiast for many years in rail, I must say I am losing it with this industry - in terms of patience and interest.

The day to day disruption is quite frankly awful. This will take a while for Rail to recover from, and it is sad to see.

The downward spiral is on, I can only predict severe cuts to May23 TT, with routes being cut particularly where there is duplication.

Is anyone else just thinking of throwing the towel in on rail for the time being? What used to be fun, certainly isn’t anymore. Car for travelling is certainly pushing towards the norm, and that’s from a pro-rail, enthusiast, loyal traveller since I’ve been born.
Yes I agree, I have always loved rail travel, come from a railway family and have been a train planner for over 40 years but there are so many proble.ms with train travel now, delays, cancellations, missed connections etc. The staff are most trying their best but I'm afraid the railway is becoming an irrelevance.
 

Crossover

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Yorkshire
I feel broadly similar - I’m falling somewhat out of love with rail travel for various reasons (despite being only a short journey away from a major railway station)

Afraid to say that taking the car often wins out. Since the start of August, I have only taken a total of 6 trains in total
 

SussexSeagull

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13 Aug 2021
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208
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Worthing
Had dinner outside Kings Cross on Monday and got the 2200 Thameslink from St Pancras to East Croydon before changing for the last train to Durrington which was immediately behind the Thameslink train.

Oddly makes me sad it can't always be like that (or at least almost always like that).
 

syrac

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Exeter
I'm in this boat to be fair. I very rarely use the train nowadays as the bus is so much better and generally far cheaper. Even with a shortage of bus drivers in the UK, it still tends to be more reliable than trains.

For some perhaps! Despite the disruption on the railways, I still find it more reliable than the buses!
 

Irascible

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Dyfneint
One "benefit" of living where I do is that nothing much has changed in decades ( other than fares & seat comfort :p ). I'll probably continue to take the train to pop over to Cornwall & if I really need to go to London, but I'd certainly look at flying up north - not that that is really any different to before anyway, XC has always been far too time consuming - and road options for anywhere east on the s. coast.

Bus travel round here is deteriorating a lot more than the railways.
 

gordonthemoron

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I’m still using LNW, and Thameslink, I’ve largely given up on Avanti, using National Express coaches or driving if absolutely necessary
 

HBP

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Harrogate
I have one advance train journey booked so far for 2023. Unheard of for me and that is for Eurostar. How I will get to STP will have to be decided on the day. All very sad.
 

507020

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23 May 2021
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1,983
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Southport
The day to day disruption is quite frankly awful. This will take a while for Rail to recover from, and it is sad to see.

The downward spiral is on, I can only predict severe cuts to May23 TT, with routes being cut particularly where there is duplication.

Is anyone else just thinking of throwing the towel in on rail for the time being? What used to be fun, certainly isn’t anymore. Car for travelling is certainly pushing towards the norm
While there are certainly no quick fixes available to the railway, perhaps not even for the duration of the current “government” due to industrial relations issues, since the Dec 22 timetable is unusable, owing to an uplift in service on most lines which cannot be resourced leading only to an increase in random cancellations rather than service, reductions in May 23 could actually increase reliability, especially where certain operators run far outside their area (e.g. GWR to Brighton or Southern to Milton Keynes) removing “competition” but not leaving any lines unserved, I like to think of the future of the railway.

I however do not own a car and am not the only person not to, so using public transport (when not walking and cycling) is very much normal for me and as as such I am well aware of how to navigate the precarious situation buses and trains find themselves in and still find the current railway to be quite reliable and customer friendly compared to the buses.
TPE only delayed me 30 mins going out and 0 mins (but I had to run for a change) on the way back.
I'm in this boat to be fair. I very rarely use the train nowadays as the bus is so much better and generally far cheaper. Even with a shortage of bus drivers in the UK, it still tends to be more reliable than trains.
For some perhaps! Despite the disruption on the railways, I still find it more reliable than the buses!
Bus travel round here is deteriorating a lot more than the railways.
Deterioration is the word, but the buses may be deteriorating due to their inability to pick up the slack from a deteriorating train service.

I have been doing a bit of commuting recently, 1 day a week. The last time I used TPE (12 Dec, the only day of the full timetable so far!) they only delayed me by 4 hours 15 minutes, with the first 6 services cancelled, of which I intended to use the 3rd and the 7th being 15 minutes late, but more recently I attempted the same journey using a 5 connecting buses in the morning and while this went without a hitch, on the return using only 2 buses I lost well over 4 and a half hours first with 3 buses arriving displaying the correct number only before leaving refusing to allow any passengers on and then the oldest vehicle in the fleet, a 15 year old single decker arriving to pick up over 100 freezing passengers, leaving most of them behind and then arriving at the bus station 10 minutes after the last connection before an hour and a half gap, with the next bus cancelled and the one after that 40 minutes late, it took me 8 hours. The train takes 1.

I have also been having problems at my local bus stop which I use most days with the driver refusing to stop for me due to unknown roadworks, leaving me with an hour wait in the evening, when I could have easily walked a few feet to the next stop. Today I had to get home for a parcel to be delivered and the buses were all either too late or had their invisibility cloaks activated and I ended up having to get 3 buses doubling back twice in the absence of the correct one. After that I went on the trains and after wading through an increasingly long list of cancellations (one I noticed was due to late arrival of an inbound service, despite only being 4 minutes late…) and standing in the middle of the aisle the whole way amongst hundreds of passengers being crammed into 3 carriages, crush loaded of course, I made it where I was going in a timely fashion and then even came across a Class 197 on the return, complete with empty cans of Strongbow already. Judging by the passenger experience, the railway isn’t finished just yet.
 

mrmartin

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1,292
What I don't quite get is people switching to the car/coach. Long distance car/coach journies are extremely unreliable as well - way way way worse than the railway even now IMO. Often hit 1-2 hour delays for congestion, accidents etc at least down the M6 etc. I cannot see how London to Manchester driving would be any more reliable than getting Avanti even in its current dismal situation.

Google Maps is predicting a 3h40 to 5h30 journey London to Manchester tomorrow departing at 9:30am. For the car to beat the train you'd have to have *7-10* Avanti trains cancelled in a row. Looking at RTT the worst case scenario delay wise would be around an hour based on yesterdays results. In which case you'd have a free journey with delay repay, and be ~0.5-2.5 hours ahead of the car, plus you don't need to be actually driving the whole time.
 

bramling

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20,387
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Hertfordshire / Teesdale
Having been an enthusiast for many years in rail, I must say I am losing it with this industry - in terms of patience and interest.

The day to day disruption is quite frankly awful. This will take a while for Rail to recover from, and it is sad to see.

The downward spiral is on, I can only predict severe cuts to May23 TT, with routes being cut particularly where there is duplication.

Is anyone else just thinking of throwing the towel in on rail for the time being? What used to be fun, certainly isn’t anymore. Car for travelling is certainly pushing towards the norm, and that’s from a pro-rail, enthusiast, loyal traveller since I’ve been born.

Can only agree unfortunately. Unreliable, undependable, most recent designs of trains unappealing to travel in, and since Covid the clientele has become conspicuously more drossy so you seem to have more chance of a Jeremy Kyle style journey.

What is particularly galling is that pretty much all of this can be traced back to the DFT. Can’t help get the feeling that they see the population as mere plebs and everything needs to be debased accordingly.
 

142blue

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30 Jul 2013
Messages
351
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UK
As someone that's been on the railway for over two decades I've given up and am starting a new career next year

Never known anything like this, it's just apologizing day after day, constant grief and anger from people, sorting trips out for families that we are now refunding due to strikes or disruption. My mental health is at a real low point where I dread work.

I was having a chat with someone yesterday and saying would we do a train journey and the answer is no due to the fears of not getting home, cancellations, overcrowding etc. The example I gave was a journey to Halifax to take kids to Eureka but facing gaps in service, short formed trains, can't get on, having to stand etc we decided we would drive it.
 

gordonthemoron

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What I don't quite get is people switching to the car/coach. Long distance car/coach journies are extremely unreliable as well - way way way worse than the railway even now IMO. Often hit 1-2 hour delays for congestion, accidents etc at least down the M6 etc. I cannot see how London to Manchester driving would be any more reliable than getting Avanti even in its current dismal situation.

Google Maps is predicting a 3h40 to 5h30 journey London to Manchester tomorrow departing at 9:30am. For the car to beat the train you'd have to have *7-10* Avanti trains cancelled in a row. Looking at RTT the worst case scenario delay wise would be around an hour based on yesterdays results. In which case you'd have a free journey with delay repay, and be ~0.5-2.5 hours ahead of the car, plus you don't need to be actually driving the whole time.
You quite often cannot book tickets on an Avanti service, as all the reservations have gone
 

Furryanimal

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4 Jun 2018
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177
Location
Cwmbran
I don't like the fact that I have to look up if my trains are running before making a journey and since I get to travel free on the bus have all but abandoned local train travel( although one of my major local bus operators are currently far from reliable).
But in my part of South Wales things are far better than in other parts that I read about daily on here.
But with bus services to Cardiff having recently been restored to pre-Covid levels I have no intention of using the train for anything other than long distance or late night travel.
And I had always put train before bus.
I do have a rugby trip planned to North Wales in February but I'm not booking it until I know the weekend is strike free and then I worry the trains won't run anyway!
It's hardly an incentive to travel!
Now,if First Group would restore the express bus between Cardiff and Swansea......
 

Mitchell Hurd

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28 Oct 2017
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1,760
For me, CrossCountry travel given the shorter Voyagers on the current timetable doesn't look that enjoyable - being restricted to 2 coaches for seat reservations on single sets I don't know why that is.

GWR have given me a reason to come back to rail basically.
 

Megafuss

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5 May 2018
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Spalding
I remember the days when I'd look at the National Rail service disruption page and the only thing you'd read was about a points failure at Basingstoke or animals on the line at Lairg.

Nowadays it a complete disaster zone with so many things a customer need to trawl through to see if they even have a service.
It is, as the OP states, unenjoyable
 

Aaron1

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3 Nov 2019
Messages
175
Location
GRIMSBY
Rail travel is not very user friendly at all and generally in my view treat the passengers as an inconvenience with some staff members making up rules on the spot hoping to catch out unwitting members of the public who perhaps would not know otherwise and that's before I even come on to the delays and cancellations and the total mess that is Avanti and TPE, and also buying an Advance fare and having to travel an hour later as your booked train is cancelled but you aren't allowed delay repay as it was cancelled the night before before 10pm! Constant strikes and disruption, total total mess
 

Seehof

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1 Sep 2019
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Yorkshire
Despite having BR retired free travel facilities I rarely travel by train now. My wife has had some horrendous journeys travelling to see her son using LNER and Thameslink. She hates travelling by train now and her last journey to see her son over 250 miles away was done by car.
Yes, it is very very sad. I know of someone who only yesterday arrived over an hour late for a hospital appointment thanks to TPE.
 

Moonshot

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10 Nov 2013
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3,806
I myself have given up on it, and I get staff discount. Next week is a trip to London for me, which I would normally use Avanti. It's the car now until further notice. The whole shooting match is just so unreliable, and isn't going to get any better.
 

yorksrob

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I still enjoy train travel, however as a regular traveller from the 1980's onwards, it is without a doubt the worst its ever been.
 

Halwynd

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11 Sep 2021
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North West
Apart from the odd local journey of a few minutes, I've given up with the railway. Less comfortable seating than in years gone by, fewer toilets - fewer working toilets - more services that are full and standing (so you can't even reach the toilets!) and the ever-present thought that your train could be cancelled - or terminated en-route and you're shoved onto a bus - I'm sure others have witnessed the chaos at Preston and Carlisle when this happens, and all because the railway won't divert via the S&C.

The uncertainty and unreliability as a result of industrial action is just the final straw. I have always supported rail workers - even as a passenger I refused to cross a picket line when Northern Guards were in dispute a few years ago - but I never thought I'd see the day when a station was closed due to an overtime ban and, for the sake of less than an hour, passengers being under or over-carried, delayed, and then put onto road transport after midnight. Sadly it feels as if the railway has just become more anti-passenger in recent years (just look at how some folk are treated when they make innocent mistakes relating to ticketing) coupled, sadly, with more of a 'couldn't give a damn' attitude.
 
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lachlan

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11 Aug 2019
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1,171
For leisure journeys I usually don't have a choice as I don't drive though the disruption has obviously been frustrating.

I'm still using rail for long distance journeys instead of flying because it's the right thing to do from an environmental perspective but I am feeling a bit messed about - all three times I've tried to use the sleeper the Aberdeen leg has been cancelled, for example. I wouldn't touch Avanti at the moment. Though I made a long distance journey yesterday with GWR and LNER that went very smoothly.

As for commuting I deliberately chose a flat where I can walk to work so I didn't become reliant on rail or bus.
 

modernrail

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The sad thing is, it really doesn’t have to be like this and it wasn’t that long ago. It seems to be part of a culture of blowing up perfectly good public infrastructure that is all the rage with a rage filled generation of leaders.
 

Snow1964

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West Wiltshire
I think a lot depends on where you live, I commuted by train for 30+ years from SW London, used to enjoy occasional long distance trains. But when SWR took over, there was a noticeable drop in passenger friendliness.

Now live about 100 miles west of London, GWR seems to try, even if too many trains short formed or crowded (and old). But I am completely put off travelling longer distances as it involves using the farce known as Cross Country. And if I can drive up M5 why would I take a train via London. Sorry but long distance services in SW England to other parts of the country are now a bad joke.
 
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